Scariest, most awesome race series of old?

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: Looking for: 1) "Production bodies" 2) Road Racing (tracks)

You changed the rules!

Definitely Trans Am and IMSA GTO then...

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: Obviously... Group B has to make the list. But if you had to come up with a Group B equivalent on road courses that actually DID exist, what would it be? Post pictures, arguments for the series you think of, and general specs of the awesome E36 M3 that was around in days of yore. Looking for: 1) "Production bodies" 2) Road Racing (tracks)

Does Group B really count towards your requirements? They built very few street models. I mean by the same thing they made a few street Porsche 962s.

93EXCivic wrote:

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: Obviously... Group B has to make the list. But if you had to come up with a Group B equivalent on road courses that actually DID exist, what would it be? Post pictures, arguments for the series you think of, and general specs of the awesome E36 M3 that was around in days of yore. Looking for: 1) "Production bodies" 2) Road Racing (tracks)

Does Group B really count towards your requirements? They built very few street models. I mean by the same thing they made a few street Porsche 962s.

Sigh, i'll update the first post again. When i meant "Group B," i meant rally.

I'm trying to find the road race equivalent of Group B Rally.

A bit off topic, but I'm pretty sure that boat racing has had more fatalities per capita than any other form of motorsport.

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:

93EXCivic wrote:

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: Obviously... Group B has to make the list. But if you had to come up with a Group B equivalent on road courses that actually DID exist, what would it be? Post pictures, arguments for the series you think of, and general specs of the awesome E36 M3 that was around in days of yore. Looking for: 1) "Production bodies" 2) Road Racing (tracks)

Does Group B really count towards your requirements? They built very few street models. I mean by the same thing they made a few street Porsche 962s.

Sigh, i'll update the first post again. When i meant "Group B," i meant rally. I'm trying to find the road race equivalent of Group B Rally.

I would probably say Group 5 then.

Maroon92 wrote: For all out nuttiness, you cannot beat the Group 7/Can Am/Interseries days.

That's what I'm thinkin' of. Strap an 800hp engine to your butt and sit on a tub made out of material almost thick enough to be strong enough...

They did have a Group B road race series....

Unfortunately it didn't go anywhere, except to create the 959 and 288 GTO.

The 959 did eventually go road racing as the 961 at the 24hours of LeMans.

Maroon92 wrote: For all out nuttiness, you cannot beat the Group 7/Can Am/Interseries days. The Shadow is SIGNIFICANTLY smaller than the Panzer... If you want to know the Shadow...think go cart with a Chev v8... I would also argue that Formula 5000 had something going there in the early 70s as well. However, for ultimate go, stop, and turn, my vote is going to go to the Group C cars of 1982-1994. (technically, there was a Group B class for sports racing cars as well)

I saw the 917-30 race at Road Atlanta in '73. I don't think I've seen a car since then that was as fast down the back straight. It took years to break it's track record. I think it wasn't unitl the Nissan GTP car did it some 15 or so years later. Awesome car!

Speaking of the 961:

Making its first appearance at the May test for the 1986 24 Hours of Le Mans, the 961 was able to show its potential pace quickly by setting the tenth fastest lap time under the control of French driver René Metge.[1] The 961's time was not only quicker than the BMW M1 which was entered in the Group B category, was also faster than several C1 and C2 class prototypes.[3] At the race in June, Metge was joined by fellow Frenchman Claude Ballot-Léna[1] and the two were able to qualify the car 26th. Through dependability the 961 was able to climb through the field as the race progressed and eventually finished the race in seventh place, 47 laps behind the winning factory 962C.[4]

Later in 1986, the 961 was moved to the United States and entered in the Camel GT Championship's final round at Daytona International Speedway. The car was reclassified once again by International Motor Sports Association, this time being entered in the GTP category alongside sports prototypes like the 962. Drivers Kees Nierop of Canada and Günter Steckkönig of Germany were assigned to the car. The 961 however struggled with the banked turns of the Daytona circuit. The 961's Dunlop tyres were pushed beyond their limits and suffered several blowouts while the car was at full speed.[1] This slowed the 961's overall pace down before it eventually finished the race in 24th position.[5]

Porsche continued to develop the 961 into the 1987 season where it was prepared once more for Le Mans. The car was repainted in the colors of Rothmans to match the scheme used by the factory 962Cs.[1] Performance fell from the previous year as the 961 earned only the 16th fastest lap in the May test session.[6] Swiss driver Claude Haldi was assigned to partner René Metge, but the two were later joined by Kees Nierop whose 962C had been destroyed in a qualifying accident. Although the 961 managed to run as high as 11th overall in the race, Kees Nierop crashed the car after suffering a gearbox problem. The car was stopped and retired after it caught fire as Nierop attempted to return to the pit lane.[1]

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: What would be the "production-based" (and i use the term loosely) equivalent?

You already covered it, Killer Bs, nuff said

I know you want road course equivalent, but once you factor in trees, mountain sides, spectators 2 inches from your bumper, boost gauges reading in bars, multiple methods on the same engine for boosting or compound boosting tiny engines, with 1-2 people on board, I think all forms of road racing while dangerous for the drivers and scary as hell, don't hold a flame to the Bs in terms of shear danger for the spectators as well...

Alway boggles my mind to see these things with a single roll hoop BELOW the drivers head,no thanks I'll just watch.Same goes for the A and B mod autox cars,sure the chances of rolling is slim but the tech people should at least require your melon below the only hoop.

MG Bryan wrote:

I don't know what this is, but it's sweet

They are production bodies in that someone "produced" them

The nuttiness is unquestionable. Isle of Man, TT, side car racing.

Gearheadotaku wrote:

MG Bryan wrote:

I don't know what this is, but it's sweet

Can-Am. If you'd like to see more pretty pictures type "Lola Schkee" into your favorite search engine.

Can Am was awesome. Too bad it ended about 6 or so years before I was manufactured. I did write a 14 page rule book for a new Can Am series and actually had Jim Hall look over them and gave his stamp of approval. Speaking with him was one of the true high points of my life. Still have his cell number!

Scary? Any series where the upper third of the driver's body extended above the bodywork, with no rollover protection of course. Or seatbelts... Amazing, Hans Herrmann not only survived this crash, but is still living today.

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote: They are production bodies in that someone "produced" them The nuttiness is unquestionable. Isle of Man, TT, side car racing.

Oh yeah, that's even more nuts than Group B rally, same concept, paved roads, no harness, no roll bar, and not only are there trees, spectators, cliffs, etc. you also blast through town at 150MPH, and these are European towns, and its still going on today! GOOD CALL!

What too about the Dakar Rally, or the Baja?

In reply to Raze:

Thanks. I said it several posts back

a401cj wrote: In reply to Raze: Thanks. I said it several posts back

But you forgot to include pics

I change my answer to Isle of Man TT.

Don't forget modsports. Jag powered Escorts, Cosworths, Can Ams, there was even a Jag powered Anglia. Lots of Group B rally cars as well. Some of the widest rubber and bodywork in motor sports.

some pics

http://www.motorsport-fanatic.co.uk/combe-specialGT-assorted2.html

Joe Gearin wrote: No form of racing in my mind compares to the sheer insanity of the 20s and 30s board racers. Over 120mph on giant wooden tracks with no safety of any kind. Not road racing per se, but fantastically nutty!

I was going to post that. It was insane. They even ran motorcycles on the boards. Worse yet.

Regarding the above wood-track racers, yeah that's why

I said:

Scary? Any series where the upper third of the driver's body extended above the bodywork, with no rollover protection of course. Or seatbelts...

Okay. Tin tops and road racing. Road racing version of Gp.B Rally.

Only thing I could suggest is whatever FIA spec was used for the ETCC in the 1970s. Not as overpowered as Gp.B, but some pretty wild stuff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8UI4ShRfRE&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0AcLytMEIo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYLPzmRqrkQ&feature=related

I thought about FIA Group 5 in the 80s, but IMO those are silhouette cars.

Another thought would also be the current Australian V8 Supercars. Those things are awesome, in the non pop-culture use of the word.

Besides, give me an excuse to repost this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLkLtBkUVuo

iceracer wrote:

Joe Gearin wrote: No form of racing in my mind compares to the sheer insanity of the 20s and 30s board racers. Over 120mph on giant wooden tracks with no safety of any kind. Not road racing per se, but fantastically nutty!

I was going to post that. It was insane. They even ran motorcycles on the boards. Worse yet.

This is probably a repost as well, but since the subject came up..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPZY-MUx8qk