"Outclassed" - Why having the "best" car is so important in autocross

My 83 is the oldest car of the event more than half of the time! I think I want to build it in the wrong class because I do enjoy it on the street so much and I like having the only one of that car there. If I can be even a little more competitive overall than I am now I would be extremely happy. It seems like the fast guys are always in the 59's and I'm always floating around 60-61. If I could have lopped 2 seconds off of all of my times this season I would have always finished in the top half of the field overall. I think that would be an excellent goal.

Considering my car is riding on 238,000 miles springs and bushings...

I love my "Knife at an artillery match" Swift. With time, I hope to achieve a "Gun at an artillery match" status with it.... and then move it to ITB where she wants to be.

P71 wrote: My 83 is the oldest car of the event more than half of the time! I think I want to build it in the wrong class because I do enjoy it on the street so much and I like having the only one of that car there. If I can be even a *little* more competitive overall than I am now I would be extremely happy. It seems like the fast guys are always in the 59's and I'm always floating around 60-61. If I could have lopped 2 seconds off of all of my times this season I would have always finished in the top half of the field overall. I think that would be an excellent goal. Considering my car is riding on 238,000 miles springs and bushings...

you need to hang out with a better group.

my '73 isn't the oldest car in our group by 6 years. One of our members still runs his '67 GTA Jr. Against modern Civics and Neons in our version of STS. Of course, his GTA is worth almost the rest of his class combined. No, for sure it is.....

E

Yes, My '73 MGB/GT is a lot older than most of my competition but she holds her own in class though the classification is idiosyncratic.

With the PCA I get blown out of the water on car age, but our SCCA Region is very much about the "latest and greatest".

It took me a few years to realize I needed to just go have fun. Forget about the class. We don't use SCCA rules locally, so it's a bit easier to not get caught up picking the "perfect" car.

I think I would enjoy running R compound tires at events, the problem is I just don't want to trailer my car to an event, and I don't want to change tires before and after an event. They are damn expensive too.

I go and compete against folks that are truly friends. We watch each other and critique others runs to help each other go faster. There are few that tend to run similar times, and compete against each other for the bragging rights and nothing else. I do get a "little" more serious when there is a beer on the line.

I think it can be fun either way. I have a few miatas. Here in Canada, they could be considered the right cars for their classes. (We have different rules) and I have a lot of fun trying to win my class. I drove one to SCCA Nationals a few weeks ago and got my butt kicked in CSP (3rd DFL). We were running on Toyos and there was no way we were going to be competitive. I still had a great time. Both are fun.

It's awfully hard to stay ahead of the curve on having the "it" car for a given class. That's also a moving target; two (maybe three?) years ago, the 2nd gen MR2 was the "it" car for ES, but after somebody won with a 94R Miata, all of the sudden people think they can't win without one.

Having the car du'jour is overated. Just like you tell newbies, it's 80% driver, 20% car. You can always improve your driving, and in turn improve your results. In the end it comes down to execution. Mark Daddio could probably post better times than me with a tricycle. (although I'm gaining... )

we have a guy who runs Street Mod in a '67 Cuda. with manual steering. it's a sweet machine.

some people care about not being limited by the car (and are good enough that it matters). others don't. to each his own...either position is perfectly valid.

Sometimes if you stick with it long enough, the class will come to you. I've been running in the G Stock spec-Mini class for 6 years now, but they're getting bumped up to D Stock for 2010. The Spec V could be the car to have now, who knows.

The way the Solo rules are written, having "the" car will always be an issue... You can certainly have fun and maybe even win once in awhile with an "outside" car, but unless they start adding weight to certain models and having weight and class checking at tech for each event (both unrealistic), it just is what it is.

I've run three different cars this year (my first). A '78 Spit 6 in SSM, an '03 TDI wagon in HS and an '07 MINI Cooper 'vert in HS. I've always had fun (although the Spit was a trying experience), but my best times in class were with the MINI (and I'm not running R-comps... yet).

We have enough national-caliber drivers in our region to be able to gauge my progress against their times. If I get to a point where I feel like the car is really holding me back, then maybe I'll worry about having the "it" car... Somehow, I doubt that will happen for some time... if ever... I spent enough time losing at DH racing to ever worry much about winning in auto-x.

One nice thing about running in stock classes is the limited mods can actually be a relief if you're on a limited budget: "Nope... can't do that mod as it would put me in a bad PAX." To this end, I plan to put some Koni Yellow's on the MINI in addition to the r-comps, but that's about it.

Then I either start saving up for a F500/F-Mod car... and/or I build my old Volvo into a SM car...

My opinion is that you either buy a car to win with or you buy a car because you like it and get mixed results.

http://mrcmfg.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=135

Here is a good start to your suspension redo. I have the same setup with Tockico Illuminas. Kenetsu on this forum and rx7club.com also has the coilovers and is very happy with the Illuminas. Good product at good prices.

I am planning on switching over to some Konis when I do the Rack and Pinion setup if the budget allows.

A wise man once said to me that he built cars to be as fast as that chassis could be, and he let it fall into whatever class it wound up in. He never built a car to a class rules, only to be as fast as possible. In the modified classes, it doesn't really matter what you start with anyway.

Considering the car, I learned how to go fast in, was an '80 RX-7. Then spent a lot of time trying to make various british roadsters 3/4s as good, and having a '65 Mustang fastback convert rubber to mastercard bills. I think YOUR A LUCKY BASTARD...enjoy A class for old slow stuff...Vintage Stock

I started autocrossing with my 97 cobra in 2004.. A mustang in STX.. it would sound good until you consider the weight and limited to 8 inch wide street tires. Had a few good fights with people and didnt pay too much attention to the overall.

I changed to ESP (tires and many other things) and am having a ball with the speed, but also being (somewhat) competitive. Its the same fun of competing with a random target friend, but easier to have an overall picture and your competing with more similar cars which makes it less course dependant in regards to advantages.

even if your not competitive its still a E36 M3-ton of fun. Being competitive is just fun in a few different ways.

making a car competitive can sure be expensive though! (ESP tire bill STINKS)

I'm afraid of putting $1200 worth of tires that will only last me a half season on a car I traded a 302 for which has less than $200x in it...

Hence me sticking to ST classes and Azenis!

alfadriver wrote: Since I run a 36 year old Alfa in DSP or our equivallent of SM, I totally relate. Eric

As I do with my 1960 TR3. Pick off some folks you have no right to beat and rejoyce in it!

Jack

I'm running SM with 92hp in a sedan.

It's all for fun!

I found out a long time ago, I am a competative soul. Last year was my first season back autocrossing in many years. The car was a nice Integra with some serious mods for ST, not THE car to have for the class, but I loved the power and the looks. Strugling all year to win my class and to even place in the top 20 on the index, I was very frustrated that my driving was not good enough. I had the chance to drive a car that is prepared to "Nationals" standards and almost won the Index! The problem was the car! There are many competant cars I can be happy driving every day, I just didn't value how important it is to me to get on a level field of competition.
Now I am getting my but kicked properly in a well prepped CRX in STS. The car is a blast and faster than me.

I think people get too fixated on what the "right" car is for the class. I am co driving an 1st gen mr2 in STS some of the telemetry we have gathered seems to indicate that the biggest problem with the car is the nuts behind the wheel... I am hoping that with another years development of the car and drivers we can kick some miata/crx butt...

Once the upgrade path of a particular make and model of a car becomes well know and or supported by the aftermarket, it renforces the tendency for people to run that car in its class. Its a lot easier to copy somebody elses work than it is to blaze your own path.

You know this thread just gave me a great idea for a magazine article...

You guys should give 3 editors a sum of money and tell them to go out and aquire an "off" car to compete in the STS class.

Then hold a shoot out comparing a nationally competitive car with the editors creations...

Whichever editor wins gets a case of beer...

Is a 92 FWD Legacy Sedan THE car to have in FSP? Nope, but I had a blast driving mine last year with my local club. Didn't win, but put on a good show churning Falkens into smoke and laughing like h#ll at the guys who had more money tied up in rims than I had in my car.

Capt Slow wrote: You know this thread just gave me a great idea for a magazine article... You guys should give 3 editors a sum of money and tell them to go out and aquire an "off" car to compete in the STS class. Then hold a shoot out comparing a nationally competitive car with the editors creations... Whichever editor wins gets a case of beer...

Quoted for truth! Greg would run a 7, and that is directly relevant to my interests.

I'd be happy to read that article if it were written.