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spacecadet
spacecadet GRM+ Memberand Dork
7/9/19 4:29 p.m.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a28339815/miata-subaru-flat-four-engine-swap-kit/?src=socialflowFBRAT

 

A kit to swap a Subaru motor into a Miata... with all the other swap kits.. This was not something I ever expected..

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 4:41 p.m.

Wow, that's pretty darn creative. I've been working on an EJ for the last week and they're weird engines. I wonder what ground clearance looks like? I want to crawl all over one of these.

From the Miata One site - it's for the Phase 1 dual port engine. So that's the original Outback and Impreza RS, right? I have big chunks of one of those scattered all over my garage floor right now...

pres589 (djronnebaum)
pres589 (djronnebaum) PowerDork
7/9/19 4:48 p.m.

What about a kit to mount the EJ and Subi trans behind the seats?  

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 4:51 p.m.

Why not just bolt Miata body panels on a Beetle in that case?

Looks like there's a fair bit of surgery done to the frame rails and the subframe for this. A fairly significant chunk has to get shaved off to make room for the heads.

spacecadet
spacecadet GRM+ Memberand Dork
7/9/19 4:54 p.m.

Yeah I saw mention of the surgery needed. 

Which made me beg the question of the advantages of this swap. 

Price is one compared to a k swap. But the upper limit of the swap seems much lower than a K swap or LS swap of the same $$ amount. I know Subaru motors can be built. But it also gets expensive quick. 

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 5:04 p.m.

There are limitations to what will fit. No Phase 2 heads, no DOHC heads - which makes me wonder about the Phase 1 EJ25 they talk about, because IIRC it's DOHC. That's 165 hp and a nice flat torque curve. The Frankenmotor I just built would probably fit as well, but it's not a sports car mill.

Dusterbd13-michael
Dusterbd13-michael MegaDork
7/9/19 5:05 p.m.

I thought it was nuts to put a fwd 3400v6  converted to rwd in one.

Why is this even a thing? Having owned a few 2.5 subaru engine and cars, this makes no sense to me. At all. 

spacecadet
spacecadet GRM+ Memberand Dork
7/9/19 5:06 p.m.

In reply to Keith Tanner :

Absolutely not, I loved the sound of the exhaust when I was younger.. But the agricultural nature of the engine note is not attractive to me now. 

And seth always referred to his forester as a road tractor. This is obviously a slightly different motor but still applies. 

Toebra
Toebra Dork
7/9/19 5:06 p.m.

This is sort of the answer to a question nobody has asked.

 

Subie motors are not that wierd.  You just did not spend enough of your youth working on air cooled VW motors

 

 

spacecadet
spacecadet GRM+ Memberand Dork
7/9/19 5:10 p.m.
Toebra said:

 

Subie motors are not that wierd.  You just did not spend enough of your youth working on air cooled VW motors

Funny enough the first motor I ever worked on rebuilding was a 1.7 for a 914. 

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 5:10 p.m.
Toebra said:

Subie motors are not that wierd. 

This weekend, I removed and replaced a wristpin on a fully assembled long block by removing one bolt. You can't tell me that's not weird. 

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 5:12 p.m.

Oh my god...

"This swap kit adapts the NA (naturally aspirated) Subaru phase 2 EJ 2.5 motor with phase 1 dual port heads."

That's my frankenmotor. I have the perfect engine sitting on my garage floor right now.

spacecadet
spacecadet GRM+ Memberand Dork
7/9/19 5:20 p.m.

In reply to Keith Tanner :

Haha guess we know what your next shop car is... 

 

​​​

Knurled.
Knurled. GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 5:21 p.m.
Keith Tanner said:

There are limitations to what will fit. No Phase 2 heads, no DOHC heads - which makes me wonder about the Phase 1 EJ25 they talk about, because IIRC it's DOHC. That's 165 hp and a nice flat torque curve. The Frankenmotor I just built would probably fit as well, but it's not a sports car mill.

I wonder if they meant 2.2.

 

An early 2.2 hesded EJ (like what you were asking about elsewhere) supposedly barely fits in an FB RX-7... with an FC subframe to eliminate the steering box, and DOHC is "a no-go".  A Miata is a ton narrower than that.

NickD
NickD PowerDork
7/9/19 5:31 p.m.

This one, like the Ford/Jag V6 swap, is a hard no from me. They make cool sounds, but that's about it. The EJ25 in my Baja makes no low-end power, but, hey, at least it doesn't have any top-end power either. I just don't see the point of it. There are other options that are easier to do and/or make better power, and I don't think that CG is really that big a problem on the Miata.

CyberEric
CyberEric HalfDork
7/9/19 7:03 p.m.

Having driven a number of Subies with the 2.2, I just can't imagine why you would go to the trouble. 

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 7:10 p.m.
Keith Tanner said:

Oh my god...

"This swap kit adapts the NA (naturally aspirated) Subaru phase 2 EJ 2.5 motor with phase 1 dual port heads."

That's my frankenmotor. I have the perfect engine sitting on my garage floor right now.

Fortunately you're the last person who would know where to find a free or cheap Miata, right?

MrJoshua
MrJoshua UltimaDork
7/9/19 7:11 p.m.

I was glad to see it required surgery. I measured this for the "behind the seats" swap years ago and was sure I remembered the Subie engine being something like 33" wide with the miata rails at around 30". IIRC the Subie trans was also a little too tall to fit in the Miata subframe diff space.

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 7:24 p.m.
BoxheadTim said:
Keith Tanner said:

Oh my god...

"This swap kit adapts the NA (naturally aspirated) Subaru phase 2 EJ 2.5 motor with phase 1 dual port heads."

That's my frankenmotor. I have the perfect engine sitting on my garage floor right now.

Fortunately you're the last person who would know where to find a free or cheap Miata, right?

I mean, there's one sitting right beside the engine in question.

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/9/19 7:29 p.m.
Keith Tanner said:
BoxheadTim said:
Keith Tanner said:

Oh my god...

"This swap kit adapts the NA (naturally aspirated) Subaru phase 2 EJ 2.5 motor with phase 1 dual port heads."

That's my frankenmotor. I have the perfect engine sitting on my garage floor right now.

Fortunately you're the last person who would know where to find a free or cheap Miata, right?

I mean, there's one sitting right beside the engine in question.

So when can we expect the build thread?

mainlandboy
mainlandboy Reader
7/9/19 7:33 p.m.
pres589 (djronnebaum) said:

What about a kit to mount the EJ and Subi trans behind the seats?  

If you're willing to go to that much effort, it's probably best to just build a Factory 5 818.

https://www.factoryfive.com/818/

 

Daylan C
Daylan C UberDork
7/9/19 7:35 p.m.
spacecadet said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

And seth always referred to his forester as a road tractor. 

Seth has dealt with weird tractors.

 

Kreb
Kreb GRM+ Memberand UberDork
7/9/19 7:47 p.m.

Now if they just made the EZ36R fit......

kazoospec
kazoospec UltraDork
7/9/19 7:47 p.m.

Having recently looked over a few K swapped cars, I can't imagine why you would even think of this.  A month or so ago, K Miata had a gathering/track day at Gingerman.  The K swaps I saw were clean, compact and faaaaaaast on the track.  Assuming there isn't a HUGE cost savings, this seems like having a 383 stroker and a 305 in the garage, and transplanting in the 305.  

Daylan C
Daylan C UberDork
7/9/19 7:51 p.m.

In reply to kazoospec :

I think GM Ecotec swaps are there if you think the K swap is too expensive. Both make way more sense to me being a larger displacement inline 4 rather than just cramming a square peg EJ into a round Miata hole.

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