Sporty Wagons

Hi folks,

As my usernames states, I love wagons and would love your suggestions on finding a wagon with this:

I have a 2004 Mitsubishi Lancer Sportback "Ralliart". This sports wagon is almost perfect for me. It has everything I want and none of what I don't. If it had a manual (and may a little more power), I would not be posting this.

I wanted; a used, fun-to-drive, reasonably priced, reliable, roomy, comfy, wagon with great visibility and a compromise between sporty handling and good ride quality.

I didn't want; expensive repairs & maintenance, electric leather seats, a sunroof, climate control (A/C button & dials are best), paying extra for a badge, a boring vehicle, an SUV. The Lancer Ralliart wagon has all of this and more. It's a great car for; commuting, driving spiritedly (it's not fast but sporty), highway cruising, moving furniture, grocery shopping, carrying sports equipment.

The problem is that I have a mental block when it comes to loving an automatic car. I am not some super-mechanic or racing driver that needs an auto for some genuine reason but I grew up in a country that had few autos and I just feel like driving an auto robs a HUGE part of a rewarding vehicle.

So, what wagon has most of the above to be bought on the used market for maybe maybe I don't know $<15k

Full Disclosure: I became enamored with sportswagons in high school when my friend's father bought a 1997 WRX wagon (we got WRX's in 95 in South Africa). I have since lusted over these vehicles. I still think it's pretty much perfect but finding one that hasn't been driven into the ground is an effort in futility. I also don't want it to be too heavily modified maybe just some little things to help the drivability but NOT AFFECT RELIABILITY.

Suggestions anyone???

this can be easily had...

take a volvo 740 wagon

8 cylinder engine of your choice (I prefer ford as they used to own Volvo.. keep it in the family.. and you can run volvo valve covers from the marine division)

and you can disappear off into the distance in unexpected style.

Done right.. the car retains all it's euroluxury and ride.. but can surprise anything short of the newest crop of muscle and sports cars

Mazda 3/Mazdaspeed 3

There are some manual BMW 3 series cars out there. The Jaguar x-type came with a manual and as a wagon, but those individually are already rare - even if you could order with both, I doubt you'll find one.

VW Jetta wagon.

Do you need five doors?

BMW Z3 M Coupe

Volvo C30

I was driving a 2003 Protege5 when the Sportback came out. Lack of a manual was the main thing that prevented my regret. The Sportback is both uncommon and good looking.

Is the Lancer Ralliart wagon not available with a manual transmission? If it is, given how much you like your current wagon, the obvious choice is to find a manual version.

Mazda Protege5 is the closest match to a Lancer, but the Mazda3 is a better car. A Focus ZX5 may fit the bill as well.

In reply to Javelin:

Seriously agreed.

Mine:

Mine was spec'd exactly in line with everything he wants. The thing is, even a perfect one shouldn't be near $15k. If he's open to spending $5k for a really nice one, and putting the rest in the bank, it's a good choice.

Mad_machine: Great idea, nice photos too, it made it easy for me to follow along My uncle always spoke about these and I found a guy in MI that does them with 850's and LSx motors with a 6 speed, for way too much $$$ and I am looking for a plug&play vehicle.

Mmosby: I do need 5 doors and a proper wagon body. I need the length so I would like it to be at least as long, preferably longer than my sportback. 180 inches I think?

Jetta wagons, umm I am a little scared of their reliability issues. The ones made in Germany seem ok though, the ones from Mexico seem dodgy. They did make a 2.0L DI Turbo wagon for 5 seconds, that would be perfect if I could find one.

3 series - unfortunately they seem to have all but 2 of the attributes in my "I didn't want" tirade.

darkbuddha: they only brought in roughly 2500-3000 lancer wagons (that includes the less fun LS edition) into the US, all autos BUT the sedan version of the car did come in a manual.... maybe transmission swap but I really just want to buy and drive if possible, I don't have time to mess w cars anymore. (Baby, job,house & one obsession more important than cars if you can believe it)

I encouraged and helped complete my nephew buying a Sportback wagon when new. I should add that new meant it was a hold-over on the lot which had not sold. The '05 models were on the lot and this dealership still had '04 Sportbacks on the lot as well. A black, Rallyart version (aka: loaded) had a $19,500 sticker and we took it off the lot for $13,500. Served him well for a number of years. For him, he managed to get a new car and the full new car warranty but bought it at depreciated (like used) prices. Sold it after 4 years and having been in two accidents for little loss

Sample:

Odd car. Only sold in US for 1 year (2004). Only came with larger 2.4L 4 cyl and automatic. As a result, they were peppy but got pretty bad mpg for their size class.

What next...
Naturally, the Sportback looked like a little Volvo so a consideration could be a Volvo V70 or V50. The V50 can be found with a manual more readily than the V70 but V70 manuals are out there. The earlier V40 only came with automatic.

The big secret and one I hesitate to let you in on because I am looking for one myself, seems to be the Saab 9-5 wagons. The lesser models can be had with a 185 hp, 2.3L, 4cyl low pressure turbo capable of 30 mpg hyw. Upper models (called the Aero) came with a 250 hp, 2.3L, 4cyl high pressure turbo capable of 27 mpg hyw.
In the middle is a 3.0L turbo but that comes with auto only.
Best of all, with Saab's demise, prices of Saabs are dropping quickly. I have noticed 1999 - 2002 Saabs with like 110k miles retailing for $4-$6k, and those are dealer asking prices. Some negotiation could drive lower.

With your $15k budget you should be able to find a really new Saab 9-5 Aero or the 9-3 Combi (Combi is Saab-speak for wagon in the 9-3 line)
Samples:
http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=44870&endYear=2011&startYear=1981&makeCode1=SAAB&bodyStyles=WAGON&transmissionCode=MAN&searchRadius=500&minPrice=44&listingId=319799434&Log=0
http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=44870&endYear=2011&startYear=1981&makeCode1=SAAB&bodyStyles=WAGON&firstRecord=26&transmissionCode=MAN&searchRadius=0&minPrice=44&listingId=319395179&Log=0

Craigloveswagons wrote: I don't have time to mess w cars anymore. (Baby, job,house & one obsession more important than cars if you can believe it)

Edit: Okay, what you wrote above here brings out the real answer...
Mazda 5 w/ manual trans.

We have one in my driveway for the wife (automatic) which was the spiritual successor for our old Volvo 850 wagon.

New or used, you can not go wrong. A GRM favorite. Follow along on this thread.
http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/behold-the-millenium-falcon-mazda5-content/34680/page1/

Are we counting the Matrix/Vibe as wagons?

Jetta TDi wagon?

Subaru Forester?

I'm also sure that you can get cars that we cannot, so check some of the variants from the UK and Australia. (Ford Mondeo Holden whatever).

Craigloveswagons wrote: Full Disclosure: I became enamored with sportswagons in high school when my friend's father bought a 1997 WRX wagon (we got WRX's in 95 in South Africa). I have since lusted over these vehicles. I still think it's pretty much perfect but finding one that hasn't been driven into the ground is an effort in futility. I also don't want it to be too heavily modified maybe just some little things to help the drivability but NOT AFFECT RELIABILITY. Suggestions anyone???

I have an 02 WRX wagon completely stock, never modified except for a new cd player and tinted windows. It is a 5 speed and is blue. It is in very good condition and has the factory 17" BBS wheels. It also has painted side skirts which I was told was a rare option. 112k miles on it, never raced, never attempted a 4 wheel burnout or anything dumb like that. All maintenance is up to date. I have been toying with the idea of selling it... If your seriously looking let me know. I might be willing to part with it.

EDIT: Are you in South Africa? This might not work

+1 for the WRX wagon- I've had an '02 from new and love it.

I don't consider the new wrx wagons, mazda 3's, etc to be wagons, as they seem more like hatchbacks to me. It's a fine point, but they simply don't have the cargo space that the actual wagons have. I like the mazda 5, the forester, etc. I too, shy from the audi/vw's even though they make true wagons. I like the E46 wagons, but to find a non-auto is nigh on impossible (unless you work for this magazine!!).

Where are you from in ZA? I nabbed one of your ladies a decade ago

I knew this was a good place to ask this question, these answers are spot on!

I got a pretty good deal on the Lancer too, under $8k 50k miles, brand new tires, zero rust. Mine is also yellow, and the small dealership bent over backwards to sell it. I asked about rust, they put the car on a lift, I said the tread was a little low, boom all new tires and gave me full kbb for my trade that was rusted to death and needed an entirely new brake system. I was getting concerned this was a lemon but realised that maybe selling a bright yellow sport/sporty station wagon might be difficult?

Protege 5: my second choice when I bought the Lancer, great little cars. My wife doesn't drive a manual, so I played it safe and got the Lancer because I thought it would be better with an auto because of the larger motor.

Mazda 5's are nice but I'd like a lower roof because I carry sports equipment on top of my car for about 8 months a year and it's easier to get to with a low roof. How are the Mazda 6 wagons?

Nearly bought a Saab 9-3 manual wagon a few months ago but decided all those "I didn't want" things were too important. The 9-5's are very nice and some of them are very fast. There is an auto one for sale nearby: http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?modelCode1=9-5&makeCode1=SAAB&ownerId=342895&listingType=all&exteriorColorSimple1=Oyster&listingId=320045633

Manual 9-5's are unbelievably rare, but would be awesome if you got one!

frenchy - your wagon sounds pretty great! The painted side skirts do seem to be rare and those factory BBS's are beautiful. I am not in the market now though, I am doing this to find a replacement wagon in a year or two, can you hold onto it for me? PS. I am an expat, I live in lovely and bucolic Cleveland OH these days.

m3 dork: I'm from Pretoria (just next to Johannesburg). I have been reading that other discussion about what constitutes a wagon and it's pretty contentious. To me a wagon is a long version of the regular sedan, hatchbacks have little depth in their "truck" sections.

Having said that, a matrix is not a bad option. I like the fold-down seats and the XRS model seems fun with the 6 speed.

I guess my budget of $15k may be high, I just wanted some lee-way to see what you guys thought without limiting options because this is almost a niche market. $10k is probably the realistic number maybe more, I may be rich in a year or two

Mazda6 wagon. I think they can be found with manual and 220hp V6.

Easiest what car question ever IMO. The answer is.....

2005 Legacy 2.5gt 5spd. Only year available with manual. Basically a bigger, nicer, "grown-up" version of a wrx. Drive one if you can find one, they made very few. There are lots up here in the NW. Check out nasioc.com there may be one close to you!

In reply to mad_machine:

A post like that is the last thing my wife wants me to read. You're on her naughty list.

OK, thanks a lot shiny happy person, research done, 302 Brick. Its happening.

N Sperlo wrote: OK, thanks a lot shiny happy person, research done, 302 Brick. Its happening.

REALLY keep it in the family and either start with the B230FT and boost it to the moon, or swap in a T5 or T6 for insane noises and more power than you know what to do with.

Wifey forgives Mad Machine and likes the idea. She only drives the stick, so T-5.

If you like the WRX/Impreza, but have a hard time finding one that you're confident hasn't been abused, also look to the Saab 92X (Aero if you want the turbo, Linear for the non-turbo). The Saabaru is more of a wolf in sheep's clothing, so there seems to be a much lower percentage of boy-racer types that get them. They're a bit harder to find, but when you do find them they seem to be better cared for.

Disclaimer: We've got one, that's been babied, so I have a highly biased opinion. It seems to check your boxes above pretty well. Roomy is the only one that's questionable...with full size adults in front and back, it gets pretty cramped. We rarely have more than two people in the car for more than a few minutes, so it hasn't been a problem. If you want more roomy than an Impreza, the '05 Legacy GT Wagon mentioned above might be a better fit (although it is a fair bit more "luxury" than the Impreza).

Bryce

Legacy GT Wagon manual is the ticket, finding one is tricky but it hits just about everything on my list, well done CLNSC3. They have the same risks as WRX's, being abused but other than that, not too much if it has had an easy life. Ironically, I just read this article and wondered how typical this is:

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/04/piston-slap-a-sticky-subie-situation/

I have been checking out the 9-2X Aeros, finding a manual one is a little tricky too. You're right, they are a little on the smaller side just like their WRX cousin but nicer inside and a little more "grown-up" but anything is compared with a bright yellow wagon.

GTwannaB: The recommendation of the Mazda 6 wagon is really growing on me! I did some reading on edmunds and the worst I have seen about it is that it's thirsty for the power. I am used to that with the Lancer. Gas mileage isn't too big of a deal, I work 5 miles away from home, literally.

It's a bigger than the Lancer, has a smooth v-6, and it should handle pretty well seeing it's a Mazda.It ticks of all the requirements. Also, they don't seem too elusive, I found a couple within 100 miles of me. I really like this one: http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=44120&endYear=2013&startYear=1981&ownerId=620413&listingType=all&bodyStyles=[WAGON]&sellerType=b&searchRadius=100&maxPrice=15000&listingId=319322357

I'll just leave this right here.

I test drove it today. Had a CEL that the sales guy said came up as a bad MAF sensor on their scan tool, but they replaced it and the CEL came back. It also had quite the shimmy at 55 mph+, and I didn't delve any deeper than that. $3600 for a 120k mile, 13 year old car was a bit steep in my wife's eyes, and she's been bit when buying a car with a CEL on, so we passed on it.

But in case you're interested, there it is. The sales guy was definitely open to a lower offer.

I bought my Mazda5 because I couldn't find a Mazda6 wagon to save my life. The gas mileage is pretty bad, the rear seat room is very cramped, but other than that they are great cars. 3.0L V6 only and the manual is hard to find, and usually brings a premium if they know what they have.

Conversely, the 5 has been stupendously great on mileage, has enough room for two rear-facing newborn seats, and has a much larger cargo area. Why put sports equipment on top when it can go inside? I just brought home some 10' boards for a garden project inside the 5 the other week (check the thread linked above). An added bonus is that manual-trans minivans just don't sell so you can steal the damn things.

Now I do like wagons, but another option to the Mazda6 is the Mazda6 hatchback. You don't get the wagon look but you do get a lot of functionality, plus I think they put both the 4 and 6 cyl engines in the hatchbacks. Too bad they did not sell the newer Mazda6 wagon. They are nice looking but that much too big for me.

I have a roof rack for my mazda5, I also have a rocket box for it. I can do anything a small can and can do it with six adults along for the ride.