Roll bar for a NC Miata - and a little venting ;)

Hi all,

I'm in the market for a 09+ miata only (It's the only one I can fit in and I like the upgrades). I'm wanting to AutoX and HPDE the car as well as it being my daily driver. I was going to go the M3 route, but it's just not working out. Plus I know the Miata will be cheaper in the long run. Until.... I looked at the cost of the rollbar.

I'm not trying to start a fight. I know safety is everything. The issue I'm faced with is that the rollbar cost of a NASA approved bar is around $1300.00. That's not installed. I also like to keep my cars as stock as possible (yes, this is my preference). I don't want to have modifications I cannot remove cleanly. I'm rounding here, but with installation it's looking above 2k+ for the rollbar (cannot install myself). This puts the price up quite high. I really thought a rollbar was around $500, but that doesn't look like the case. Before I dump the idea of getting a miata and going back to an M3 hardtop (the cost is the same after the roll bar costs on the miata) is there a rollbar out there that is approved for track use that isn't so pricey and doesn't require cutting material the car to install it?

Also, I know a car with a hardtop is not really safe either. But with the rollbar cost I'm starting to re-think the miata since they're about the same cost out of the gate (I know, consumables). Personal experience, but my god the people who own M3's are some of the biggest tools (Sorry to offend anyone here with an M3, just my dealings over the past months looking for one and I'm venting).

Thanks for reading all that and if anyone has any cheap solutions for the miata I would love to hear them. Cheers!

Hard Dog has a bar that's less expensive but IIRC because of where the diagonals are placed it's technically not acceptable by some organizations.

Where are you seeing the rollbar is more than 500-600? I've never seen anyone have an issue with the hard dog bars at a track day unless they just don't fit under the top hoop. It's pretty much the accepted standard for roll bars in the miata world.

Hard Dog Link

bmw88rider wrote: Where are you seeing the rollbar is more than 500-600? I've never seen anyone have an issue with the hard dog bars at a track day unless they just don't fit under the top hoop. It's pretty much the accepted standard for roll bars in the miata world. Hard Dog Link

The only SCCA/NASA legal NC bar is the Blackbird one. The Hard Dog one is probably "okay" but it's not accepted by the org's.

You could probably get a custom one built for half of that $2K. My experiences with off the shelf roll structures has never been good. Thats why I build my own. Maybe today in the world of computer generated roll structures, the fit has become better. I'm still amazed at how the countertop guys can come in take a 3D picture and come back a week later with perfectly fitting granite countertops, so maybe the same principle is at work in roll hoops. Custom hoops will use every bit of available space and allow for your body shape to fit inside them the best. Legality is a matter of tubing type, tubing size, and placement of tubes.

Not starting argument here either - but I'm 6'2 and I own 2 NAs. I don't find the NC to be any bigger than the NA/NB and there's better options to lower the seat in the earlier cars.

if you want an NC and if you want a rollbar and if you dont want to do the work yourself... yes it will be pricey. Not sure why it's upsetting you, you can either get a diff miata, a diff car, or wait for a used bar to popup for sale or install it yourself. Unfortunately $2k isn't that much in this game. I budget half that for a single weekend in tires/brakes/gas/entryfees.

You can also look at an 86. Better seats, more space, no roll bar needed (and excellent roof strength) and can be had for low teens.

Depends on your body shape. NCs are wider and have more room for Torso length. I'm 6'2 but have a 29" inseam and I don't fit in race prepped NA/NBs unless they have the floor pan lowered or have a seat with a good amount of layback. NCs I can make work stock and I'm fine in pretty much any race seat bolted to the floor.

As far as roll bars they're all going to be intrusive and require cutting stock plastics. For NASA/SCCA legality there are 2 other options than the Blackbird one:

Hard Dog Transformer Roll Bar - Most expensive and most tall guy friendly. Requires more messing with stuff when you're unloading for the day/packing up to go home, not very rain friendly either. That said if you go prht bar for the street one you lessen the unhelmeted head colliding with a steel bar risk while driving on the street.

Hard Dog Sport with Petty Bar Upgrade - Cheapest, won't be legal if you have a passenger/instructor. I've also seen many people running with this without the Petty Bar and haven't heard of anyone getting turned away while using it.

I went with the transformer bar to make sure I was fine on a broomstick test without changing seats and I liked the prht bar idea when I'm not on a track. That said it does suck when it's wet and at the end of the day the extra 15 minutes unbolting stuff is annoying.

I will second the FRS/BRZ/86 idea though, they're basically an NC Miata with less drag.

If you're racing, then pull the soft top, get a permanent hard top and you can build a much better bar. The design of the factory soft top on the NC really limits what can be done with a bar, custom or off-the-shelf.

I'm not completely sure what justification Moti uses for the pricing of his bars, but they are expensive.

The NC Hard Dog bar fits perfectly. The best protection you can get in a roll bar for the NC is the Transformer due to the available height, but there is some assembly required.

Keith Tanner wrote: I'm not completely sure what justification Moti uses for the pricing of his bars, but they are expensive.

As the owner of one, the quality shows. I deal with fabrication quotations all the time at work and I thought $850 shipped for the bar I have was very reasonable.

The Hard Dog stuff isn't exactly hacked together, but it doesn't have the flourishes like the drilled gussets. The BFW stuff does look nice.

Gentleman_Racer wrote: ... is there a rollbar out there that is approved for track use that isn't so pricey and doesn't require cutting material the car to install it?

I'll shorten that question to simplify the search.

Gentleman_Racer wrote: ... is there a rollbar out there that doesn't require cutting material the car to install it?

No.

Just had a long talk with Tom at Hard Dog. I was wrong - the "problem" with his NC bars is the location of the rear braces where they join the main hoop. It's forced by trying to minimize the cutting of the plastic in the car and it's not a structural problem, but it doesn't currently meet the letter of the regulations. Tom's been talking to anyone in the SCCA who will listen - and he's been building roll bars for a quarter century at least, so they know him - and he's got some ideas. My poke with a stick will get him to take another look at the situation.

He has also never heard of anyone failing tech due to this.

The Hard Dog NC bar does have backing plates on the front feet while (I believe) the BFW bar does not, so that's a point for Hard Dog. He has some concerns about how the BFW bars will survive a vertical impact due to the angles of some of the diagonals, but that's the sort of thing that cage designers love to discuss with lots of "what if" and hand waving. The cool looking gussets in the BFW bars are more of a signature flourish than a structural item.

Awesome help all! Very much appreciated! I totally forgot about the gt86, so I'll give those a look next. I think with the new info about the roll bar I may give M3's or the gt86's another shot.

Just in case I do pull the trigger on a miata though I'll definitely consider the Hard Dog M3 Sport. It seems the one that is less intrusive. Only thing is I'm 6ft tall and I hope that the additional 1 3/4" is enough to pass broomstick anyone have experience here? I was going to run with NASA, but maybe I'll try to find another group as I'm not that hardcore I'm just looking for weekend fun around the track and autox.

In reply to Keith Tanner:

Just to add in, I've never heard of the Hard Dog failing tech and I've seen 6 diff NCs with them on track with NASA/SCCA/other groups. Before buying a bar for my car I talked with a couple of tech inspectors and they basically only cared about tube size and the broomstick test. Adding the petty bar option does make it letter of the law legal but requires drilling in the passenger floor board and has more reversibility issues.

Also I know you wanted a later car but there's a 2006 on m.net that's got Ohlins/hard top/hard dog with Petty bar for $8k.

Gentleman_Racer wrote: Awesome help all! Very much appreciated! I totally forgot about the gt86, so I'll give those a look next.

Great. I love them. It's my next car unless somebody gifts me $50k for a 981...