Statement on George Floyd

Stampie (FS) said:

When I signed up to serve I swore an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States.  One part of that Constitution is Freedom of Speech.  That applies to those I agree with and disagree with.  

Well said Stampie. Oh by the way I too took that oath. 

I posted this on the VW racism thread yesterday. I urge everyone to think about your language and assumptions.

If you grew up in the United States of America the chances are, like me, you are not good at talking about racism, prejudice and bias. Lets acknowledge that collectively we are not good at this and we are going to make some mistakes.

Language is important, there are a lot of words and phrases with strong connotations for others we may not be aware of. I am going to offer up a few definitions and distinctions of my own.

Race – A grouping of humans based on shared physical or social qualities into a category generally viewed as distinct by a society.

Racism – Active hated, devaluing, and/or dehumanizing of a group of people for being of a particular race.

Racist – hating, devaluing, and/or dehumanizing something or someone because its associated with a particular racial group.

Bias – disproportionately weighted expectations or attitudes, positive or negative, you have about people or things based on beliefs and sometimes life experiences.

Prejudice - a negative opinion or feeling formed beforehand or without direct knowledge, thought, or reason.

We all have prejudges and biases. It is part of how minds work. Let me throw a few words hopefully non-political words up and observe your reaction to them.

NASCAR

Formula Drift

SUV’s

Pontiac Aztec

Prius owners

Ford vs Chevy

Jeep

Figure Stating

I could continue the list, but I am guessing we all have an opinion or feeling about something on the the list that we don't have direct experience with. (Full discloser, I have never driven an Aztec, but don't want one for some irrational reason).  We are often not conscious of our prejudices/biases and get really defensive when they are pointed out. It doesn’t make me or you a bad person by itself. I try to be aware of my biases, and counter act them when I realize they are not working for me or harming someone.

There is no room in this community for active racism. (Thank You Moderators). Strong biases and racist beliefs are definitely here because this forum because the majority of the members are male and North American. We are not actively racist, but we still have been taught a lot of wrong-headed, wrong-hearted, bullE36 M3 that harms us, our loved ones and everything we say we care about. I am trying everyday to learn and do better. I invite everyone here to help me and to do the same for yourself.

There are good cops and bad.  

There are good people protesting and bad.

Core thing I find is, they have a right to be PISSED. 

Don't know if you guys have caught up to tonight's presidential speech. I have a feeling that whatever side of the asile you are on you can agree. I weep for our country tonight.

Type Q said:

I posted this on the VW racism thread yesterday. I urge everyone to think about your language and assumptions.

 

If you grew up in the United States of America the chances are, like me, you are not good at talking about racism, prejudice and bias. Lets acknowledge that collectively we are not good at this and we are going to make some mistakes.

 

 

Language is important, there are a lot of words and phrases with strong connotations for others we may not be aware of. I am going to offer up a few definitions and distinctions of my own.

 

Race – A grouping of humans based on shared physical or social qualities into a category generally viewed as distinct by a society.

 

Racism – Active hated, devaluing, and/or dehumanizing of a group of people for being of a particular race.

 

Racist – hating, devaluing, and/or dehumanizing something or someone because its associated with a particular racial group.

 

Bias – disproportionately weighted expectations or attitudes, positive or negative, you have about people or things based on beliefs and sometimes life experiences.

 

Prejudice - a negative opinion or feeling formed beforehand or without direct knowledge, thought, or reason.

 

We all have prejudges and biases. It is part of how minds work. Let me throw a few words hopefully non-political words up and observe your reaction to them.

 

NASCAR

Formula Drift

SUV’s

Pontiac Aztec

Prius owners

Ford vs Chevy

Jeep

Figure Stating

 

I could continue the list, but I am guessing we all have an opinion or feeling about something on the the list that we don't have direct experience with. (Full discloser, I have never driven an Aztec, but don't want one for some irrational reason).  We are often not conscious of our prejudices/biases and get really defensive when they are pointed out. It doesn’t make me or you a bad person by itself. I try to be aware of my biases, and counter act them when I realize they are not working for me or harming someone.

 

There is no room in this community for active racism. (Thank You Moderators). Strong biases and racist beliefs are definitely here because this forum because the majority of the members are male and North American. We are not actively racist, but we still have been taught a lot of wrong-headed, wrong-hearted, bullE36 M3 that harms us, our loved ones and everything we say we care about. I am trying everyday to learn and do better. I invite everyone here to help me and to do the same for yourself.

Well put

Type Q said:

NASCAR

Formula Drift

SUV’s

Pontiac Aztec

Prius owners

Ford vs Chevy

Jeep

Figure Stating

 

I kind of drew a blank at Figure Stating  

I feel the need to set the record straight on one thing:

Yes, a few months ago, going into the pandemic, we posted that the future was extremely uncertain and your support mattered more than ever. We said in this post:

Put simply, we face an existential threat unless you #SupportMotorsport and support us, too. We’d like to still be a part of the motorsports world when it emerges from this crisis in a few months, but we’re not going to be unless you support us any way you can. 

And you all supported us more than ever. You directly kept us going, and it did and still does mean the world to us. And since that post, well, the world opened back up again (whether or not it should have is a discussion for another thread). Because of your support, we were as strong as ever when it opened. Advertising resumed. Financially-speaking, things got better. You'll also notice that we didn't make a follow-up post, ask for more money, or even mention Patreon again aside from the links at the bottom of articles for those who like what they're reading. You saved us, and now we're here. Thank you. 

Subscribed and ordered a bit of merch. Trying to vote with my wallet.

To balance some of the earlier posts from a couple of (forum supporter)s, I'll be throwing some money you're way soon.

After reading the few comments of dissent, I'm reminded of a quote by Anais Ninn - "We don’t see things as they are, we see them as we are". 

Regarding the comments on police, I have to say this.  My dad was in law enforcement and I was around a lot of cops growing up.  City cops, county cops, state cops - all had one thing in common.  They wanted to do good in their community.  They wanted to make things better.

Let me give you an example.  My step-daughter's home had a collapsed sewer line that happened as her family was heading out the door on vacation.  Told her to keep going, I would take care of it.  Started digging to replace the line from the house to the septic tank.  A mutual friend (who happened to be a cop) got wind (probably literally) of what I was doing and offered to help.  No big deal, right?  Except this guy got the dry heaves just smelling sewer gas.  So he's gamely out there helping with half an inch of Vicks on his upper lip so he doesn't puke.

There are lots of genuinely good people out there, and a lot of them are cops.

Reading all this from a foreign country (Canada) is an interesting experience.  I think what we have here is another case of the Perfect being the enemy of the Good.  Could GRM have made a donation that would have satisfied more people?  Hard to say, impossible to prove, and irrelevant anyway, because it's their budget to spend.  Could they have made a donation that satisfied everybody?  Um, no.  As a general principle, No, and as regards this particular group of well-meaning, opinionated, articulate crazies, Hell no.  (Remember how many of us (a) praised and (b) loathed the various styles of company T-shirts?  Because I bet Tom does.)

GRM decided this wasn't a time to stay silent.  I support that.

Wow! I would never have expected the publishers of a car mag to make a donation to a liberal charity and *then blog about it*.  That is ballsy! I would guess your readership skews 70/30 conservative/liberal (although you probably know that already from the zip codes of your subscribers, since we are all so politically sorted).

I'll continue to support you regardless of what charities you give to.  The whole "take my ball and go home" crowd are such wusses.  Really, you've never had a friend or co-worker who has different politics than you? You've never shown up to a track day and started talking with the young kid in the flat-brimmed hat driving the FR-S?

We're here because we love going fast in cars, or on bikes, or wrenching, or something.  Most everyone I've met on here is great.  Let's keep it that way!

One thing that I'd like to add is a bit of context. If you listen to a lot of people, America is a seething cauldron of racism. While we've still got a long ways to go, in fact by many measurements things are much better than they were when I was born (The 1960s).  Take this chart for instance:

A young black man in 1968 was five times as likely to be killed by a LEO than in 2010. 

Or this one:

An African American is half as likely to be in poverty during the same period.

Is this good enough? No. But I dislike those on both sides of the spectrum who like to make it sound like things are worse than ever  and we're on the brink of a race war. Doesn't have to be. 

This does nothing but reinforce the reasons why I chose to become a member of this forum and support your business.   Thank you.

Personally, As long as GRM don't donate money to an Anti-Semitic Group, I could care less who they give to. Also, I haven't give money to a charity in 20 years, but do give the very few causes I believe in Items and do shop at said places.

I really like playing with cars and talking about it online.

There's a reason the only magazine I subscribe to is GRM, the only forum I visit is this one, and the only events I won't miss are organized by these PEOPLE. I love that they made a choice a humanitarian choice and did so publicly. 

You guys appear to try very hard to do the right thing I'm proud that I'm able to support the magazine. 

ProDarwin said:

Type Q said:

NASCAR

Formula Drift

SUV’s

Pontiac Aztec

Prius owners

Ford vs Chevy

Jeep

Figure Stating

 

I kind of drew a blank at Figure Stating  

Another name for accounting?

Truly was hoping the donation to SPLC remark was a joke.  Apparently not, and the only joke here is the SPLC.  Shameful.

https://news.yahoo.com/southern-poverty-law-center-state-180649483.html

Thanks GRM for your statement. 

L5wolvesf said:

T.J. said:

L5wolvesf said:

Staff of Motorsport Marketing, Inc. said:

We stand against racism. We stand against violence. We stand for inclusion. We stand for a free press. We stand for speaking out, together.

This I agree with 100%.

I find it interesting that none of those who don't like the SPLC have not provided any links to their claims. 

We are not allowed to discuss politics.

Tom Suddard said:

We don't believe human rights are political, and we did not see silence as a viable option here. 

I too do not consider human rights to be political - they are fundamental.

 

 

 

That’s a bit of a stretch, Tom, and reveals quite a blind spot, if indeed you believe that line hook line and sinker. The same ideals that inform one’s politics inform one’s belief of what is “basic human right.” 

I am a new subscriber as of the recent push and have intended to do the $3/mo thing too, and I completely get that the SPLC seems like a safe choice to donate to since Amazon and Microsoft and others import their lists for charity screening, but as someone who has beliefs and ideologies that would make me a hate monger to them, I surely don’t appreciate the donation. 

Your statement doesn't actually say anything directly about George Floyd.  I guess it's implied.  As such I agree that what happened to Mr. Floyd is horrific.

Almost everyone assumes it was racial.  And there is pretty good chance it was.  Or it could have been an bad cop that would have done that to anyone.  In any case, he should not have been a police officer.

Of all the organizations you could have donated to, the SPLC is probably the worst.  It would have been better to donate to an organization such as the King Center.

1988RedT2 said:

Truly was hoping the donation to SPLC remark was a joke.  Apparently not, and the only joke here is the SPLC.  Shameful.

https://news.yahoo.com/southern-poverty-law-center-state-180649483.html

The National Review is VERY right wing and this article is strong on opinion and light on facts. There are much more detailed accounts if you really want to know how sordid and immoral Morris Dees is. Even the liberal New York Times tore him a new one. But he doesn't run the place anymore.

short of a hate group. I don't care who the Suddards give money to. 

I support the magazine and understood early on in my forum days that it's their game and we are all but guests here. 

the Suddards put their hand out asking for any money we could give and I was unemployed, I bought ad space, 2 t-shirts and got a E36 M3load of stickers

I don't care if the group they gave money to, in good faith, is imperfect. 

thanks for being a beacon and a megaphone amplifying the message and trying to improve the world around us GRM.