ND on a Dyno

In exchange for some free parts, my ex is letting a local tuner shop use her car to develop parts (CAI and Cat-back, I think). They posted a base-line dyno run:

http://engineering.mishimoto.com/2015/10/mishimoto-dyno-tests-a-2016-nd-miata/

Torquey

Hey I work there. Hey that's the blog I work on. Hehe. Please extend our appreciation for the vehicle use.

We are working on an intake and catch can system to start. Should be interesting.

I know the ND is the "spiritual successor" and "all about balance" and all that, but I have an NA and while it's fine. It desperately wants 50% more hp. Not 10 more.

KyAllroad wrote: I know the ND is the "spiritual successor" and "all about balance" and all that, but I have an NA and while it's fine. It desperately wants 50% more hp. Not 10 more.

It's about how that power is delivered, hence the wide torque curve.

Also to fix the lack of power in your NA:

https://www.flyinmiata.com/fm-ii-turbo-system-na6-chassis.html

KyAllroad wrote: I know the ND is the "spiritual successor" and "all about balance" and all that, but I have an NA and while it's fine. It desperately wants 50% more hp. Not 10 more.

The ND has something like 22hp and 40 ft/lbs over your NA. It'd be like having a M45 supercharger.

In reply to KyAllroad:

How much power would you have to add to your NA, from stock, to get down to a 14.5 second 1/4 mile? Regardless of peak numbers on a spec sheet, that's the real world power difference between the two.

I'm trying to understand the low power output. The torque curve is beautiful, but doesn't this thing have 11:1 compression? I just feel that a 2.0L with that compression should make a lot more horsepower.

AntiArrhythmic wrote: I'm trying to understand the low power output. The torque curve is beautiful, but doesn't this thing have 11:1 compression? I just feel that a 2.0L with that compression should make a lot more horsepower.

13:1, but it appears to be tuned for low end. Nobody in the USA gives a E36 M3 if it makes power up high if it is perceived as being "gutless" (like the FR-S). The average person will drive this, feel the torque below 4000 or so (they're scared to redline it! ) and think "wow this is more powerful than I expected! "

Enthusiasts love bolt-ons and there should be some easy power to find, perhaps in the ECU tune.

I hope it's easy to tune. 77.5hp/liter doesn't sound like a sports car engine these days.

Keep in mind that is rear wheel #'s, It has already had it's driveline loss.

142 lb-ft and 128 whp for those who didn't watch the video.

It'll be ok, everyone. Big gains are being seen with a tune, and we can always opt to focus on how the car performs, and not numbers on paper in the meantime.

Tell me again whats the deal with the Skyactiv engine? Just high compression? Any fancy cam stuff?

mr2peak wrote: I hope it's easy to tune. 77.5hp/liter doesn't sound like a sports car engine these days.

It's a pretty good possibility that Mazda understands how their customer uses this car- to the point where peak power (which is unlikely to be used that often) can be sacrificed for a broad usable power band (used all the time).

And that when a stopwatch is used, this car ends up faster than a car with a better power/weight ratio.

Sometimes, you guys fall too easily into the numbers battle that marketing guys bait you with.

She finds the car to feel more "peppy" than her 2003 MCS which has a few minor bolt-on mods (15% pulley, intake and JCW cat-back), despite the fact the MINI has more power. The MINI is probably ultimately faster, but you have to rev it out to make it happen.

When I drove the car a couple of weeks ago, it definitely surprised me.

RossD wrote: Tell me again whats the deal with the Skyactiv engine? Just high compression? Any fancy cam stuff?

It's marketing speak for "Let's add lightness."

alfadriver wrote:

mr2peak wrote: I hope it's easy to tune. 77.5hp/liter doesn't sound like a sports car engine these days.

It's a pretty good possibility that Mazda understands how their customer uses this car- to the point where peak power (which is unlikely to be used that often) can be sacrificed for a broad usable power band (used all the time). And that when a stopwatch is used, this car ends up faster than a car with a better power/weight ratio. Sometimes, you guys fall too easily into the numbers battle that marketing guys bait you with.

Mid 6s second 0-60 and mid 14s 1/4 mile is not slow. I am impressed. Wasn't an NA closer to 9s 0-60 and 16-17s 1/4 mile? Incredible difference.

Guuuyyyyssss, why doesn't it have 200whp?! So disappointed...

I think it is a gift. It is light enough, and appears to be, tight enough to handle like, well, a Miata and it has a great foundation for an engine.

Worse comes to worse, swap it for a EcoBoost 2.0. There seems to be enough room under the hood.

Same(ish) performance as the Fiesta ST 1.6t that everybody loves. Pretty amazing if you ask me: what did a stock 5.0 fox body run again? Remember when they were fast?

tuna55 wrote:

alfadriver wrote:

mr2peak wrote: I hope it's easy to tune. 77.5hp/liter doesn't sound like a sports car engine these days.

It's a pretty good possibility that Mazda understands how their customer uses this car- to the point where peak power (which is unlikely to be used that often) can be sacrificed for a broad usable power band (used all the time). And that when a stopwatch is used, this car ends up faster than a car with a better power/weight ratio. Sometimes, you guys fall too easily into the numbers battle that marketing guys bait you with.

Mid 6s second 0-60 and mid 14s 1/4 mile is not slow. I am impressed. Wasn't an NA closer to 9s 0-60 and 16-17s 1/4 mile? Incredible difference.

RossD wrote: 142 lb-ft and 128 whp for those who didn't watch the video.

Thanks Ross. Keep in mind there is some driveline loss with the Dynapack. We also have a Dynojet, which makes for a slightly more exciting event due to the rollers. That being said, the DynaPack is a nice tool and makes the process much quicker due to its mobility.

If anyone would like any specific images of certain components, please shoot me a PM and I will snap a shot.

-John

Wait, a stock ND is a mid 6 second 0-60 car and all I hear is that it is underpowered? That is marvelous. I think my 2005 Mazdaspeed Miata has something about the same 0-60 and I don't complain about lack of power. I only complain about the low redline and the gearing.

Brian Goodwin's been working on a couple over on his mazdatalk forum, posting dyno numbers with various combinations of parts and tuning.

All I can say is after driving one it doesn't feel underpowered... of course, compared to the vehicles I own, most cars don't feel underpowered...