RWD Rallycross Cars - Nationwide Top Cars List

So in the other thread Pete and I and others were discussing the "must have" RWD car for rallycross. And looking around, it's clearly very dependent on the region, conditions, or just what's popular where. Anyhow, thought it might be an interesting statistical study to see which cars are the best in which region/championship. I can't find (or am too lazy to find) ones from the regions all over the country, so maybe you all can help me out with that by looking at the 2016 results from your own region.

Note - this doesn't have to be SCCA specifically - any club will do!

So here's what I've rounded up so far for 2016:

2016 National Championship

MR - 1st Miata, 2nd '81 Corolla, 3rd Miata

PR - 1st FR-S, 2nd MR2, 3rd Miata

SR - 1st-3rd Miatas

2016 East Coast Championship

MR - 1st BMW e30, 2nd Miata, 3rd Volvo 240 Turbo (14-car class!)

PR - 1st Miata, 2nd BMW e36, 3rd BMW e30

SR - 1st 240SX, 2nd Volvo 240, 3rd 240SX

2016 Central Championship (not much RWD action)

MR - 1st Miata, 2nd Miata, 3rd Volvo 940 wagon (!!)

PR - 1st MR2, 2nd and 3rd BR-Z

SR - none

2016 West Championships

MR - 1st '81 Corolla, 2nd '81 Corolla, 3rd Miata

PR - 1st and 2nd - two MR2s (only cars entered)

SR - 1st and 2nd - two Mustangs (only cars entered)

2016 Washington DC region - RWD Season Results

MR - e30s won all 8 events (4 different cars/drivers) - typical turnout 10+ entries

PR - Miata won 6 events, e30 won 1, e36 won 1 - typical turnout 10+ entries

SR - no entrants (none)

2016 New England Region - RWD Season Results (hard to read their results, but here's my best try)

MR - Porsche 924S won 4 events, e30 won 2 events, some other kind of RWD car won 2 events (about 20 total cars all season)

PR - almost no entries all season

MR - almost no entries all season

In for an informative thread... I would like to snag something for Susquahana, Blue Mt, and DC region events in the future.

Here in Texas we have Dustin's AE86 and Bee's supercharged Miata as the fast regulars. If someone wins, it's one of them.
I think Bee's car is inherently faster, it's just that Dustin is a mutant and the Corolla is an extension of his brain at this point.

2016 Tarheel Sports Car Club Rallycross Results

THSCC does a mixed class with 2WD based on displacement and tires. Looks to have been a pretty even mix of wins between e30s, Miatas, and A Volvo or two amongst the RWD entries.

I see "E36" in there but with so many versions of that chassis.. which one? 2 door, 4 door, hatchback? Even the Z3 qualifies as an e36

I really should have gotten a RWD car. I have a lifetime of driving RWD. I have no idea how to do FWD, it's all bass ackwards. I don't think my brain will adjust. I feel sorry for the course workers when I'll be running.

Ross413 wrote: In for an informative thread... I would like to snag something for Susquahana, Blue Mt, and DC region events in the future.

if you're on facebook, join up in the "dirty e-thirties" group or the DC rallycross group. RWD cars frequently posted up for sale cheap on there for rallycross duty.

Nick (Bo) Comstock wrote: I really should have gotten a RWD car. I have a lifetime of driving RWD. I have no idea how to do FWD, it's all bass ackwards. I don't think my brain will adjust. I feel sorry for the course workers when I'll be running.

You'll be faster in FWD and you'll learn some useful things. The fastest people I know can switch back and forth and use skills learned in both.

mad_machine wrote: I see "E36" in there but with so many versions of that chassis.. which one? 2 door, 4 door, hatchback? Even the Z3 qualifies as an e36

yeah yeah....of course in MR class, they can have engine swaps, etc....so was just going with general chassis . Same with e30s (our local e30 group includes M42, M20B25, M20B27, and M50 cars)

Our fastest local e36s are a 318i (2nd in PR at most events) and Nick's M3 (in MR). I would think more TI's would be out there, but I've only ever seen one at a rallycross (S52 swapped, a stage rally car). Never seen a Z3 at an event, though I guess it would be possible.

Coupe vs. Sedan make no performance difference in my experience (e30 or e36). More a matter of convenience.

mazdeuce wrote: it's just that Dustin is a mutant and the Corolla is an extension of his brain at this point.

So the PROJECT.RX decals aren't just an otaku homage?

I'll finish watching Initial D someday. I think I stalled at episode 6 of Fifth Stage.

Speaking of engine swaps and all sorts of stuff.

I'll lay this out simply. Everything you do that helps you put more power down, makes the car worse for rallycross. Full stop.

Engine swaps are kind of a waste of time, I think. I joked with the Englands that they'd slow down a lot after they put the supercharger on, but they didn't

This all is why I'm kind of excited to deliberately limit myself to Prepared rules for my new RX-7. It's only going to have maybe 160, 165hp because the rules don't allow any internal engine work. This will liberate me to have lighter tires that react faster, less limited slip so the car will actually turn, less breakage (I hope...) so I can actually drive the thing instead of shovel money at it every event, and perversely this car is something like 20% lighter too so it should be even more non-breakage-prone. I even think I have a Prepared-legal method of dealing with the rear suspension geometry issues. There are loopholes you can drive a truck through if you are inventive enough.

On the other hand, I still think that the Detroit Locker-based rearend I built for the MR car will greatly help its handling, turning it from a chuck and recover car to something you can actually drive through a corner. It's a shame that they made the rule that no driver can enter two cars in the same event.

All these boosted Miatas around these days. I'm going to have to bite the bullet next winter and boost the M42 to make up for all the extra weight I run with these days with the full cage and spare tires in the trunk lol. M52/52 swap would be the easy(er) button, but the weight balance on the 4-cyl e30 is so nice I actually dislike driving the 6cyl cars at this point.

EDIT: Funny timing considering your prior post. But if I boost the car it will be primarily for stage rally (where we're really underpowered). I agree with you Pete that power is not the great equalizer in rallycross.

Then again, I'm at 135-140hp at best. Will be changing to a shorter LSD diff in a couple weeks, which should be a much better upgrade for rallycross (3.73 moving to a 4.10) with the lower power.

Miatas just get forced induction because nobody focuses on N/A power. Well, there was that one guy who had something like 250hp N/A from a 1.8 with all headwork (stock engine south of the head gasket), but that's about it.

In reply to irish44j:

there or the dirt cheap future racecars group as well, I think most members are in each group

Bee's supercharged car is VERY easy to modulate power in. It drives like a NA car with half again as much power.

The PROJECT.RX decals were something we came up with after we decided that the white car could really be competitive. Unfortunately I couldn't be as involved as I wanted to when they moved the event time and I couldn't attend nationals.

In reply to Knurled:

there are a handful of 1.8L miatas now making 150-160hp at a wheels without port work on pump gas out of Florida now. I'm pretty sure that on E85 with a decked head, portwork and cams that aren't the simple exhaust cam swap, that 185 is pretty easy to obtain, but it gets expensive when comparing the cost to get above 150hp.

In reply to captdownshift:

I'll agree that it doesn't make sense given that you can get 300-320hp junkyard-diving Duratec 4-cylinder parts. Scuttlebutt is that the 2.0 direct injected head is incredible for port flow characteristics. That on a 2.5 block destroked with a 2.3 crank for Midget rules reasons, and throttle bodies/good pistons and rods/good cams...

Of course, at the speeds we work with, you're either lucky or your chassis setup is biased, if you can put more than 200hp down reliably.

also, you guys were supposed to be posting up your regional stuff like I did at the beginning ;) stop slacking lol...else Pete is going to take us down the rabbit-hole of obscurity.

rx7 - duh.

ETRSCCA results 2016 from what i can find

SR: 240sx, Miata, RX8, MR2

PR: Miata, Volvo 242

MR: RX7, Isuzu Impulse, Mustang.

Who snuck an impulse into a rwd class

captdownshift wrote: Who snuck an impulse into a rwd class

apparently first gens are RWD

fidelity101 wrote: rx7 - duh.

As you are the only GLDiv car that's beaten me, I will fully support your contention. Though I still don't know how you did it with no compression and running out of fuel...

Ironically, the only non-BMWs I've ever lost to at a rallycross (at least that I can recall) are 2nd gen RX7s (you, Shawn Roberts, and Roberto Moreton). So RX7s can DIAF as far as I'm concerned :/

I'll also throw out that Nick Drymalski won the (highly competitive) 2015 WDCR MR season in a (heavily modified) e28 528e, winning I think four events that year and taking second in most other cars. He beat every local e30 that year (including me).

Something he was not able to accomplish either of this year with an even more heavily prepped e36 M3.

Sometimes a car just works for you, I guess that's the lesson there.