fast_eddie_72 wrote: I know 'round here, good winter tires pop up on craigslist. Might be worth a look.
I picked up a set of studded Nokian Hakkapeliitta 4 snows 2 years ago... I paid $125 for all 4 mounted on honda steelies... one tire had a flat... I pumped it up found the "object" removed it, and installed a plug - all good, and I have REAL snow traction in my little All-Trac Corolla
oldeskewltoy wrote:fast_eddie_72 wrote: I know 'round here, good winter tires pop up on craigslist. Might be worth a look.I picked up a set of studded Nokian Hakkapeliitta 4 snows 2 years ago... I paid $125 for all 4 mounted on honda steelies... one tire had a flat... I pumped it up found the "object" removed it, and installed a plug - all good, and I have REAL snow traction in my little All-Trac Corolla
studded tires are illegal in most states though....and they're terrible in dry conditions. Epic awesome in ice and icy snow though!
Hmmm...although I see the benefit of snow tires, I really have never had an issue with A/S tires. Ever. Not gonna lie, I'd love to have a set of snows for my Saturn for the Cleveland winters but I just don't want to spend the dime for them and I have nowhere to store extra sets. On all the cars I've driven I really think that a big part of it goes back on the driver. There is a certain skill needed to safely drove and maneuver a vehicle in the snow and icy conditions. That being said, how other people drive on the road also plays a factor in safety. While snow tires clearly kick ass, not everyone can or wants to swap tires with the seasons, whatever the ultimate reason may be. So what are some good A/s tires you've used through the seasons? Are they all the same level of suck or are there better tread patterns and brands out there? Especially with beater cars, its so much easier to slap on the most affordable all seasons, hone the driving skills through the crazy unplowed streets and be a good driver. On that note, if anyone wants to donate some snows my way, I'd be more than happy to try them out this winter...its already began snowing here ;)
procker wrote: Hmmm...although I see the benefit of snow tires, I really have never had an issue with A/S tires. Ever.
Loads of people have never had an issue with their iPod and the little plug in deal-e-o that makes it "fill the room with sound". But I'll stick with my AR LST/2s, Denon POA 2400 and Technics SL 1200. They both make sound and they both work just fine. But they're not the same. Difference is, listening to E36 M3ty sounding music won't ever kill you.
fast_eddie_72 wrote: I know 'round here, good winter tires pop up on craigslist. Might be worth a look.
Sometimes you get lucky. I searched CL in my area and found that either the tires for sale were either junk, or they were already mounted on wheels that wouldn't fit my car, the seller wanted waaay too much for the combo and they wouldn't sell them seperate.
I finally coughed up the dough for 4 brand new tires this week. One of the local tire shops was having a sale. I got four 175/70r14 snow tires for my Neon for $332 (mounted, balanced, etc)
I've had all season tires on cars in the winter and it sucks. atleast around here it does.
All season tires suck in all seasons. They are a compromise. If you use snow tires after using all seasons you will never go back.
I just picked up a set of 4 barley used studded snows for $100 a couple weeks back for my 924s. I can not wait to try it this winter. They take all the "fun" out of driving on dry pavement but here in the NE it is a compromise I can live with. And I have had a Jones to try some of the Ice racing that they do around here.
The only time all season tires have been acceptable is on my expedition.
There is no "vs." in this argument. It's not a fair fight. That's how superior snow tires are to all seasons in the winter. Once you get them, you will never understand why you gingerly drove your car around like it was on ice skates every time it snows. And even when it doesn't snow, they stay soft enough to provide some sort of grip in an emergency situation.
I know snow tires are great and all, but before blindly recommending them over a decent normal tire shouldn't someone have asked EvanB where he lives? If you're in the mountains of Colorado, yes, get snow tires (I wouldn't be surprised if they're required), but even in the Detroit area millions of people get by without snow tires. If you're somewhere that only gets a significant snow fall once or twice a year, don't worry about it. Since he uses the car for delivering pizzas I would tend to blindly recommend snow tires too, but where he lives seems like a big part of whether or not he really needs snow tires.
I tried to check out EvanB's profile to see where he lives but it wasn't working. If his location is common knowledge and I'm just clueless, please let me know.
Bob
No way. That is an anomaly, not a norm. I tried to drive my M3 on RE01's in barely enough snow to cover the road, and I didn't make it up the street - and it took me nearly 1/2 hour to get back up the driveway.
Normal/good all seasons are merely ok in snow. Summer tires are suicidal. Winter tires rock.
Javelin wrote: Yup. Tire Rack did a test where even the Summer tire beat out the All-Season in the snow. All-Season tires are freaking pathetic. Oh, and the snow tire beat the All-Season in the dry sun as well.
I drove my ti for the past 5 years in winter on Summer Tyres.. this included getting home from work when a Major snowstorm hit. Granted, I have the Limited slip from the Winter package, but I was still on summer tyres. I drove 15 miles and only stock 50 feet from my driveway when I could not negotiate a snow berm from a plow.
My C900 runs all seasons.. it clawed through last years snow with no issues.
While I will agree that substantial snow requires snow tyres for optimum performance and safety, We do not get enough snow down her at the very southern Tip of NJ for me to consider buying them.. or even taking the time to switch them over.
Plows are out during the storm and most roads are clear within 24 hours after the storm.
njansenv wrote: No way. That is an anomaly, not a norm. I tried to drive my M3 on RE01's in barely enough snow to cover the road, and I didn't make it up the street - and it took me nearly 1/2 hour to get back up the driveway. Normal/good all seasons are merely ok in snow. Summer tires are suicidal. Winter tires rock.Javelin wrote: Yup. Tire Rack did a test where even the Summer tire beat out the All-Season in the snow. All-Season tires are freaking pathetic. Oh, and the snow tire beat the All-Season in the dry sun as well.
An Re-01 is not a normal Summer tire man. They used normal people summer tires with tread.
I will put it forward that SNOW tires aren't required in most of the US because you have plows. Ice tires on the other hand? That polished, slippery-er than ice hard packed snow they leave behind? Yea, ice tires.
Beyond that, I don't think people are listening to the fact that ice/snow tires have significantly better dry/wet pavement performance than all seasons below freezing.
I've driven in Alberta winters with all-seasons (-50*C weather at times, constant polished icy roads with the occasional foot or two dump once a month). It's not like you are going to die and spin out of control (and this was in Fireflies/Sprints), but winter tires made winter driving that much more enjoyable. You won't be that asshat that causes everyone to miss a light because it took you 3 minutes to get across an intersection from a standstill.
If you do go with one of the newer all seasons (Hankook and Kumho make them I believe) that are specifically designed to include "winter" in their all season design, expect a shorter lifespan. The fact is, I can get 195/60R15 winter tires studded, mounted and balanced from walmart for $400. 175/70R13 sized for an economy car from the 80's/90's? $300 or less (in FRIEKIN CANADA). There is so little reason to not do it unless your snow/ice doesn't stay on the ground past a day or two. If you consistently have snow/ice on the ground, they should be a purchase you make.
I had snow tires for a few years and I wore them out very quickly and they had a huge amount of tread squirm on dry pavement, which was at least half the winter. I have gone to AS tires as my winter tires and have not had a problem. Both the AS and snow tires perform great for the first year and then they fall off the next winter. I don't like the idea of paying extra for superior snow traction just to lose it after a couple of seasons. The AS are not as good as the snow tires, but I would like to see a test done after two winters to see which tire has lost more performance. I'd bet under my conditions the AS would lose less performance than the snow tires. I drive a fwd Neon 60 miles north of Detroit. Your mileage may differ. :-)
My experience with all-seasons, on two different vehicles, were, they work fairly well on plowed roads the first winter from new with full tread deph.. After that, forget it. My Blizzaks will be going on as soon as the snow starts to accumulate. I hate studs because of the noise and the poor traction on dry pavement.
mad_machine wrote: I drove my ti for the past 5 years in winter on Summer Tyres.. this included getting home from work when a Major snowstorm hit. Granted, I have the Limited slip from the Winter package, but I was still on summer tyres. I drove 15 miles and only stock 50 feet from my driveway when I could not negotiate a snow berm from a plow. My C900 runs all seasons.. it clawed through last years snow with no issues. While I will agree that substantial snow requires snow tyres for optimum performance and safety, We do not get enough snow down her at the very southern Tip of NJ for me to consider buying them.. or even taking the time to switch them over. Plows are out during the storm and most roads are clear within 24 hours after the storm.
It's not your ability to nurse your car along and plan for the limited grip you have, but your inability to plan for the knob who can't drive in the snow and isn't being as cautiious as you are that makes them worth it.
I won't disagree with you. Generally though, unless I get stuck at work when the storm comes.. I stay home till the roads are clear.
If I have to go out to the store, I jump on the mountain Bike.. that thing is great in the snow
Schmidlap wrote: I tried to check out EvanB's profile to see where he lives but it wasn't working. If his location is common knowledge and I'm just clueless, please let me know.
I guess I just assumed that because he's even asking about snow tires, it's because he lives in a place that gets more than a little snow.
It's not just about the snow - regular tires are hard as hockey pucks below zero. Winter tires stay grippy when it gets cold, which translates to better stopping on bare pavement too.
Javelin wrote: Yup. Tire Rack did a test where even the Summer tire beat out the All-Season in the snow. All-Season tires are freaking pathetic. Oh, and the snow tire beat the All-Season in the dry sun as well.
Link?
I don't doubt that has happened, but in general summer tires are absolutely the worst possible thing to drive on in the snow. I certainly would never recommend them to someone.
If you live in Florida or Southern California there is no need for winter tires.
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