motorcyclists be careful out there

Rodan said:

OldGray320i said:

We'll do what we choose, of course, but those making the suggestions are empirically correct. 

And about as welcome as those who keep telling us that racing cars is dangerous.  We know.  Thanks.

 You're welcome!

I remember having this conversation with my grandmother shortly after I got my motorcycle endorsement. Yes, its a dangerous activity. Yes, cars are more practical. And safer. And more comfortable. I understand all of these things. And I am making a conscious decision as an adult to do it anyway because I have weighed the potential consequences versus my enjoyment. And yes, I have made plans so that those I leave behind will be taken care of in the event I have to get powerwashed off the pavement.

If she were still alive and came at me NOW with this line of reasoning, I'd tell her that I was somewhat offended that she felt she needed to inform me, as though I wasn't aware of the risks.

I don't think that was the intent behind this thread. I read it as more along the lines of "hey guys, we know you know already, but be alert out there cause bad E36 M3 happens at a higher rate when you're complacent". Along the same lines as "as the weather warms up and we start working under cars again, don't forget to use your chock blocks and jack stands properly".

We've already lost too many board members this year. Be safe. Have fun.

I’ve been riding dirt for 34 years and street legally for 28,  since it’s legal in TN to get your MC license at 14.   For a decade I commuted on my bike year around,  with a truck for weather and a sports car for weekend fun.  I’ve hit the pavement four times in all of those years,  all of those happening within my first decade of riding,  however I’ve had more close calls over the years than I can count.  

I’m similar to Nick,  not sure what it would take to get me off my bike.  I’m aware of the risks,  but pay very little attention to any statistics as I feel so much of a riders safety is up to them.  Not all of it of course.

This is my front yard and happened last Friday evening.  I was on my front porch at the time and saw the entire thing.  Totally the riders fault.  I actually hope he decides to stop riding after this one.

If I am to die on a motorcycle , I will have been 100% more alive than most people ever dream.

Nick Comstock said:

In reply to dculberson :

Believe me I'm not justifying it to anyone. I don't care about percentages. My statement is not inaccurate. I don't give a rats ass about statistics, per mile driven whatever. Being a road user, no matter the mode of transportation, is more likely to kill a person than anything else (not health related). Don't kid yourself that the very thin steel cage you're riding in is in any way safe.

Nice. OK. Obviously you're more worried about feelings than facts, so I'll bow out.

@Appleseed: I say this as a rider, well, former rider - you could rephrase your post to be about Russian Roulette and it would be just as true. I don't think being "more alive" depends on you doing some specific activity. It has to do with enjoying what you do and relishing it and the life you live. Riding a bike doesn't suddenly make you some amazing creature that is only now fully experiencing life while all others live some dampened version of life. It makes you the same person you were before, enjoying another hobby. Don't glorify a specific activity just because it's something you enjoy. I like eating chocolate and masturbating but I'm not some god for engaging in it.

Appleseed said:

If I am to die on a motorcycle , I will have been 100% more alive than most people ever dream.

I don't mean to be an ass, but that's the sort of thing I used to say when I was 18 years old.

I can't speak for the Harley rider, but I was taught to ride the stripped pavement area like you would a steel cat walk material type bridge; slowly move from one side of the lane to the other, straight lines get you hooked into a slot.

Not to pile on another horrible story, but a friend of mine, a long time rider, touched a floorboard at speed in a corner and took a guard rail to the thighs.  VERY green-blue bruising but he's OK and not broken.  I explained sliding your butt to the inside of the turn keeping the bike upright while fighting the Gs.  He argued.  I pointed out the sport bike road racers, watch them.

He doesn't get it.  Won't.  Shame.

I know from riding I4 a few times that grooved pavement is butt puckering. The construction creates uncertainty in drivers and then a groove grabs your tires... I stopped riding I4 before it killed me. 

Road construction is fine for cage drivers but they seldom clean up enough for bikes. 

Kreb said:

Appleseed said:

If I am to die on a motorcycle , I will have been 100% more alive than most people ever dream.

I don't mean to be an ass, but that's the sort of thing I used to say when I was 18 years old.

How old were you when you gave up *edit*riding?

In the end, there is only one person I have to justify my actions to. 

Appleseed said:

Kreb said:

Appleseed said:

If I am to die on a motorcycle , I will have been 100% more alive than most people ever dream.

I don't mean to be an ass, but that's the sort of thing I used to say when I was 18 years old.

How old were you when you gave up?

In the end, there is only one person I have to justify my actions to. 

I tend to have a similar feeling when people question me riding a bicycle on the road.  If plastered on the grill of a texting SUV driver is how I go, at least I'll go doing what I love to do. I'm OK with that. 

Everybody dies. It's just a matter of when. 

Appleseed said:

How old were you when you gave up?

 

Don't be a dick.

In reply to dculberson :

I'm not. I'm the same guy at a funeral as I am at a wedding. What I need to do is edit that. I ment to ask when Kreb gave up riding?

My retort to you is that on a motorcycle, I have felt and experienced things that those who do not ride can never have. I see things in ways non-riders do not. Doesn't make me better than anyone. Doesn't make me a god. It makes me different. 

And no, I'm not the same person I was before I started riding. It's impossible to take back experiences. How much those experiences change you is up to you. As for myself, they have. And I wouldn't trade them. 

I get defensive every time these things come up because people try so hard to convince me I'm wrong about riding. 

In reply to Appleseed :

I could make your same post with the words "sailing", "flying", and "doin' shrooms" instead of riding. Yes, motorcycles are different, and yes, they are fun. They aren't some transcendent, better-than-though experience

My retort to you is that on a sailboat, I have felt and experienced things that those who do not sail can never have. I see things in ways non-sailors do not. Doesn't make me better than anyone. Doesn't make me a god. It makes me different. 

And no, I'm not the same person I was before I started sailing. It's impossible to take back experiences. How much those experiences change you is up to you. As for myself, they have. And I wouldn't trade them. 

I get defensive every time these things come up because people try so hard to convince me I'm wrong about sailng. 

See?

To some, they are a trancendant experience.  Why do people try to convince us that is not?

This is so far removed from D2W's intent. 

This thread sucks. I'm going for a ride.

In reply to Appleseed :

I really don't think anyone was trying to convince you/us that we are wrong. At least not the original premiss.

The problem is I made a statement that was technically incorrect while still being accurate. The pedants couldn't handle that and had to throw in irrelevant statistics and numbers. We've all weighed the risks and made our choices. I damn sure don't have to justify that choice to anyone. I'm not trying to convince anyone else I'm right or trying to prove they are wrong. Just providing my perspective. Which is why I said I'm not sure what it would take to get me to stop riding. Maybe one day something will happen that makes me quit. Maybe it won't. 

As for the god of chocolate and masturbation, he's the only one being a dick in this thread.

This thread got crazy fast. I read it when it was first posted and it made me remember many years(over a decade) ago when the only vehicle I owned was a motorcycle. Mostly fond memories but I do remember sucking at life riding my sportster through a Pa winter. I don’t recommend that part. 

In reply to Appleseed :

Sorry, prior to your edit I misread it as if you were trying to say he’d given up on life and not just riding. My bad for assuming the worst. The contentious tone in this thread made me go to the bad place sorry. 

And nick, if you think I was being a dick, well that’s your right but you clearly haven’t seen me being a dick then. I’m pretty good at it. 

I agree. Totally off the rails. Probably reading things that were never said. Not sure what happened. For what it's worth,  crapping on someone for what they think is no better than viciously defending my opinion. 

I apologize for throwing switches on the train wreck.  

dculberson said:

And nick, if you think I was being a dick, well that’s your right but you clearly haven’t seen me being a dick then. I’m pretty good at it. 

I'm well aware.

I used to ride a bit.  I'd run motocross naked before I'd ride a bike in the city these days.  Cagers be stupid.

Theres an awful lot of Harleys bought by old guys that always wanted one.  They ride slow, which works fine until they really need to countersteer and drag the floor boards to avoid that oncoming bus on the corner they misjudged.

Everyone that buys a motorcycle should take a race school.  Lots of people die from giving up, because 95% of the people on them have no idea at all how far their bike will actually lean.

In reply to Nick Comstock :

Might be time for some chill pills dude. Maybe you had a bad day. Go for a ride you should still be glowing from getting that bike fixed. Hope you have a better day. 

In reply to dculberson :

Go back and read the thread. You're the one that brought the "contentious tone" to this thread. 

I'd disagree with the notion that 'cages' are as dangerous to be in as riding a bike. Being in the insurance/car damage business as I am I see a LOT of wrecked vehicles. I see very few fatalities compared to 20 years ago. That is all because of car design and has zero to do with the increasingly horrible drivers.

When I ride I do so with the understanding that things could go very wrong. I do my best to minimize the risk by wearing all of the protective gear I can zip and velcro on. Having ridden ATGATT for so many years now even riding without a jacket on a hot day makes me so nervous I just can't ride.

Motorcycling (and I suppose bicycling--which I don't understand since there isn't an engine involved) is a very different experience than car travel. Some 'get it' and some just view it as travel without a roof and doors, like in a Jeep. There is a bit of 'zen' to riding and I find it clears the head and removes stress. It isn't for everyone, just like everything else in life. I'd be loathe to give it up. I mostly ride on the weekends, in the country and usually Sunday mornings when there is little traffic. This helps my chances of not having an incident. And I ride slower bikes that won't encourage hooliganism. I'm far more mature on a bike than I am in my BMW M3.