New Driver's What Car Thread

I have a friend who's son is getting his first car soon and has $3,000 to $4,000 (obviously close to $3k is better).

I want to send his mom this threads' link because when she asked me I told her I knew just who to ask!

Probably auto, reliable, 2 or 4 doors. Small suv perhaps? Safe. (I have a secret love affair with Jeep ZJ and XJ's not sure if he does)

Anyone have experience with new drivers (kids) and first cars?

Get them a Subaru, they are built like tanks, tend to take a hit really well.

A manual will make them a better driver in the long run. Rip out the radio and tell him he can have it back in a year if there are no accidents. I'm serious about that, the best thing my parents did for me was get me a car with a broken radio. The single biggest reason kids get in accidents is distractions, and the single biggest reason for distractions, initially, is the damn radio.
The manual transmission works in the opposite direction. With an auto it's very easy to function on auto pilot when approaching and leaving intersections. With a manual those actions are more deliberate and focus you as a driver. Other than that, budget for brakes and tires, the two biggest safety items on the car. For the price range, I'd be looking at first gen focus sedans. They almost all came with the SOHC engine and were slow. They're safe. Easy to work on, parts are cheap, and they're chronically uncool. Perfect.

For this situation my favorite answer is Oldsmobile Alero.
Yes, a car that most people have forgotten about. Since the demise of Olds, they have dropped in price. The 4 doors still sell well (and I suspect that they are bought by single mothers) but the 2 doors are completely slow sellers. I figure that this is because the 2 doors are not seen as sporty enough by the young crowd. Honestly, I think they look better than their Pontiac Grand Am mate.

Here is a 2004 2 door (pretty damn new and having the safety stuff like abs, etc) with 74k miles (darn low) for an asking price of $4,500. I would be that could be bought for just under $4.
http://boston.craigslist.org/nwb/cto/2984304878.html
It took me a nano-second to find this one.

For a kid-car, do not get hung up on mpg. Great mpg cars are holding such a premium right now and a kid will typically not drive enough miles per year to reap the benefit. Besides, as a parent, you are discouraging them to travel too far.

Biggest piece of advice:
Before buying anything, find how much it will cost to insure. Kid-insurance is expensive and you would be surprised how sweepingly different the costs can be with different vehicles.
This is as easy as calling you agent and saying, "we are thinking of buying a (Make, Model, Year), how much would that be to insure?" Most likely you will get an answer while you wait on the phone but at most you will get a call back at the end of the day.

mazdeuce wrote: A manual will make them a better driver in the long run. Rip out the radio and tell him he can have it back in a year if there are no accidents. I'm serious about that, the best thing my parents did for me was get me a car with a broken radio. The single biggest reason kids get in accidents is distractions, and the single biggest reason for distractions, initially, is the damn radio. The manual transmission works in the opposite direction. With an auto it's very easy to function on auto pilot when approaching and leaving intersections. With a manual those actions are more deliberate and focus you as a driver. Other than that, budget for brakes and tires, the two biggest safety items on the car. For the price range, I'd be looking at first gen focus sedans. They almost all came with the SOHC engine and were slow. They're safe. Easy to work on, parts are cheap, and they're chronically uncool. Perfect.

This, with the additional advice that it be a car incapable of seating more than five. My first car was a Taurus wagon, bench seats front and back plus the way-back = eight screaming teenagers in one car

mazdeuce has clearly put some thought into this...

If you don't have to worry about winters, I'd give a Miata a serious look. No . . . really. Here's why: Almost all of them are manuals, but very easy to drive manuals. They have no usable cup holders and crappy radios. Only two seats = a MAXIMUM of one stupid friend. All this minimizes the major killer of new drivers, distraction. They are very forgiving cars to drive and incredibly easy to recover if they get slightly out of shape. They are fun and engaging to drive, but not fast. Of course, they are terrible in the snow so, if winter driving is an issue, clearly not ideal.

The conventional wisdom is to try to put as much sheet metal as possible around teen drivers. The problem is big sheet metal is accompanied by big interiors which can be filled with cell phones, chargers, radios, stupid friends, cheese burgers, big gulps, dangly orniments, and a 1000 other distractions. Really, big cars with lots of "safety features" provide parents with a false sense of security. Many also have tricky handling characteristics (especially SUV's). I've been in law enforcement for 20+ years and most of the teen driving fatalities I've seen are not from teens dying in survivable accidents. They are high speed crashes into immovable objects (trees, light poles, guardrails, etc.) and high speed rollovers, where no amount of steel or air bags are going to save the driver. The two main causes are distraction and drinking. Drinking is, of course, its own problem regardless of the type of car they have. Eliminate distraction to the amount possible = the best teen drivers car in my opinion. Hence, the standard GRM answer: Miata.

For MY son, manual without a doubt. And the no radio idea is a really sensible one. The hang up is that he is not my son. I can't think of anyone that will be able to teach him to shift a manual (even though I couldn't drive one but bought one anyway and got it home). I had the luxury of living in wide-open country with half-deserted roads to learn on. He lives in a very congested urban area.

Does anyone think a Mazda/Toyota/S10/Ranger 4 cyl pick up is a good idea? That's a three-seater at best.

Winter? All depends on winter. I wouldn't put a youngster in a mini truck if there was even the faintest hint of snow, or even heavy frost. You (well, not you, but his mom) need to be able to trust that he won't put people in the back or try to do truck things with it. Speaking from experience, it's amazing what shenanigans kids will get themselves into because it's a truck instead of a car.

mazdeuce wrote: Winter? All depends on winter. I wouldn't put a youngster in a mini truck if there was even the faintest hint of snow, or even heavy frost. You (well, not you, but his mom) need to be able to trust that he won't put people in the back or try to do truck things with it. Speaking from experience, it's amazing what shenanigans kids will get themselves into because it's a truck instead of a car.

I had a Ranger 5spd as a kid and I was a great winter driver... But I made myself PRACTICE every chance I got. I used to practice on frozen ponds each weekend and snowy parking lots. That made a big difference.

But you're so right on, shenanigans is a great word. Actually jumped my truck at a railroad crossing, loaded it with friends (not while jumping) and had it go up on two wheels on one occasion. Maybe a Focus sedan or Pontiac grandma's car is a better idea!

I am going to play devils advocate here. You can get in trouble and be unsafe in any car. I would focus on letting the kid get a car if they are mature/responsible enough. I learned how to drive in a 1979 Chevy Malibu with 103 hp. It was big, slow and the radio didnt work. That car saw more air-time than a jumbo jet. In high school I had a V8 Firebird and sure I drove fast and took stupid teenage risks, but the car was kinda built to be abused. (more so than a camry) There were guys who's parents bought them "safe" cars that they wrecked and died/got seriously hurt because they pushed cars that shouldnt be driven hard.

But most importantly, it depends on the kid.

Agreed. If I know anything about him it's that he's responsible. Sure that doesn't preclude him from fooling around but I'd be less worried about him than anyone his age that I know.

Ford Taurus with the rear seat removed. Boring, won't get chicks, no seat means no passengers, relatively safe, slow, cheap.

That being said, I don't really believe there's a "right" first car. There are several wrongs (anything named Evo, STi or Mazdaspeed, anything bigger than said Taurus, or anything with 4wd) but it ultimately comes down to driver training. What's been said about safety devices in cars being a distraction is pretty much true. I am a firm believer that people are entirely too reliant on auto manufacturers keeping them safe, and don't take the time to teach their offspring the proper way to drive and be safe.

A "kid's car" can be a tough choice. Buy something halfway sporty, and they think they are a world class driver and take all sorts of risks. Buy something fit for a suburban housewife and they drive it like it was stolen...there can sometimes be no winning with your choice.

For the sake of the parent(s), start the list with something insurable and reliable, that has room for as few passengers as possible. So start off the list with no trucks, minivans or wagons. The broken radio idea sounds pretty good, just hope the kid doesn't substitute some kind of portable music source instead.

My nieces and nephews (with different parents) started out with: a Pontiac Sunfire, a Honda Accord, and a Nissan Altima. For around $4K you are almost into cars with ABS. If you want a big car with a lot of metal for crush absorbing...go with a Taurus or Sable sedan. An '02 or newer model has ABS.

I have a secret love affair with Jeep ZJ and XJ's not sure if he does

DO NOT give a new driver a cherokee for their first car. They do NOT respond well to hamfisted maneuvering and they're VERY touchy on slick surfaces.

Ive had 4. Not a good car for a first-timer. Not because they're too exciting, but because they are too unforgiving of panic maneuvers and slick surfaces.

and there's NO WAY IN HELL i would pay $4k for an alero

Anything other than my first car!! 351W powered 1985 mustang GT.

Seriously though. Think of it this way, it's probably going to be disposable. So try to get the best disposable car you can.

A good run forever car is a 1995-1999 maxima or accord 4 cylinder.

Ex police car crown vic interceptor (shoot for 2006+ but doesn't matter too much)

They are dirt cheap to fix, tons of parts everywhere, pretty decent MPG (on par or better than the Jeeps), lots of back seat and trunk for moving out, MOTORS RUN 450K miles+( I can take pictures of a few if needed in a few days). Haul butt in winter with snow tires, can jump curbs and train tracks with little or no damage

And all that extra car means they are very safe in crashes, compared to compact death traps.

Del Sol with stick and the single cam?

Vigo wrote:

I have a secret love affair with Jeep ZJ and XJ's not sure if he does

DO NOT give a new driver a cherokee for their first car. They do NOT respond well to hamfisted maneuvering and they're VERY touchy on slick surfaces. Ive had 4. Not a good car for a first-timer. Not because they're too exciting, but because they are too unforgiving of panic maneuvers and slick surfaces.

Seriously this^^^^

Any random pile midsize will do. It's a first car, so base your options on easy to learn on and able to take a beating.

Nothing with sporty characteristics, no coupes, and no trucks unless his mother doesn't mind paying out the ass for insurance.

Grab the cheapest wallowy E36 M3pile you can find, old base model stratii and gran pricks and taruii. Old fleet vehicles and rentals, because that car is going to get the piss beaten out of it and needs to be cheap to fix and easy to maintain. Better yet, take him to pick his crap box, explain why he should have one and let him pick one he likes being in.

Small and slow doesn't work, because I distinctly remember a buddy and I trying to get his E36 M3ty old Topaz to do a burnout when I was younger.

E: Nothing with a V8. V8 = powerful to teens, even if it's a 140 hp V8. Street racing an 86 305 powered Pontiac against a 89 V6 Dakota also happened when I was younger.

In reply to Grizz:

If the kids gonna race the and do dumb stuff they will do it in whatever car they've got...happened when I was younger Might as well cover the rest of the bases

E30 325i or 318is and don't look back... When we were looking for a first car for my 17 year old last year, we wanted a sub- 3K vehicle, preferably a 5 Sp, and 4 door. This would be a car that I can use in the event that I didn't want to put miles on the MCoupe.

We looked at Corolla's, etc, and as luck had it, we came across a 1990 E30 325i, 5sp on the list. Asking 1500.00 and needed work. We went to look at it immediately. It was in pretty bad shape in the interior, but the body was in good condition. We had a great canvas. We got it for 900.00 bucks.

A year later, 2K in parts, 40 hours later, and we have a great little daily driver/Track rat!

The first thing I did after we got the car on the road was get his signed up for Street Survival. He's not driving it until his grades come back up next year, and I drive it as my DD..

Good Luck!

Based on the idiot I was at 16 with a 1980 malibu wagon with the 125 bhp v8 and crappy kraco radio that I had to stick a pen under the cassette to get it to play I have to say get a solid reliable stereo system thats easy to operate because if not your teen will find some way to rig up tunes in the car that WILL distract them from driving. and they will speed. Miata is my answer and my 12 year old already knows it. She also knows she will attend street survival school and several autocrosses during her 16th year of life. Safety begins between the ears. They listen, but they do try to hide that fact. Also winter tires make all the difference in snow. My dads answer was I was not allowed to drive with snow on the ground. which is fine, but instead Ill have winter tires and wheels for the miata just like all my other vehicles

My first was an 83 RX-7, with the 12a and manual. Even with new tires, it was not afraid to slide around a little in the wet, but I drove far more conservatively when I was less sure.

The Samurai was my third, and it had some good properties. Mine was a late model with fuel injection, 2wd, and no rear seat. Never available with a manual. No cup holders. Mine was born without air conditioning or a radio. With fresh tires, in the wet, it would not spin the tires or slide. It came with an okay top, and $30 bought a bikini top. The tires are made for trucks that actually weigh something, so they were still fresh 30k miles after I put them on the truck. I'd get exactly the 28 MPG EPA estimate, no matter how I treated it. I drove it through a couple of muddy situations that shouldn't have worked out. It was also the simplest and easiest vehicle to work on. Everything was easy to get to, all of the parts were light, and there were no crazy electronic dohickeys. A big downside is it'd probably fold into an origami bird if you tap the bumper with your knee. The Suzuki Sidekick, Geo\Chevy Tracker and Suzuki X90 are all mechanically similar. Later models of those had airbags and such. The X90 is odd, but kinda cool, has a real roof and a real trunk.

ebonyandivory wrote: For MY son, manual without a doubt. And the no radio idea is a really sensible one. The hang up is that he is not my son. I can't think of anyone that will be able to teach him to shift a manual (even though I couldn't drive one but bought one anyway and got it home). I had the luxury of living in wide-open country with half-deserted roads to learn on. He lives in a very congested urban area. Does anyone think a Mazda/Toyota/S10/Ranger 4 cyl pick up is a good idea? That's a three-seater at best.

Find a parking lot and set him loose. I learned to drive in a manual and it only took about 30 minutes before I was comfortable with it. It definitely makes you more aware of what the car is doing. It also leads to hooning around, especially with a $400 92 Corolla with working e-brake .