More Wartburg progress

Big work day today, earlier in the week I had stripped the floors off the donor VW chassis in preparation for today. So we started with a bare VW chassis and an extreme desire to create weirdness.

We started by cutting the front of the VW chassis off as we were only interested in the rear suspension and center tunnel.

Next we just placed the VW on top of the Wartburg frame to get an idea of where we needed everything. Part of the overall design calls for extending the wheelbase. We already got 2 inched up front with the 944 a-arms, we wanted another 4 inches in the rear so the VW frame was placed locating the wheel centerline 4 inches back from the Wartburg wheel locations

The grinding wheel got quite a workout as we started trimming the frame back to where we needed it. This is one of my many "do as I say, not as I do" moments. Please ignore my total disregard for safety.

In the end our poor Wartburg frame looked like this. It was a bit painful and scary to hack it up, but the ends should justify the means.

The chassis was dry fit in the frame and many measurements taken. Lots of fine tuning with the grinder to get everything nice and snug, but finally we got it where we liked it.

Finally we let the metal burn and the sparks fly and we put it all together. I still have some finish welding to do and reinforcement but it's again at a place where I can work on it solo and prepare it for the next all out team effort. An added note the rear disks are mocked up in the back. 944 brakes really are just a bolt on affair for a VW bug, sweet.

I said "cooooooool" in a Tim Allen-esque voice out loud - no reason I should type anything different than that.

impressive

JThw8 wrote: we started with a bare VW chassis and an extreme desire to create weirdness.

You're certainly headed there.

Nice.

Matt

Bummer I missed today, Having Christmas with my side of the family.

Can't wait to get my hands back on it and make more progress

Sonic wrote: Bummer I missed today, Having Christmas with my side of the family. Can't wait to get my hands back on it and make more progress

You were missed. Still plenty to do. Weekend of 16-17 is the next work weekend. Unless I get money for some of the next parts (steering, pedal assembly) so we can start plumbing we will probably start pulling apart the subie.

JThw8 wrote: ...Weekend of 16-17 is the next work weekend.

Rats! That's my on-call weekend.

I must say now that I have touched the beast I really think we may have something but we have to start breaking down the subie ... still lots (and lots) of work to do!!

littleturquoiseb wrote: still lots (and lots) of work to do!!

why? just because the entire car is disassembled into tiny pieces across my rather messy garage? and because we still have to dissassemble another car into tiny pieces and then put the combination of all the pieces together into something that may or may not run, drive and handle?

Welcome to my anxiety attack.

that looks awesome! i cant wait to see the next installment!

Looks like you're in it up to your eyeballs...good work. Remind me...what is the plan for the powertrain? Also, since you mentioned the 944 brakes, it reminded me that I've read that the Porsche aluminum trailing arms are supposed to be the same as the VW ones. Something to consider swapping out depending on how much 944 stuff you've got laying around.

Bryce

Nashco wrote: Looks like you're in it up to your eyeballs...good work. Remind me...what is the plan for the powertrain? Also, since you mentioned the 944 brakes, it reminded me that I've read that the Porsche aluminum trailing arms are supposed to be the same as the VW ones. Something to consider swapping out depending on how much 944 stuff you've got laying around. Bryce

The 944 trailing arms are indeed the same but dont bring much to the table other than a slight weight decrease. I'd probably use them if I had them but all I have is the front suspension and rear brakes which I traded a used radiator for :) The current powertrain plan is to strap a 2.2L subaru to that VW transaxle. I also have an adapter plate for a Toyota 2TC/3TC if one turns up as a backup plan (the adapter was too cheap to pass up) It wont be a rocketship, but the subie's 135hp is a bit better than the stock 30something of the Wartburg. Its simple, and most importantly reliable. And if we up the power too much more then we start to test the reliability of the VW transaxle. We will also be doing a considerable amout of "adding lightness"

What do you have for adapter parts for the Subie (adapter plate, clutch, flywheel, etc.) so far? I think the 2.2 is a good start...not horribly demanding on the trans and it will be fairly tolerant while you work out the bugs in the cooling system, which will overheat at least once while you work out the kinks. Been there, done that, thank goodness my first custom cooling system was for an iron block, iron head engine!

Interesting trivia for budget builds: Early 901 trans (from 911/912) uses the same CV pattern and almost identical width between the output flanges to a Bug trans. This allows the use of the stock axles with a (supposedly) more robust 4/5 speed. Of course, the stock type 1 axles aren't that tough, but I thought it was worth mentioning...I figured that out through dumb luck. It requires a lot of work to get a shifter to it and make mounts where a type 1 trans used to be, but relative to what you're doing here it's child's play. This is only useful if you find a great deal on a 901 trans, which I've bought a few of for $200 or less.

Bryce

If we were going to upgrade I'd probably just go to a bus transmission, plenty strong and stronger axles to boot. Pretty easy to upgrade the axles on these. Most of the larger porsche or vw bus parts are swappable. Porsche 930 joints are the preferred poison. For budget reasons though we will be sticking with the stock stuff.

We are going to use a Kennedy kit for the adapter plate. I have one already for the Toyota motors that I snagged cheap for $75. Still hoping to find a used subie setup cheap (the EA setups are cheap but not so much for the EJ) but our budget can support a new one if needed. Honestly our only expense right now has been the donor Subaru which will easily be parted out to get it back down to 0. The Porsche bits were traded for a radiator that I paid $70 for, the VW chassis came from one of Andy's hot rod beetles and was given to me in exchange for delivering a Studebaker to him.

We are going to have to cage it for Lemons but Im hoping to keep it within the new rules for GRM so the cage counts as safety.

Nashco wrote: .not horribly demanding on the trans and it will be fairly tolerant while you work out the bugs in the cooling system, which will overheat at least once while you work out the kinks. Been there, done that, thank goodness my first custom cooling system was for an iron block, iron head engine!

At least 2 of us are former owners of X1/9s, Lancia Scorpions and Fiero's so we are well versed in the cooling issues and um..."creative" bleeding techniques :) But thankfully 2.2s are cheap and readily available in case we nuke one during setup. :)

And now my decent into madness has begun

i see fiberglass....

flares? scoops?

PICS!

looks like a trunk.

maroon92 wrote: looks like a trunk.

Indeed, a trunk, to start.....

Since this has to go through Lemons and well "E36 M3 happens" and there is no replacement sheetmetal available for Wartburgs in the US Im taking the time to make most bolt on panels (except the doors) out of fiberglass.

I guess the weight savings is nice too

Figure 1.

Ultimately, the end result of this project will be the World's Fastest Wartburg. No other Wartburg in the world will perform anywhere near as well. What an achievement!

I love this thing. Keep the updates coming. My theory is once you finish the car, you won't want to race at LeMons because you'll have eleventy billion man-hours in the thing. Too many to risk going head to head with some cracker in an '83 T-Bird.

Jerry From LA wrote: My theory is once you finish the car, you won't want to race at LeMons because you'll have eleventy billion man-hours in the thing. Too many to risk going head to head with some cracker in an '83 T-Bird.

Has been my fear all along to be honest. That really is the main reason for the fiberglass panels. I will run it at Lemons, but I will be on edge the whole time.

Luckily I have a good crew of drivers who understand that vehicle preservation is above winning. And I have 3 and a half months to fix anything between Lemons and GRM :)

I would never build something like this for Lemons normally. All along my goal with this car was GRM. But we vowed to attempt the "Trifecta of Crap" in 2010 and this is our car so we press on.

Tetzuoe wrote: Figure 1.

Don't confuse that light streak with a spark. That's actually his laservision ensuring a perfect cut

What if you somehow win the peoples curse?

or will this be some sort of special entrant that is immune?

GlennS wrote: What if you somehow win the peoples curse? or will this be some sort of special entrant that is immune?

Nope, no immunity from the curse. It is exempt from BS judging though.

Just gotta play the game and see what happens with the curse, there are some "non-permanent" destruction methods employed sometimes and if we do get cursed I will petition Jay to utilize those so we can put it back together for GRM.