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Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
9/6/15 7:29 p.m.

So mid engine swap, I realize I need to retain the original bellhousing and clutch.

Well, here's the beautiful part. Removed engine is frozen up, main reason for replacement.

the next wonderful part? two bolts to remove the bellhousing are behind the flywheel.

Can't spin the frickin engine. Pull the head, of the 6 pistons, 2 are at TDC, 2 are full of penetrating oil, 2 are dry.

12lb sledge isn't moving a thing when pounding the exposed pistons.

grr....

fasted58
fasted58 UltimaDork
9/6/15 7:31 p.m.

Moar bigger sledgehammer?

EvanB
EvanB GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
9/6/15 7:40 p.m.

Build a bonfire under it?

dmyntti
dmyntti Reader
9/6/15 7:41 p.m.

Can you drop the oil pan and unbolt the rods. Try to hit the pistons from the back side and to remove all the pistons that aren't completely frozen and see if it allows you to rotate the crank enough. Should be easier to move one piston at a time.

Toyman01
Toyman01 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
9/6/15 7:42 p.m.

If you don't want to salvage the engine, shatter the pistons or cut the rods.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
9/6/15 7:49 p.m.

No need to save the engine... that may be my option

Engine is laying on under my lift right now on the floor.

Knurled
Knurled GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
9/6/15 7:52 p.m.

I want to know what engine this is where two of the bellhousing bolts are behind the flywheel.

I have had to remove pans, find the stuck rod, then loosen the nuts so I could break the crank free. Sometimes this requires turning the nuts with an air chisel because the rods don't always sieze at BDC/TDC when you can get a socket on them...

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess MegaDork
9/6/15 7:55 p.m.

Bigger breaker bar? My friend did a Toyota V6 in a Camry that was seized (oil change place left the drain plug out.) He put a really big breaker bar on the crank and went after it.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
9/6/15 8:01 p.m.

It's a 1946 GMC 228 Straight Six. No crank bolt thanks to the hand crank

The 53 270 replacing it is the same way.

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic UltimaDork
9/6/15 8:06 p.m.

I/We need pictures to visualize these hidden bell bolts.

You could try heat, like hit with some ATF and then the HF flamethrower while a helper works the breaker bar.

Knurled
Knurled GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
9/6/15 8:07 p.m.

Ooooooh, I think I see now. So it has the deal where you are supposed to remove the clutch and flywheel through an access hole in the bottom?

You may have to flip that sucker over, pull the pan, and pry on counterweights, if you can't hammer whatever is stuck out so it can rotate freely.

TR7
TR7 New Reader
9/6/15 8:08 p.m.

I have had good luck using vinegar for a couple days and then oil a couple more. And instead of brute force used an air hammer to vibrate everything lose. I think the big thing here was patience.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
9/6/15 8:10 p.m.
Kenny_McCormic wrote: I/We need pictures to visualize these hidden bell bolts. You could try heat, like hit with some ATF and then the HF flamethrower while a helper works the breaker bar.

These bad boys: Hidden bolts at 10 and 3

OHSCrifle
OHSCrifle GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
9/6/15 8:13 p.m.

When brute force doesn't work, use more.

chiodos
chiodos HalfDork
9/6/15 8:43 p.m.

What if you throw it on an engine stand, turn it upside down and remove the pan and fill the bottom of the cylinders with atf, wait 3 days and try again

petegossett
petegossett GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
9/6/15 8:53 p.m.
EvanB wrote: Build a bonfire under it?

This is your answer. Seriously. I knew a guy who pulled a hit-n-miss engine out of a creek, built a bonfire, got it red-hot and it freed up...he had it running while he was telling me the story.

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy PowerDork
9/6/15 9:20 p.m.

The cover on the bottom of the bellhousing needs to come off, so you can unbolt the pressure plate...which you won't be able to do because you can't turn the engine and the bolts at the top will be inaccessible...Never mind.

Torch.

patgizz
patgizz GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
9/6/15 9:30 p.m.

sledge on side of block at the bores until cast iron blows up and pistons are flopping in mid air while you spin the crank?

Dusterbd13
Dusterbd13 UltraDork
9/6/15 9:42 p.m.
patgizz wrote: sledge on side of block at the bores until cast iron blows up and pistons are flopping in mid air while you spin the crank?

Do this. Please. And bolt a starter to it to spin it quickly. Take videos.

Coolest thing I have seen in a while was an sr20 with a hole in the block big enough to stick a soda can through running on three cylinders with the chunk of rod poking out the hole intermittently. Just wild.

daeman
daeman Reader
9/6/15 10:03 p.m.

Try rotating the engine opposite to its operating rotation? I've had a couple of locked engines that unlocked when being spun backwards. Usually works if a rod has broken and locked up against something in the bottom end.

Vinegar in the bores can work if its a rust issue. Sulfamic acid also works.

Are you able to make a tool to go into the end of the crank so you can either use a big bar or impact gun on it?

Best thing would be to get the oil pan off and see why it's seized, that'll give you a better idea of how to try and free it up.

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic UltimaDork
9/6/15 11:28 p.m.

Sorry, I'm still confused how the flywheel is hiding bolts for a part that needs to be removed in order to remove the flywheel. Sure you aren't missing the bellhousing parting line under the grime and looking at the block/rear plate line instead (if so equipped)? I've made dumber mistakes before.

Edit: OK, now I think I get it, forgot how old bells often only cover half flywheel. So it's supposed to come apart, in order of removal, Trans>>flywheel shield>PP/disc>flywheel>bell? In that case I'd do what oldopelguy suggested.

oldopelguy
oldopelguy SuperDork
9/6/15 11:34 p.m.

Remove oil pan.

Remove rod bolts.

Remove main cap bolts.

Remove crankshaft with flywheel attached.

Profit.

Slant sixes are the same way, and I have had to do it more than once for a locked up engine.

pres589
pres589 UberDork
9/6/15 11:56 p.m.

Obviously time for an LS swap.

44Dwarf
44Dwarf UltraDork
9/7/15 4:14 a.m.

Saw-all the last crank throw and or rod cap.
I've had to use a 7ft bar more then once in the fly wheel teeth and braced on the bell housing to nudge stubborn motors..

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
9/7/15 9:31 a.m.
Kenny_McCormic wrote: Sorry, I'm still confused how the flywheel is hiding bolts for a part that needs to be removed in order to remove the flywheel. Sure you aren't missing the bellhousing parting line under the grime and looking at the block/rear plate line instead (if so equipped)? I've made dumber mistakes before. Edit: OK, now I think I get it, forgot how old bells often only cover half flywheel. So it's supposed to come apart, in order of removal, Trans>>flywheel shield>PP/disc>flywheel>bell? In that case I'd do what oldopelguy suggested.

Does this hotlinked pic help?

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