Redline MT-90 Vs. Honda MTF

So I’m ready to buy Redline MT-90 and I’ve been told that it’s basically indistinguishable from Honda Manual Transmission fluid then being half the price. Does anyone have any insight into this?

O RLY?

I have 2 quarts of Honda MTF just sitting on my toolbox, shoot me an offer and they're yours.

Head over to Bobistheoilguy. There are probably 10 different threads obsessively discussing this very topic.

beans wrote: O RLY? I have 2 quarts of Honda MTF just sitting on my toolbox, shoot me an offer and they're yours.

I'm sure I'll take you up on that once I'm sure. thx

Tom_Spangler wrote: Head over to Bobistheoilguy. There are probably 10 different threads obsessively discussing this very topic.

Awesome idea as usual Tom. I've been over and can't see this exact Q, but I've found some info on analysis of virgin samples of both, plus Amsol MTF. I've tried joining, but I'm waiting for a mod over there to approve my e-mail address. In the mean time, here's what I found from the analysis info

So, they are not the same. It's interesting that the Honda has lots of calcium but no Magnesium, but that both the Redline and Amsol have lot;s of Magnesium and very little Calcium. What does that mean? I have no borking idea. Anyone smarter than me? Well that's simple, lot's of you are smarter than me, but does anyone know anything about oil?

I'm not intelligent enough to know what any of it means, but what I do know it a lot of people smarter than me when it comes to transmissions say to stay away from the Honda MTF for anything other than the K series. Something about the formula changed some years ago, being optimized for low friction/good economy and not really sufficient lubrication for hard driving, especially in the older D and B series motors. I personally use GM/Pennzoil synchromesh, and for the D series I know many others prefer regular old dinosaur oil.

The Honda MTF would be the best fertilizer.

Many of the Miata guys swear by the Amsoil and have the blackstone labs data to show why.

I'd guess the high zinc content is good for the gears. I'd bashed up my share of Honda transmissions, I like them with Honda MTF the best. I've tried the two different kinds of synchromesh stuff, regular dino, regular synthetic oil, just about everything really. Seems like with a good drain and fill a couple times over the course of about 4 tanks of gas, it feels brand new(relatively speaking, if everything else is in good shape).

I asked a well known Honda transmission rebuilder his thoughts

10w30 dead dinos or Penn. Synchomesh for most everything. Esp. Dailys

so that's what I'm going to do

Honda MTF is way thinner than MT-90, I believe the cross ref would be Redline MTL.

Has anyone used Redline MTF in a Honda manual? I'd be interested in hearing a first hand account.

wbjones wrote: I asked a well known Honda transmission rebuilder his thoughts 10w30 dead dinos or Penn. Synchomesh for most everything. Esp. Dailys so that's what I'm going to do

Sounds like Bone's words. I'd listen to him :)

I've got 30k on a Honda Fit with Redline MT-90 in it. Prior to that, it had 60k miles on the OEM Honda fluid. I notice no difference in ease of shifting, other than a little better/smoother action after the change, which I attribute to new fluid vs old stuff.

wrongwheeldrive wrote:

wbjones wrote: I asked a well known Honda transmission rebuilder his thoughts 10w30 dead dinos or Penn. Synchomesh for most everything. Esp. Dailys so that's what I'm going to do

Sounds like Bone's words. I'd listen to him :)

this

Random Google search brought me back here.

Redline MTL or MT-90 does the plastic bearing cages in Honda no good. It slowly bleaches the color out of the plastic/weakens the cages, then the balls are able to move about and very fast wear. Needing new input shaft bearing at 75,000 miles was common. Running normal 10w30 or EARLY Honda MTF they would last 150-200k (or longer) miles before needing bearing replaced.

Current Honda MTF is too thin to be any use. P!$$water thin.

Mista Bone

My '90 Acura Owners Manual calls for SAE10W30, Type SE or SF.

Anybody got any really old cans of oil on the shelf?

Kenny_McCormic wrote: Honda MTF is way thinner than MT-90, I believe the cross ref would be Redline MTL.

yup, MTL in the Honda box, MT-90 in the Miata. I ran MTL in my Integra GSR from 30,000 to 150,000 when it was killed by a minivan. Shifted smooth as butter with the MTL.

In reply to EvanR:

Rotella 10w30 should work well.

wrongwheeldrive wrote:

wbjones wrote: I asked a well known Honda transmission rebuilder his thoughts 10w30 dead dinos or Penn. Synchomesh for most everything. Esp. Dailys so that's what I'm going to do

Sounds like Bone's words. I'd listen to him :)

I did ... and he's on here now

I run Honda MTF in my 115,000 mile Accord - it's only $5-$6qt? And you use 2qt?

jimbob_racing wrote: Has anyone used Redline MTF in a Honda manual? I'd be interested in hearing a first hand account.

I have a 2011 CR-z, I put the redline mtf in around 30,000 miles. Was hoping for a fraction of mpg improvement. What I got was worse cold weather drivability.

About 10,000 miles later I put back in Honda manual fluid, I can actually get the car in first gear when it is cold.

No notable (by me) differences in MPG or shifting feel when the weather is warm or the car is warmed up.

With Bone on the board, things could get very interesting!

Bonespec wrote: Random Google search brought me back here. Redline MTL or MT-90 does the plastic bearing cages in Honda no good. It slowly bleaches the color out of the plastic/weakens the cages, then the balls are able to move about and very fast wear. Needing new input shaft bearing at 75,000 miles was common. Running normal 10w30 or EARLY Honda MTF they would last 150-200k (or longer) miles before needing bearing replaced. Current Honda MTF is too thin to be any use. P!$$water thin. Mista Bone

So what exactly should we be using? Doubt I can find any old Honda MTF...

I was told using torco mtf is good for a daily driver honda b/d series. I started using it on my integra this year.

I still get a grind every blue moon when I autocross, but Im starting to think its more me than the transmission the times it grinds since it is very rare that it does.

Adrian_Thompson wrote: So, they are not the same. It's interesting that the Honda has lots of calcium but no Magnesium, but that both the Redline and Amsol have lot;s of Magnesium and very little Calcium. What does that mean? I have no borking idea. Anyone smarter than me? Well that's simple, lot's of you are smarter than me, but does anyone know anything about oil?

Calcium and Magnesium are pretty similar chemically. My guess is that they both use an additive(s) for a very similar purpose, where the Ca is swapped for Mg in one formulation.

Hard to make any judgements other than "clearly not the same" given just element counts.