Might have been hashed already.
I can find images for a kit car called the Smythe G3F. Built from Jetta diesel donor platform.
I can not find any driving results. Is the car for real or just a concept?
Might have been hashed already.
I can find images for a kit car called the Smythe G3F. Built from Jetta diesel donor platform.
I can not find any driving results. Is the car for real or just a concept?
My understanding is that he's in the process of putting the prototype together. IIRC he's got a bit more info on his Facebook page and puts up regular updates there.
Not a lot of info on his facebook page either. It's random and you're jumping into the middle of the conversations so you don't really know what anyone is talking about.
I like the looks tho
I remember this from when it was an FFR project.
I recall something to the effect that this is the brother and former partner of FFR doing his own thing.
So lets go with "Vapor-ware" for now
I really havee no idea if a good Jetta canbe had for 5k, and I know for a fact that paint alone is 5k in this part of the planet, but it still looked like a smoking deal for a very fun car.
From the Facebook profile:
Mark Smith, founder of Factory Five Racing, Inc. created Smyth Performance to serve VW tuners and builders who want a green performance car. VR6, 1.8T or TDI, the 99-04 Jetta transforms right here with our mid-engine sports car kit for 10 grand.
There's a thread about it around here somewhere...
EDIT: Here it is.
Cars's don't just hatch from eggs - the development process for a new vehicle is a huge undertaking. Mark Smith is doing this on his own, while starting a new company at the same time. Calling the G3F project 'vaporware' isn't exactly fair - the prototype car isn't completed yet, but it exists, and beta car projects will begin next year. Mark announced the idea for the project little less than a year and a half ago, and has been documenting the process and soliciting ideas and advice from enthusiasts in the VW & Kit Car communities the entire way.
I have been watching the progress of this car on Facebook and I have no doubt he'll get the prototype finished... eventually... However, IMHO, he's spending too much time on the looks of the car where as I think he should have developed the rolling chassis first, then wrapped a body around it. To my knowledge, he hasn't even touched the electronics yet. Plus, after he gets the prototype running, I'm betting he'll have to do a second one (at least) in order to develop the actual "kit" aspect. So I wouldn't expect to see a kit for sale for at least another 3-4 years.
To me, the "vaporware" part is his delusion that he'll be able to sell kits for $10K. I just don't see how that will be possible.
As far as a fun mid-engine TDI, I have more faith that hausofguru.com will have his MkIV TDI-into-a-Fiero kit developed well before the Smythe car and at a much cheaper price point.
nderwater wrote: Cars's don't just hatch from eggs - the development process for a new vehicle is a huge undertaking. Mark Smith is doing this on his own, while starting a new company at the same time. Calling the G3F project 'vaporware' isn't exactly fair - the prototype car isn't completed yet, but it exists, and beta car projects will begin next year. Mark announced the idea for the project little less than a year and a half ago, and has been documenting the process and soliciting ideas and advice from enthusiasts in the VW & Kit Car communities the entire way.
To echo these thoughts, I recall he has an active Twitter feed too, offering lots of updates on his progress.
I personally think it will happen, and can't wait! I'd love to build one as a three season DD.
nderwater wrote: Cars's don't just hatch from eggs - the development process for a new vehicle is a huge undertaking. Mark Smith is doing this on his own, while starting a new company at the same time. Calling the G3F project 'vaporware' isn't exactly fair - the prototype car isn't completed yet, but it exists, and beta car projects will begin next year. Mark announced the idea for the project little less than a year and a half ago, and has been documenting the process and soliciting ideas and advice from enthusiasts in the VW & Kit Car communities the entire way.
"Vaporware" is not necessarily a derogative term. It means that the concept is tossed out in order to see if there is any interest.
What it also means is that I can't buy it even though it is presented as ready for market. The posted delivery dates for this kit were september of this year.
So lets hope that it is just delayed due to more potential for development. However I am familiar with what happens when cashflow does not start on an expected date but development cost continue to acrue.
NOHOME wrote: What it also means is that I can't buy it even though it is presented as ready for market. The posted delivery dates for this kit were september of this year. So lets hope that it is just delayed due to more potential for development. However I am familiar with what happens when cashflow does not start on an expected date but development cost continue to acrue.
I think Mark's enthusiasm hasn't waned, but I also think he was more than a little optimistic about the development time.
Hasn't this thing been in the works for almost 3 years?
And why a TDI engine?! Don't get me wrong, I love TDI's, and I love the way this car looks and could perform. I just don't like them together. TDI's can make some good power and still get good MPG, but the thought of a diesel in this car makes me sad.
Inb4 Some points out the Audi and Puegot racers. Because hand built race diesel =/= mass market diesel fun.
Drewsifer wrote: And why a TDI engine?! Don't get me wrong, I love TDI's, and I love the way this car looks and could perform. I just don't like them together. TDI's can make some good power and still get good MPG, but the thought of a diesel in this car makes me sad.
Because Mark is primarily building this car for himself and this is what he wants - a lightweight 2-seat mid-engine sports car that gets 50+ mpg. Since the mounting points for the engine are basically the same, a kit version could easily fit either a 1.8t or a VR6.
Does the R10 TDI make you sad too? 
Go Green Go Fast hence G3F. Thats the reason for the tdi option.
The prototype is essentially done and beta molds are currently being built by Mark himself at this time. His original vendor for the molds backed out. I believe he's making 25-30 beta kits before production of the final kit. I think he has 25 deposits for the beta kits already and the beta kits should be completed by mid 2011. Input from the beta kits will help determine the final production kits. Alot of input and beta kits are being built from Factory Five Racing customers. This should be a nice kit when completed and expect the same quality as FFR kits.
Hi all,
not usually on the site posting but love GRM. the story on the car is best told by the ffcars.com thread called "mark smith...time to talk". The project scope haschanged with the projects success to be honest. When it was a cool little cut jetta for me and maybe 5 guys that wanted a diesel sports car it would have been done in a year....but with 33 deposits and the potential to be an actual business you can imagine that the quality of the work had to be raised a few notches.
I drastically changed the style of the car into more of a daily driver...a good move for the existing customers. After Dave voiced a complaint about the car's similarity to the FFR gtm I changed it for good and the G3F you see now on Facebook was born. Pretty straight forward stuff.
Re the diesel I just have to say that 8/10 of the customers(people that have parted with deposits...you see they have the real say) are going tdi...go figure....a huge group of diesel enthusiasts that really had nothing fun to build until this year. So thouugh it is not everybody's choice.....it really is the most popular powertrain for the car. Go ahead and run the other engines...that little 1.8T is hard to pass up....but the diesel rules the roost in this project for the launch.
The first ffr roadster took me about three months to transform into a production kit from a prototype back in 1995 when i was a solo engineer rookie before the FFR we know now was shipping kits....lets just say that I know a bit more about how to do it well now:)
There are always going to be a couple nay sayers in any new start....I remember those that predicted I couldn't make it in 1995 with a fuel injected FFR mustang based kit.....but in the end I befriended them and brought a few over to the new ideas we had about fun kit cars that performed....same thing now but with a jetta....
A diesel kit REALLY doesn't fit the uber high performance FFR brand that I guard carefully as the owner of FFR. So even though I am no longer active in the managemant of FFR, I care about my "baby" still.
The Smyth car is fun and a great way to do a daily driver 60 mpg mid engine sports car for 15 grand...have fun with it....cuz THAT is what it is alll about....
cheers guys. I won't be such a stranger.
mark smith
facebook.com/smythperformance
Mark - it's always fun to see your latest build photos in my FB news feed. Thanks, and good luck with the project!
nderwater wrote: Mark - it's always fun to see your latest build photos in my FB news feed. Thanks, and good luck with the project!
2nd that.
Waiting for the day I can build a kit, FFR or G3F. Too bad the Spyder is discontinued.
dDid not expect that!...
Thanks Mark. Looking forward to seeing one in the flesh.
This is the first I have heard of this project but I think it is very cool with a lot of potential. I can't even imagine what all it would take to get something like this developed, put together and marketed but good luck to you Mark. The industry needs more people like you.
As the first beta-kit builder of a Smyth Performance G3F, I have to tell ya, this project is ON! Mark and I are cutting apart my Jetta donor car on Sunday, June 19 (great Father's Day present for me!) at my house in Jupiter, FL. Anyone interested is welcome to come see how it goes. Just PM me for directions.
I'm blogging the experience of this first G3F build at Smyth G3F Build Blog if anyone's interested.
The G3F is designed to accept any engine and tranny found in a Mk IV Jetta, including all gas and diesel variants. My car will be a TDI. I'm hoping for 50-60 mpg in a cool daily driver that should be pretty darn sprightly in performance. Other Beta builders are planning 1.8T and V6 builds. This should be some fun!
John Phillips
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