Searching for Passenger Mounted Mid Engine

Folks, this is an open invitation to tell me how bad I stink at searching

I just can't find a lot in the way of builds where someone deep-sixed the front passenger seat or foot-well area and plopped a longitudinal engine in its place. Heck, I can't find anyone giving their build the Previa treatment (engine under the front seats).

My only successful finds:

http://www.palatov.com/cars/d4gallery.html

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/side-winder/

It seems putting the engine behind the front seats is the common landing spot and I understand why that would be popular. But sometimes that configuration isn't practical, like on a really short wheelbase (which is the reason behind the D4 above).

There are all kinds of tricks to get the engine behind the front seats, but lets say a person is determined to sit next to or on top of the engine...Have you found any builds attempting this or can you suggest decent search terms (please at least try the term before posting a dead-end, I have plenty of those terms)?

I know heat management and center of gravity are big design hurdles, but go ahead and tell me anyhow (you who know you will, will, won't ya)

I'm really looking for paths to builds and first hand experiences if you have any to share.

My pipe-dream is similar to Sidewinder above, but set further back with a super short drive-shaft to an offset solid axle. Maybe an inline 6 with turbo on the outside

Please let me add to my "Previa" comment: there are obviously factory COE examples (aka A100), but I haven't found conversions to COE.

It seems to me that a conversion to a COE configuration is pretty unlikely, due to height dimesnions.

All of the COE configured vehicles I can think of (including the Previa) have a very high roofline. By the time you have an engine (even a small one, like a rotary), headers, piping, and stick a driver on top, you've got to raise the roof (unless the driver is in a prone position laying on his belly).

I remember the Side Winder. Still one of my favorite Challenge builds.

This is the first thing that came to my mind.

In reply to Burrito Enthusiast:

I heard a story yesterday about someone who plopped an SBC into the passenger seat area of a 510. Most likely a Southern California car. Might have been autocrossed in the 80's or 90's.

Paging Kevlarcorolla. Tom to the forum please.

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/mid-engined-awd-geo-ice-racer/41954/page1/

was there not a datsun with an aluminum v8 in one of the first challenges?

warpedredneck wrote: was there not a datsun with an aluminum v8 in one of the first challenges?

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/side-winder/

In reply to David S. Wallens:

That same link was posted in the first post.

It's tough getting old, huh??

My early 60's Econoline van had a 6-cylinder engine between the front seats.

I loved reading the article in the mag about that Z600. I remember wanting it to be a book length article though. Don't remember if it was in GRM or Classic Motorsports.

Mid engine MGB? I think there was also an epic build thread on this board.

http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?41,1540381,page=34

for kit cars there's the MEV Atomic, but it's RHD and sticks a literbike engine where the passenger seat (of a RHD car) normally goes, and I can't imagine freight trying to get one into the US would be very cheap. it would be fun though!

Fantastic info fellas! After seeing these examples I know I need to hone my search skills better. To add to the mix, I found a class of track cars somewhat relevent even though they keep a center seated position.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermodified_racing

I've heard the name, but wasn't familiar with the chassis design.

series8217 wrote: I heard a story yesterday about someone who plopped an SBC into the passenger seat area of a 510. Most likely a Southern California car. Might have been autocrossed in the 80's or 90's.

junked wrote: http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/side-winder/

Ahh, it was that one. Thought it was an SBC from the story I heard, but I probably just heard "GM V8" and a$$umed.

if I wanted to do a true Cab over, I would probably use a Subaru engine. With a dry sump (like a Porsche) and the proper exhaust system, you could probably get it pretty low

There is also the Kiesel Sprite.

http://www.racingbeat.com/mazda/performance/features/rotary-racer-jeff-kiesel.html

mad_machine wrote: if I wanted to do a true Cab over, I would probably use a Subaru engine. With a dry sump (like a Porsche) and the proper exhaust system, you could probably get it pretty low

I'm not convinced.

I've spent a lot of time with Subarus. Yes, they are lower profile than a V configuration. But they are not THAT small.

When I sit in the average sedan, I have only a couple inches of clearance between my head and the roof. Less than 2" if I am wearing a helmet.

Seat height is 9-11" on average. Let's say you could reduce that to 2" (which is optimistic at best).

You've only got a total of maybe 10" max height without raising the roof, or lowering the clearance under the car significantly.

The roofline of the Previa sits 69" high. A sedan (like the aforementioned 510) is more like 55" high.

You're missing more than a foot.

NOHOME wrote: Mid engine MGB? I think there was also an epic build thread on this board. http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?41,1540381,page=34

Yep that's the latest evolution of loosecannon's e-mod car.

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/build-projects-and-project-cars/scca-emod-mgb-gt-v12-build/26822/page36/

BTW the incredibly short driveshaft distance killed that particular layout. Ultra-short driveshafts and live axles don't mix!

Smokey Yunick built this:

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

THe STP Indy cars had a side-engine configuration. They used a turbine. PLEASE USE A TURBINE!

I immediately thought about the carbon honda.... but I see that I have been well beaten to the punch. I would expect nothing less from those here.

I've done 2 side mounted builds,the geo ice racer and a scratch build autox car both using bike engines.The bike engine is very well suited to this application especially with a chain drive. As mentioned a live axle will make it tough to pkg and have a driveshaft last very long.I'd take a very hard look at going irs to avoid that.

One thing is for sure after driving those 2 cars there is a huge difference having that mass centralized both fore/aft and side to side.

Pick the smallest lightest engine you can to make it both easier to fit and keep the overall weight down.

So whats the use for this thing??