Road Racing Anyone?

Just looking for opinions if this is a bad idea or a good idea.

I recently purchased a 2017 Jaguar XE.

I was thinking of taking this car to track days at Road Atlanta.

Years ago I used to autocross race.  But never road raced before.

Would this be an epically bad idea?

I'm not looking to be a badass on the track, I just want to put the car through it's paces.

I probably don't know much about road racing.

If I have to take a class first, that is fine.

If you have any links to info on that, it would be great.

Any insights for a newb about how to get into this sport would be lovely.

Or telling me I am nuts to want to race that car is fine also.

Thanks.

The first thing to know is don't say "road racing" because that infers you want to do wheel-to-wheel racing, in a race car with racing safety gear, etc.

What you are looking for is a "track day" or a "HPDE" (high performance driving experience) or a number of similar noncompetitive events that will allow you to put your car through its paces on a track, but without the danger of actual racing.

Plenty of organiztinos do them, but check with SCCA, NASA, BMW CCA, Porsche Club, etc. Since I don't suppose there are Jag clubs doing track days !

You're not nuts. What's the point in buying a powerful sports sedan if not to take it to the track?? :)"

Thank you!  What generally happens at track days? What can I expect as far as the experience goes?  

Because I haven't been able to find any good info on this yet.

There is a club at Road Atlanta, I could sign up for, but their website is rather sparse. So I don't exactly know how it all works.

Here ya go, NASA south east is your answer. Some other clubs probably run similarly, track night USA, Chin, and Porsche club is welcoming to other makes.

A track day is exactly the perfect place to try out your car; most people driving at them aren't racers.

I instruct at track days so I'll share the basics:

You'll need a helmet (Snell  SA2010 or Snell SA2015) the club should be able to give you exact requirement.

So the basic weekend goes very much like autocross; you show up sign in and then go through a basic tech inspection.

As a newbie you'll be in a student group. On Saturday they'll do some class rooms sessions in the morning along with some skid pad style drills, then around lunch you'll likely do a couple of sighting laps at low speed so you can see where the corner statins are and where the track goes.In the afternoon your instructor will do the first two laps at a moderate pace, then you'll come  into the pits swap seats so you can drive. You will likely have two on track sessions in the afternoon

On Sunday you'll do four sessions, you'll have an instructor for every session.

Sessions are usually 30 minutes long; broken out by skill and sped level. Student, novice, intermediate and expert.

There is a difference from track driving to autocross. The big difference is unlike autocross where the car responds immediately, the higher the speed the longer the car takes to respond, so you can't be near as aggressive. 

As an instructor I focus on getting students to think about trajectory versus steering to hit your marks. I try to get people to make corrections by steering with the pedals (throttle steering & trail raking) rather than trying to make rapid steering inputs. Also remember on a road course you're trying to bend the tires slowly as to get them most out of all 4 tires at once. It's a different mindset from Autocross. Autocross of course will haven given you the car control skills as well as the ability to read the car quickly, so you'll  have a huge leg up on most students.  

I also, like most instructors, really really want you to have fun as well as progress.

My advice is go for it, you'll likely not be driving more than 75% of the cars capability but it will still be about 200% faster than you could on any on ramp or curvy mountain road.

Lots of writeups out on the net, but generally speaking, at a track school you'll do sessions of around 20 minutes in length, possibly with an instructor in the car, possibly in a lead-follow arrangement.  There will be classroom & discussion sessions between the track sessions, where the instructors will go over what went well and what still needs to be worked on.  They'll teach you about the line, the flags, steering and braking techniques, passing safely, etc.  It's a ton of fun, and can turn into a very expensive hobby if you're not careful. :)

One thing to keep in mind is that incidents at track schools are generally not covered by your normal car insurance.  You can opt to self-insure (my personal rule is never to drive anything on track unless I can afford to replace it out of pocket), or there is at least one specialized track day insurance company (https://locktonmotorsports.com) who will quote you a premium to cover a track day or weekend.  It's expensive insurance and has a high deductible, but it buys a certain amount of peace of mind.

Track Night In America   I believe this is where you want to be. The program is aimed at new drivers looking for some on track time.

Thanks guys!  Awesome advice.  I am reading through all that.

My next question is, are there any special tire requirements for this?

When I autocrossed, tire pressure had to be way up and decent tires.

My Jag has the super low profile tires and not sure if that is suitable or not.

And not sure about the tire pressures.

I can post pics/specs if it helps.

What I have done is just pick a track that I want to visit then look at their calendar to see what events look good to me.  Most will list the phone number of a rep for each club or group. 

I have been to a BMW CCA drivers school and found that they allow other makes to come and play.  Three Balls Racing is a group in Michigan that rents tracks for HPDE, with instructors available.

Any way you go about this it the right way, get out there and have fun.

ncjay said:

Track Night In America   I believe this is where you want to be. The program is aimed at new drivers looking for some on track time.

No no no no no no no no. No, No.

No.

Stay away from Track Night. This format is a great way to get yourself or your car hurt.

Seriously. They allow anybody to sign up into any group, there's no in-car or out of car instruction. There's no instructors on track either monitoring traffic. I did 20 HPDE events this year and the ONLY sketchy situations I had were at track night (and there were many both times I went). Notably an RX-7 which spun multiple times after taking passes without a point, or an e46 which pushed me onto the grass on the front straight after pointing him by (and then claimed that it was my fault).... or a parked EXOCET on the exit of the highest speed corner with no flags thrown...

NASA runs a great HPDE event, and I hear Chin does too. Since the OP is driving a new Jag, I'm assuming he can spend $500 on a quality weekend vs a $150 weeknight scarefest.

Since you are looking at Road Atlanta, check out Just Track It. They have a great group of instructors and you usually get more track time than you would with NASA/SCCA since they don't have all of the race groups as well. Their next event at RA is March 9, but they have a few events throughout the year.

http://justtrackit.net/calendar/road-atlanta-march-2018/

http://justtrackit.net/calendar/

In reply to Blaise :

Yeah, I've done 2 TNIA and it was fun but pretty seriously sketchy.  As an autocrosser with some experience and fair skills I went out (alone) in the intermediate group for my first ever track experience.  Everything went ok but I could see it going sideways really quickly.

The only incident was a mechanical failure that should have been caught if there was any sort of tech inspection (self tech didn't notice loose lug nuts resulted in sheared off wheel in a corner).

Just Track It is superb! I would second that signup.

If you're in a new car - I'd recommend getting track insurance (I use Lockton https://locktonmotorsports.com/) or check with your insurer about it. 
 

As has been said, check your organizing group carefully. I've run with groups with no vetting process and  inadequate numbers of corner workers. If you're running a late-model jaguar, run with people with care and restraint, not a crazy teenager in a clapped out Civic (Or a hedge-fund manager with aggression issues). I can't speak to your area, but where I am, NASA runs a tight ship, and the Shelby Club practically does parade laps.  Also, big bucks  clubs like Aston Martin will often invite other marques to fill out their sparse fields, and I doubt they'll tolerate tomfoolery.

That said, the possibility exists that even under the best of supervision stuff can happen. At one event a coolant spill led to a brand new 370Z as well as a cherry race-spec Birkin sliding into the wall at triple digit speeds. No amount of talent or restraint could have saved them from totaling their cars.

I'd say go with chin first. Road atlanta is a tricky track to be a first timer and I think chin's longer sessions and complete lack of competitive race groups will get you more time on track and laps with an instructor. Don't get me wrong I love NASA too. But the focus there is more on competition and for a first track experience with a nice car I think that competition is the last thing you want on your mind.

I'll just make a couple of quick points.

1. Over the last 20 years or so, I've instructed with just about all the major organizations that host "HPDE" type programs. Even served a Chief Instructor for a couple. My personal opinion is that the BMW CCA is still the best overall. Obviously, everyone will have their own opinions. But, I think just about everyone would agree that you can't really go wrong with BMW CCA driving schools. Join your local chapter (they don't care what car you drive), check their events calendar, and register for a school. It's a friendly bunch and you'll surely feel welcome.
2. Besides a car, you'll need a helmet. Most clubs will require an "SA" rated helmet, which is designed to be used in a car with a cage around you. Some will let newcomers use an "M" rated helmet and some will offer helmets for you to borrow or rent.
3. You'll need to bring the car in for a pre-event "tech inspection." Go to a local shop you trust, bring them the tech sheet, and have them go over the car. For a brand-new car, it should be very quick. You'll be charged maybe 30 minutes of labor.
4. Leave the car stock. No need to upgrade anything. Stock street tires are fine; even all-seasons and run-flats are OK. Don't worry about that. If you feel the burning need to upgrade something, maybe consider brake pads. But even this isn't really necessary.
5. It's always a little risky putting a car on track. Chances are, everything will be ok. But what if you have a big impact? I'm personally not very comfortable putting a car on track if I'm still making payments on it, keeping in mind that your regular insurance policy probably will not cover you for any damage you pick up while on a racetrack. Look into trackday insurance coverage from Hagerty, Lockton , RLI, etc.

codrus said:

One thing to keep in mind is that incidents at track schools are generally not covered by your normal car insurance.  You can opt to self-insure (my personal rule is never to drive anything on track unless I can afford to replace it out of pocket), or there is at least one specialized track day insurance company (https://locktonmotorsports.com) who will quote you a premium to cover a track day or weekend.  It's expensive insurance and has a high deductible, but it buys a certain amount of peace of mind.

Lots of good advice, but with a shiny new Jag...Especially this!

I instruct at track days and I had a student this past year that drove one of these cars.  I was impressed with the power and handing. Make sure you turn off the traction control each time you go on track.  AS most cars today use the braking system  in part to manage traction and stability on the street. You don't want that working on the track as you could overheat your brakes and won't learn to react to what the car is doing in the turns since these systems will "cover up" any mistakes you make.

You will use up a few thousand miles of rubber on your ties if you have "all seasons" like he did. But he had fun!

This instructor won't want you turning off the traction control, at least in the first session.

Each car responds differently to 'nanny aid' intrusions. Some beginning students really need the TC on, especially if they are driving a car way above their skill level. As my trainer at work is fond of saying to answer half the questions we ask him, "It is a case-by-case basis". 

ddavidv said:

This instructor won't want you turning off the traction control, at least in the first session.

Each car responds differently to 'nanny aid' intrusions. Some beginning students really need the TC on, especially if they are driving a car way above their skill level. As my trainer at work is fond of saying to answer half the questions we ask him, "It is a case-by-case basis". 

My advice to my students (and I think I stole this from Randy Pobst) is to leave all the nannies on until you can feel them working and they're doing something you don't want them to. 

I will say that with the student with the Jag we did keep the nannies on for a session of two but this driver was good enough that I felt they were holding him back from learning how to drive the car and not letting the car drive him.  I've been doing "on track" driving since the mid 70's and inst. since the 80's so while I'm no Pro driver I do know what I'm doing.

APEowner said:

My advice to my students (and I think I stole this from Randy Pobst) is to leave all the nannies on until you can feel them working and they're doing something you don't want them to. 

You mean when you pull off the track and the brakes are on fire? :)  Brake-based TC really isn't intended for track use.

Another option:  Open Road Racing

Sort of like bracket racing over a much longer course, with little danger from other drivers.

Texas:  Big Bend Open Road Race

Nebraska:  Sand Hills Open Road Challenge

Nevada:  Silver State Classic