Pifalls to buying/owing a higher mileage E36?

Looking at getting something different and want to drive something I want not something I have to drive. Currently have my paid for, but painfully anemic 18mpg Dakota, but with getting accepted to nursing school in the fall and having to cut back on the work hours to goto school 30 min the opposite way, I need something better. I would just get a V6 Mustang, but after driving my friend's 380rwhp Procharged 2v yesterday, I am utterly underwhelmed by nearly everything about the car. It just outright sucks. I also looked at the F-body twins, but entry costs are ridiculously high. Same with the GRM answer of Miata, outside the price range for what is available. Plus only having two seats hurts if everyone wants to go somewhere.

So what say ye all? Overall, getting and keeping one running doesn't bother me, but having it survive 2yrs without breaking the bank does.

Get one that's in good shape with good maintenance. You don't want to find a "cheap" one that needs to replace the cooling system, the brakes need to be done, the alternator is on its last legs, etc.

Pelican Parts is your friend if you can do your own maintenance. They've got plenty of walkthroughs and good prices on the parts.

I'll be putting mine up for sale in the next month or two, which has had the above taken care of in the past 5k miles.

Running an E36 can be pretty easy and inexpensive - if you're the type who doesn't sweat the small stuff. If you're the type who is irritated by cosmetic issues, accessories which malfunction, random CEL's or clunks and jolts from tired suspension components, owning an E36 can get expensive fast.

Just about any used E36 will need some cooling system components and all of the rubber under the car replaced. (Cars with super conscientious owners or very low mileage may not, but those are expensive). Interior bits are likely to be broken or not working properly. There may be some body and paint work needed. For piece of mind you can replace and repair this stuff all at once, but that costs money. It's your choice to decide what you can live with and what you should repair.

The best way to save money is by DIY-ing maintenance and repairs - dealer labor can reach $125/hr, and even independent shops often charge upwards of $85/hr. Online parts often cost 50% of dealer prices, and used and rebuilt parts abound for major components. BMW forums are very active and can be a great source of assistance for diagnosis and repair advice.

Fixing "stuff" doesn't bother me. I work on all my own crap, plus I helped my previously mentioned friend putting in and getting his new motor "running".

So even if I found one needing internal engine repair, it doesn't bother me, too much.

By "rubber underneath", I assume all the bushings? And maybe brake hoses?

What kind of mileage are we talking about here? The definition of high miles for a BMW is often different than it is for other brands, and in any case it often depends more on the care and maintenance the car was given over its lifetime.

120k plus......

nderwater wrote: Running an E36 can be pretty easy and inexpensive - if you're the type who doesn't sweat the small stuff. If you're the type who is irritated by cosmetic issues, accessories which malfunction, random CEL's or clunks and jolts from tired suspension components, owning an E36 can get expensive fast. Just about any used E36 will need some cooling system components and all of the rubber under the car replaced.

This. Once you drop the $700 or so on that, the big stuff (engine, drivetrain) is as dead reliable as anything out there. It's also a great excuse to replace everything with polyurethane, and upgrade the shocks and springs if you have the budget.

Ranger50 wrote: By "rubber underneath", I assume all the bushings? And maybe brake hoses?

Bushings, engine and trans mounts, rubber drivetrain coupling ("guibo"), maybe the subframe bushings. I haven't had any issues with brake hoses on my 13yo, 133k mile example.

rubber underneath is actually not a lot of rubber.

The front Lower Control Arms (there are no uppers as it is a strut front suspension) are held in with two ball joints a piece and a single rubber bushing in the "donut"

The rear has a lot of rubber depending on what model you go for. The Z cars and the Ti have two subframe bushings and two control arm bushings a side in the rear. The Sedan and coupe have a different suspension, so I am not sure what they need.

Cooling system should consist or waterpump, thermostat, and hoses at minimum. You MIGHT need a new radiator if the plastic end tanks are splitting. This may seem odd, but I consider the engine mounts to be cooling related.. the I6 uses a mechanical cooling fan (only the 1.9 litre 4 cylinder cars use an electrical fan) and if they are shot, the fan will hit the cooling shroud and "explode" often destroying the radiator, shroud, fan, waterpump and occasionally the hood.

Interior.. expect the headliner to fall down and the leather on the door panals to bubble. Windows that break and refuse to roll up are an EASY fix you can do in less than half an hour... just be prepared with new window clips and something to both degrease and regrease the bottom track. With age the stock grease gets sticky and the resulting friction breaks the plastic runners. Clean it out and regrease and you will be golden.

other niggles are a loss of pixels in the On Board Computer (OBC) heater, and odometre.. all are easily fixed if you are handy with some solder

Replace cooling system. Replace suspension bushings.

Enjoy.

The only thing left off earlier would be the CSB for the driveshaft, but it's cheap so no biggie.

There really isn't that much other stuff to do if you want a reliable, DD. If you want a PERFECT DD that is reliable, then yes, you will deal with lots of little stuff.

yes.. thanks for the reminder on the Guibo.. I need to do mine as well.

In all Honesty, the E36 is one of the last of the easy to work on cars. Everything is right up front where you can see it.. and if you can't get to it from the top.. you can reach it easily from underneath.

mad_machine wrote: Cooling system should consist or waterpump, thermostat, and hoses at minimum. You MIGHT need a new radiator if the plastic end tanks are splitting. This may seem odd, but I consider the engine mounts to be cooling related.. the I6 uses a mechanical cooling fan (only the 1.9 litre 4 cylinder cars use an electrical fan) and if they are shot, the fan will hit the cooling shroud and "explode" often destroying the radiator, shroud, fan, waterpump and occasionally the hood.

QFT. The previous owner of my M3 put a nice set of small dents in the hood when the fan exploded due to broken engine mounts. The paint chipped and there's a slight patina of rust around the edges now, but I think it adds character.

I purchased a '97 328is down in VA about two years ago, and I'm the third owner of the car. It was originally a lease, the second owner bought the car as a CPO and had it for 9 years. He decided to sell when he bought a 335is sedan. The car came with a stack of receipts, this guy had poured a fortune into the car ($30K in the CPO purchase and thousands in work done over the time he owned it). I basically bought the best example I could find within my price range. I think I slightly overpaid, but hope that will be a wash in reduced maintenance over time. I use the car as a three seasons DD

I picked up the car with about 113K. The first thing I did was to replace the cooling system (radiator, aluminum thermostat housing, water pump, t-stat, upper and lower radiator hoses) and the belts. The parts were about $350 (I shopped the GB forum on Bimmerforums for the best prices), and it took a day with me taking pictures and documenting the process. All in all, I had to buy a few BMW-specific tools (32mm/36mm wrench, fan pulley holder, 19mm wrench for the block drain plug), but it was very easy to work on.

Since then, other than oil changes the only thing I've done is to replace the coolant expansion tank cap (was leaking under pressure), and I replaced the P/S clamps with stainless steel hose clamps (these cars are famous for P/S leaks). The car has had a torn door seal on the driver's door since I bought it, I picked up a used seal and just haven't had a chance to install it yet. I also have a set of Bilstein TC shocks/struts waiting to be installed when I get some time.

There's still a bunch of stuff I'd like to replace over time:

• ball joints
• tie rods
• front control arms (include balljoints)
• rear trailing arm bushings (RTABs)
• rear shock mounts (preventative)\
• subframe bushings
• shifter bushings
• misc bushings (guibo, lollipops, etc.)

The car currently has over 125K on it and has been an absolute pleasure both to drive and to live with three seasons out of the year. Even with a decent list of things that I could/should replace, it's still a blast to drive on a daily basis. It's a great commuter car when all you want to do is get from point A to point B (I get 28 MPG in mixed driving), and it's a fun car when you want to enjoy the drive a bit more. I really miss the car when I put it away each winter!

Here are my main points: - Buy a good example with documented maintenance - If you're looking for a solid driver and don't get annoyed with minor details, they're great cars - If you feel the need to restore the car to perfection, stay far away! - Buy the Pelican Parts 101 Projects book for the most common DIY items - Watch the BMW forums for DIYs and the best deals on parts

Good luck with your search!

mad_machine wrote: In all Honesty, the E36 is one of the last of the easy to work on cars. Everything is right up front where you can see it.. and if you can't get to it from the top.. you can reach it easily from underneath.

I agree, although the PS lines and clamps are the exception to the "easy to get at" rule However, when I did all of the cooling system work, I was stunned at how well things went together. They really did put some thought into these things!

nderwater wrote: Just about any used E36 will need some cooling system components and all of the rubber under the car replaced. (Cars with super conscientious owners or very low mileage may not, but those are expensive). Interior bits are likely to be broken or not working properly. There may be some body and paint work needed.

Most of the rubber bushings on my $1200 1994 325i were actually in decent shape. My cooling system is also fine. It was leaking a little, but it was probably just the upper hose not being secured correctly.

IMHO, the E36 was designed a little too cheaply. I place it a little below a Saturn S-series as far as serviceability. It is certainly a complicated car--the whole process of bleeding the cooling system was definitely nothing I have ever had to go through before.

Good find! My car needed the works - shock mounts, engine mounts, trans mounts, guibo, r-tabs & subframe bushings. Still waiting on the subframe bushings, so I hear plenty of clunks. Previous owner had just replaced the radiator, fan and fan motor, but I had to replace the water pump, belts and pulleys.

My 92 has 258k and I just took a 400 mile trip into GA with it yesterday. Wear items are ridiculously cheap if you can afford to wait for the Pelican truck.

People go on and on about completely R&R'ing the cooling system when you buy one but really you can do a thourough inspection of all the components and replace parts as necessary. There's nothing particularly special about the cooling system and parts that pass a good look over for britleness, cracks, mushiness, etc are probably not going to fail spectacularly without warning, at least not more often than any other car on the road. An old car is an old car, you have to keep a closer eye on things to keep it running, doesn't matter if its a BMW a Honda or a Chevy. I have only replaced the radiator (started oozing along a seam), the reservoir cap, and the fan on mine. It already had a metal t-stat housing and I pulled the WP to make sure it had already been replaced with a metal bladed model.

Bleeding the cooling system? I fail to see the problem, I have done it several times.

Unscrew cap (duh)

Loosen bleed screw next to cap

Pour some coolant in the reservior

Start the car

Turn on the heater

Let car warm up

Rev the car a little to get the coolant to circulate you will see coolant squirting back in the top of the reservoir just under where the cap screws on. It should squirt in after you rev it and the rpm is dropping. Some coolant will come out from under the bleed screw also, tighten it now. This whole time you are adding coolant to the reservior as the level is dropping, keep the level in the tank up high, it bleeds better that way.

when that stream is solid when you let off the car is bled, put the cap back on.

Done!

Other than that front control arm bushings, tie rods, transmission mounts and guibo, likely at least some of that will need some R&R. It's a 15-20 year old car, if it has low miles an sat then things will be rotten, if it has high mileage then some things will be worn out.

But yeah, what I am saying is if you want something that will make you happy to drive do some shopping, buy one that runs and can be test driven, and see if you can find one that doesn't look like it needs much.