Mini Cooper is pretty close to your pricing (the new ones start at 28K), but you might be able to find a leftover 2024 for a good deal as I believe the 2025 is a new platform for them.
Depending on your needs, if you want to go full bottom of the bucket, Mitsubishi mirage, you could be under 20K for that one.
budget_bandit said:In reply to John Welsh :
i am really impressed with how good that looks for an econobox...those bronze wheels are nice
$950 more gets you an Initial D-esque white/black two-tone
Yesterday saw me drive the mazda3 (not it. It got cramped somehow), the carolla hatch (really liked it!) And test sit in the elantra/kona/some other one.
Wife wants to be more involved now, which is actually kinda cool to me.
Tonight is hyundai/kia night.
Due diligence. But I really liked the carolla at first blush.
If you want longevity, the Mazda 3 2.5 and 6 speed auto has been around for years more or less unchanged and I've heard several people putting 400k without even changing the trans fluid. It's a wet clutch auto, no CVT stuff to worry about.
I get they feel cramped though.
CyberEric said:If you want longevity, the Mazda 3 2.5 and 6 speed auto has been around for years more or less unchanged and I've heard several people putting 400k without even changing the trans fluid. It's a wet clutch auto, no CVT stuff to worry about.
I get they feel cramped though.
Did they use the same drivetrain in the cx-30 and CX-5
In reply to Dusterbd13 :
Yep, that's the same 2.5/6-speed traditional auto they have been using basically since 2014 with minor changes over the years across the lineup. It's stout and dependable. There were a couple hiccups over the years, but they have all been worked out by now.
According to a popular/former toyota technician on YT (Car Care Nut), he said that Toyota's CVTs weren't an issue he came across. Also anecdotally, when you scour the internet for people complaining about Toyota CVTs (which basically Corollas and Corolla Crosses) taking a dump on them, there aren't many complaints. Considering the Corolla(s) are some of the best selling cars around (they sold 232k in 2024), I'd figure there would be massive outcry if they had issues. I know one person who has a CVT powered Corolla and its got 100k+ miles and its doing fine.
+1 to Tony's comment about the Mazda. They drive great in my opinion.
In addition to their issues, I just don't like the way CVTs drive. But if I were to own one, it would be the Toyota CVT. I'll acknowledge that I haven't driven a Corolla with one. I've driven a Hybrid RAV4 and Prius, both with CVTs. Not sure if it's the same as what is in the lastest Corolla. They were ok. I respect the Car Care Nut's opinion. He seems to know his stuff.
I just think the Mazdas feel slightly more "special" than the Toyota equivalents. I get the packaging concerns though. The c-pillars in that hatchback 3 are huge too.
Interested to see what you think of the Korean options. Do they still make an Elantra hatch?
CyberEric said:In addition to their issues, I just don't like the way CVTs drive. But if I were to own one, it would be the Toyota CVT. I'll acknowledge that I haven't driven a Corolla with one. I've driven a Hybrid RAV4 and Prius, both with CVTs. Not sure if it's the same as what is in the lastest Corolla. They were ok. I respect the Car Care Nut's opinion. He seems to know his stuff.
The Hybrid CVTs are completely different animals.
CyberEric said:+1 to Tony's comment about the Mazda. They drive great in my opinion.
In addition to their issues, I just don't like the way CVTs drive. But if I were to own one, it would be the Toyota CVT. I'll acknowledge that I haven't driven a Corolla with one. I've driven a Hybrid RAV4 and Prius, both with CVTs. Not sure if it's the same as what is in the lastest Corolla. They were ok. I respect the Car Care Nut's opinion. He seems to know his stuff.
I just think the Mazdas feel slightly more "special" than the Toyota equivalents. I get the packaging concerns though. The c-pillars in that hatchback 3 are huge too.
Interested to see what you think of the Korean options. Do they still make an Elantra hatch?
I just want to throw in my last 2 cents here, but I was stuck in a Corolla rental when I went to FL not too long ago for vacation and I think the iteration current CVT drives pretty well. (with the physical 1st gear). In normal driving, you don't really notice anything different.
I disliked the torque steer in the Hyundai Elantra and Kia Soul when compared to the Mazda 3.
My vote is for the 3 and use S-Plan pricing to buy it at dealer invoice
On the Koreans...
Closest thing to a Hyundai hatch is the Kona or the cheaper rental special Venue. Those are more CUVs than cars, but the line is a bit blurred these days. There's still the regular Elantra, but that's also a CVT car, I believe (could be wrong). The N-Line has the dry clutch DCT which I would avoid. The full hog Elantra N has the way better wet clutch DCT and a manual option.
Kia has the Soul and the Niro, and then it's CUVs after that. Then there’s the K4... that's a sedan. A very homely sedan, at that.
In reply to RyanGreener (Forum Supporter) :
That's nice to hear.
In reply to Tony Sestito :
Wow, I didn't realize the Koreans offer basically no hatches anymore. Bummer. I kinda liked the looks of the last gen Elantra hatch.
Tonight was Korean night.
Elantra seat boaters killed it. Kona was way too space age for me and tbe wife. Too many screens, etc.
However, the soul lx we drove, we really really liked. Way more than I expected. Its on the short list.
So, we'll get the mazdas next week. I'm going to have to do a learn me thread on the carolla and the soul, as they are short listed.
When I think hatchback, only one thing comes to mind:
Dodge Charger Daytona
For real, though, your list is solid so far, but I think you should also include the Subarus (Impreza and Outback) in the shopping list. Very solid cars with good interiors.
My daughters 2019 Fit CVT was a medical courier's car for the first 160k miles, now 190k. I swapped the CVT fluid when we got it, no issues. I highly recommend the Fit, we also have a 2nd gen 5 speed and a rear sway bar, w/185k miles, it is more fun. Both get >40 mpg highway
In reply to petemc53555 :
Does Honda still make the fit? I honestly have not seen any reference to brand new ones.
The Fit, no longer available, sort of morphed into Hondas smallest SUV, the HRV, starting at $25k
Ahh. OK. Thanks John!
And this has been an actually enjoyable endeavor, yall. Mostly because of the forums help. You guys are making this fun, because the dealership experience does everything it can to suck the joy out of it.
Go drive a Mini Cooper hatch, the most fun you can have with your clothes on!
In reply to MiniDave :
Oh, I'd love a mini. But its not quite the appliance we are looking for.
Someone mentioned resale value and I realized that all 3 of these models have been offered for many years as generally the same car.
The Corolla Hatch is the newest offering having been launched in 2019. So, for this exercise, I went to Edmunds for a car value appraisal. For all cars I chose 2019 model year, each with 99k miles and all in equal condition.
Corolla Hatch: $10,468 worth today
Kia Soul Plus: $7,753
Mazda3 Hatch: $10,495
Findings: Wow, the Corolla is worth a lot more than the Soul. Wow, the Mazda keeps right up there with the Corolla, actually surpasing it!
Disclaimer: Past performance is not indicative of future results...but its something to look at.
Corolla Hatch:
Kia Soul Plus:
Mazda3 Hatch:
Just pulled up next to an hr-v at the gas station. That looks an awful lot like a wagon.
Think ill add that to the list.
FWIW, you can get a Buick Encore in your price range pretty easily, and it will be loaded with luxury features you won't find in the base wagons, like leather seats with heat. Yes, it is a CUV and not a wagon, but for doing basic errands in the PNW, it's pretty great. My wife moved from a 1st gen Soul (later gens are much nicer) to the Encore and LOVED it. Its still in the family, my daughter has been driving it for a few years and also loves it.
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