^ That. Fo realz. Our CEL's don't stay lit. Hell, I'm not even sure either one of ours works.
^ That. Fo realz. Our CEL's don't stay lit. Hell, I'm not even sure either one of ours works.
Datsun1500 wrote: Seeing as the high dollar luxury cars plummet in value in the first few years, I can't imagine how bad the high dollar Hyundais will fall.
I'm all in favour of a cheap Genesis sedan in a few years. Not a sports sedan, but it would likely be a sweet daily driver.
forzav12 wrote: Agreed, the obvious choice would be the V. Lacking that option and only having 60K, I still leave the copy at the dock and choose a couple year old S class.
a used S class is temptingly cheap (hell, a 5-year old S is only ~$30k), but they do require "$100k car"-type maintenance, and lots of it.
Buzz Killington wrote:forzav12 wrote: Agreed, the obvious choice would be the V. Lacking that option and only having 60K, I still leave the copy at the dock and choose a couple year old S class.a used S class is temptingly cheap (hell, a 5-year old S is only ~$30k), but they do require "$100k car"-type maintenance, and lots of it.
Bingo. Want a luxury marque, you have to maintain a luxury marque.
In reply to Buzz Killington:
When do the Japanese cars stop being considered the copies? It seems to me that Mercedes got their asses handed to them so badly by Lexus that they ended up largely trying to switch over to a Lexus model of business. Of course, the old world charm and unique German enginingeering was left behind. Since they never had the driving prowess of a BMW, there wasn't much else left. Now Mercedes has little to offer in their mainstream sedans that you can't get in a Lexus. And the Lexus is light years ahead in reliability.
A little more on topic, it is telling that Hyundai is trying to emulate Lexus with their sedan instead of Mercedes.
I'll throw it out there. I just don't get why European cars are held in high opinion. Sure, I'm jealous of the options they have over there, specifically small diesels and AWD 3-door hatches, but I've never seen anything specifically fantastic about European brands that's not done just as good or better elsewhere.
Yeah, last time I rode in a Mercedes I wasn't impressed. It wasn't bad by any means, and I'm certain there's more I'd notice as a driver rather than as a passenger, but it felt no different from any other decent mid-size sedan I've ever been in.
Basically, it was nothing special.
Heh. I've been helping a friend car shop and he test drove a Genesis. He liked it okay after driving it, but in my opinion, it's the Toyota Camry of sporty cars. Or, as I said to him, "You are not getting laid in that car, dude." Still, it's a nice little sleeper.
He's shelling the big bucks out for the used Porsche Cayman instead. If you're going to have a midlife crisis car and have the money to do so, might as well do it with style.
Funny thing, when I posted the pic of him in the Genesis to Facebook, the guys liked the look; the women thought it was the most boring car they'd ever seen.
dollraves wrote: . Or, as I said to him, "You are not getting laid in that car, dude." Still, it's a nice little sleeper.
if you can't get laid because of what car you drive, you have other problems to worry about....
and women who want to berkeley you because you drive an M3 or Lexus are a bad lay anyhow. The best berkeleys are the ones who want to do it in the back of your 1989 turbo plymouth voyager, with DARK tinted windows. Especialy if your roommate drives a 3rd-generation RX7 twin-turbo and still can't get any tail.
not that i'd know anything about that, of course...having been married for 7 years 
I agree with irish. Never got laid because of my car; I guess you could say it was 'in spite of my car'. 
Late model Mercedes fit/finish/reliability is pretty bad. Want an eye opener? Check out concerns of oil in ECU's and transmission fluid in transmission controllers. Mercedes does not consider this a defect. Or maybe turbocharger failure on the late inline 6 diesels.
They are coasting on their reputation now and that won't end well.
Ninja edit: my ex m-i-l has a Kia Spectra5 wagon (has a Hyundai drivetrain), other than routine maintenance, a battery, 4 tires and a mirror that fell out of a sunvisor it's been rock reliable. Oh, and it got popped hard from behind by a Olds 88, it was close to totaled dollar wise. Still runs/drives great. I'd put current Kia and Hyundai products about where Hondas were in the mid '90's and that's not bad by any means.
So much hype.. So little execution..
dollraves wrote: Heh. I've been helping a friend car shop and he test drove a Genesis. He liked it okay after driving it, but in my opinion, it's the Toyota Camry of sporty cars. Or, as I said to him, "You are not getting laid in that car, dude." Still, it's a nice little sleeper. He's shelling the big bucks out for the used Porsche Cayman instead. If you're going to have a midlife crisis car and have the money to do so, might as well do it with style. Funny thing, when I posted the pic of him in the Genesis to Facebook, the guys liked the look; the women thought it was the most boring car they'd ever seen.
Sounds like he's getting a good thing with the Porsche, but if he wants to get laid, he needs to go to the cute looking cars. Think E30 Convertible, Miata, VW Beetle... THAT is what attracts the females, at least in my experience.
Otto Maddox wrote: In reply to Datsun1500: Yeah, but Hyundais are generally reliable. VW can't even make a reliable Jetta.
I was going to disagree with you but my GLI is hanging from a hoist right now with an exploded INNER C.V. joint... I got to drive a 2010 Nissan Altima S 2.5L CVT sedan. At least I was well rested from sleeping through my drive home.
A few months ago I test drove a 2.0T Track Manual and a 3.8 Track Automatic. The dealer didn't have a 3.8 Track Manual to drive so I was stuck with the automatic. The 2.0T was first and I was disappointed. I didn't like the power and the sound just wasn't right. I thought I would hate the 3.8 since it was an automatic but I actually liked it much more than the 2.0T. Power was more than enough to have fun on my commute and for an occasional (realistically probably none) autocross. I asked the dealer to call me when a manual one came in and I never heard a thing. I keep thinking I'd like the 3.8 Track Manual for my next car and I really want a car just like that but with 4 doors. Plus I hear rumours of a power bump, more rumours of big issues with the transmissions, and an over 30 grand price and I'm content to wait.
That same day I also drove a 370Z with a manual. I really liked the car but for the few weeks after the test drives I only really thought of the Genesis Coupe.
mtn wrote:dollraves wrote: Heh. I've been helping a friend car shop and he test drove a Genesis. He liked it okay after driving it, but in my opinion, it's the Toyota Camry of sporty cars. Or, as I said to him, "You are not getting laid in that car, dude." Still, it's a nice little sleeper. He's shelling the big bucks out for the used Porsche Cayman instead. If you're going to have a midlife crisis car and have the money to do so, might as well do it with style. Funny thing, when I posted the pic of him in the Genesis to Facebook, the guys liked the look; the women thought it was the most boring car they'd ever seen.Sounds like he's getting a good thing with the Porsche, but if he wants to get laid, he needs to go to the cute looking cars. Think E30 Convertible, Miata, VW Beetle... THAT is what attracts the females, at least in my experience.
and motorcycles.
Otto Maddox wrote: In reply to Buzz Killington: When do the Japanese cars stop being considered the copies? It seems to me that Mercedes got their asses handed to them so badly by Lexus that they ended up largely trying to switch over to a Lexus model of business. Of course, the old world charm and unique German enginingeering was left behind. Since they never had the driving prowess of a BMW, there wasn't much else left. Now Mercedes has little to offer in their mainstream sedans that you can't get in a Lexus. And the Lexus is light years ahead in reliability. A little more on topic, it is telling that Hyundai is trying to emulate Lexus with their sedan instead of Mercedes.
Those of us that consider ourselves enthusiasts know the difference. I gave a Lexus 400 a try and was very disappointed. A boring, floppy device that was quickly replaced by another S-class. There is no comparison for a competent, GT that can cover ground in a hurry. The Europeans get it and have for decades. Cadillac is also rather nice and I fully expect to add a CTS-V wagon to the fleet at some point. Interestingly, I found the Infinity Q45 to be a far better device than the Lexus. Considering that the best selling Lexus is a tarted up, jacked up Camry platform with an ugly body, I'd hardly consider their customers to be the paragon of driver-based luxury vehicles. Mercedes(and others) depict their cars on the autobahn, the 'Ring and performing feats of vehicular goodness. Lexus? We have a car that parks itself. Pass. As to the Hyundai, a coarser, cut-rate Lexus. Pass again.
ReverendDexter wrote: I'll throw it out there. I just don't get why European cars are held in high opinion. Sure, I'm jealous of the options they have over there, specifically small diesels and AWD 3-door hatches, but I've never seen anything specifically fantastic about European brands that's not done just as good or better elsewhere.
I have.
mtn wrote: Sounds like he's getting a good thing with the Porsche, but if he wants to get laid, he needs to go to the cute looking cars. Think E30 Convertible, Miata, VW Beetle... THAT is what attracts the females, at least in my experience.
Nope. MINI. Period.
If the goal is to buy a car and meet interesting single women, no car do that like a MINI. I can not think of any car where the local clubs have more women in them. Single women. Interesting and intelligent women. I'm not saying they won't see a dog a mile away if you come across like that, but your chances are better with a MINI than through any other car.
Ian F wrote:mtn wrote: Sounds like he's getting a good thing with the Porsche, but if he wants to get laid, he needs to go to the cute looking cars. Think E30 Convertible, Miata, VW Beetle... THAT is what attracts the females, at least in my experience.Nope. MINI. Period. If the goal is to buy a car and meet interesting single women, no car do that like a MINI. I can not think of any car where the local clubs have more women in them. Single women. Interesting and intelligent women. I'm not saying they won't see a dog a mile away if you come across like that, but your chances are better with a MINI than through any other car.
I definitely agree with you.
I'd consider a 2.0t track as a dd. It couldnt possibly any more gutless than my Accent.
If the 2.0T R-spec had cruise, I'd buy one as a DD. On an auto-x course they are fun, tossable and balanced, if a bit underpowered. But on the street it is a nice comfortable, economical and safe vehicle with loads of room for two.
Too bad the European makers can't get their maintainance and repair costs down. They've trolled for years on the notion that their kind of goodness comes at a cost, and then the Japanese came along and exposed their game.
Fussy and expensive (or time-consuming) vehicles are fine as weekend toys, but for us workaday Joe's who need reliable transportation but also love cars, the Japanese have it wired.
If you're judging all Japanese cars by one Lexus 400, you're missing the point.
I've been a fan of European cars all my life, but there are just too many good choices from across the other pond.
rogerbvonceg wrote: Fussy and expensive (or time-consuming) vehicles are fine as weekend toys, but for us workaday Joe's who need reliable transportation but also love cars, the Japanese have it wired.
I don't know... I replaced a lot more parts on my '91 Integra in 229K miles than I have on my '03 TDI Jetta in 237K... radiator, rear caliper, blower motor... 75K timing belt vs. a 100K...
In reply to Ian F:
Yeah, two cars out of how many?
rogerbvonceg wrote: Too bad the European makers can't get their maintainance and repair costs down. They've trolled for years on the notion that their kind of goodness comes at a cost, and then the Japanese came along and exposed their game. Fussy and expensive (or time-consuming) vehicles are fine as weekend toys, but for us workaday Joe's who need reliable transportation but also love cars, the Japanese have it wired. If you're judging all Japanese cars by one Lexus 400, you're missing the point. I've been a fan of European cars all my life, but there are just too many good choices from across the other pond.
I've owned dozens of Japanese cars-including the LS400, a couple Q's, Z-cars, Honda's, RX7s and a neat 2.5 Trans Am 510. Wired? perhaps, but certainly not exclusive. My domestic vehicles have racked up far higher trouble free miles ,as have my Volvos. Considering my Buick GN purchased new rang up nearly 150K miles under increased boost and never needed repair-why drive some boring heap(Toyota, I'm talking to you)? My Benzs have also been able to rack up impressive miles. My 2000 S-class was sold to my friend with 140K on it and he currently has well over 200K with simple maintenence items and an AC hose as his only repairs. The current Benz cruiser offed to my sister, is at 180K and still is solid as an anvil with over the road manners the far east offerings can only dream about.
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