In reply to fidelity101 :
I was running the BMW ITBs with adapter plates on the v6...the only real modification to the throttle bodies themselves were the flanges welded on. I have since swapped to Jenvey ITB setup:
More for hood clearance compared to the BMW setup than anything else(well, it also has better air velocity characteristics)...but yes, running MS3 for engine control.
I just Got my Itb's today and can live without IAC after the install.
Might get around to it some time but its probably not super important.
I probably wont get to putting this rebuilt engine into the car until summer.. Plan is to get it running first on the old known good carb, then swap to megasquirt. III with the EFI ITB's
I found this doodad that can possibly help. Similar to what folks have proposed here..
So is alpha n a fueling strategy that does not reference manifold pressure?
Thanks!
Correct alpha-n uses tps as the load axis
Thank you.
Might have to dabble in that strategy for this install.
So far I am a Classically trained Map-baro boy.
Other than the values just "looking weird" in the table, the process is the same.
In reply to Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter) :
Sounds Good! Thanks.
In reply to slantsix :
If you are going to have a TPS, certainly start with Alpha-N. But once you have it running, it wouldn't hurt to see what you can do for a vacuum signal and try out the blended mode. I've done that twice now with a TR6 and ended up running blended mode once the vacuum system was working well enough.
In reply to JoeTR6 :
Awesome, It will have a TPS. Thanks for the insight.
Finally got around to finishing up my overly-complex vacuum manifold setup. I think it should work out well.
I'm trying to solve this same issue on a 4 cylinder with twin sidedraft Solex carbs. I have threaded openings into all 4 intake runners that I have joined together with 5/16" tubing. I need an "average" vacuum signal for a vacuum advance canister on the distributor, and vacuum for a power brake booster. The booster has a built in check valve.
Any counsel on how big the vacuum bottle/canister/reservoir/box (hard to pick a term!) needs to be to provide a solid vacuum signal for the vacuum advance canister? Thx - M
In reply to MichaelYount :
I just installed some BMW OEM throttles and they came with a vacuum rail tying each throttle together. It almost looks like a second fuel rail and injectors. The ID of each port is probably about 5/16 or 3/8. The vacuum tube itself is 1" diameter. The MAP reference, OEM idle air controller, and booster are ported into the middle of the tube - not sure if it matters? I put my IAC off to the side for packaging. My MAP signal is pretty strong and so far I've had an easy time tuning the MS2 Microsquirt with the ITB mode and autotune feature. Idles pretty decently too.
In theory a bigger "vacuum box" should give more damping to the overall vacuum reading. Smaller lines can also help with that. I've seen one engine set up with essentially no vacuum box volume, with just small lines (maybe 1/8~1/4ID") teed together that worked. Most of the aftermarket units I've seen are about the same size as Wicked93gs' setup.
Thx folks - that helps. And that 6 looks wicked! What kind of 6 and what is it in?
Before I decided on adding a reservoir - I had the runners connected using some elbows/tees and 5/16" tubing. Worked reasonably well - but I think I can create a cleaner signal for the vac advance and a more consistent vacuum source for the booster. I have a perfect spot close to the back of the intake where I can fit something about 3"x3"x5". Break out the welder...
In reply to MichaelYount :
The engine is a Ford 3.7L Cyclone. Internally it is stock(red-headed step-child engines like this one don't have a lot of aftermarket parts options). Aside from a MS3 ECU, as far as performance goes its just the equal-length longtubes and the ITBs. Enough to hit 340-ish crank HP in theory(we will see what the reality is once I finish the rest of the build)
Cool Stuff everyone.
I hope to get My Injected ITB's Going this summer, we'll see.
In reply to Wicked93gs :
Can you enlighten me? When I search Ford 3.7L Cyclone I get references to the Duratec V6. And I can't find a 3.7L inline reference in the US or Australia. What am I missing?
In reply to MichaelYount :
The Duratec v6 engine started out as a 2.5L in the Ford Contour and Taurus(mid-late 90s) . Later on they used it in 3.0L form in the Jaguar AJ30(first VVT version) anf the Ford Fusion/Mazda6. Then they re-designed the engine in 3.5 and 3.7L versions...used in the Mazda CX9 for the first 3.7L version...which was still single VVT. Then in the 2011 mustang v6 the 3.7L became Ti-VCT for VVT on both the exhaust and intake cams...along with the F150. The 3.5L version is essentially the same...except the ecoboost v6, which got direct injection and turbochargers. So yeah...the "Cyclone" 3.7L is also known as the Duratec37...an evolution of the engine design. All Duratec v6s are known for good reliability and power.
https://fordauthority.com/fmc/ford-motor-company-engines/ford-cyclone-engine-family/ford-3-7l-duratec-37-engine/
This link will give yu the basic info on the engine. I chose this engine for my project because I wanted an engine that made 300HP out of the box while weighing less than 300lbs. Those are some tough criteria to meet and only a handful of engines qualify...most of them turbo 4 cylinders(which would be fine, I just didn't want to deal with the piping turbocharging would require for this project)
MichaelYount said:In reply to Wicked93gs :
Can you enlighten me? When I search Ford 3.7L Cyclone I get references to the Duratec V6. And I can't find a 3.7L inline reference in the US or Australia. What am I missing?
You were looking at a different car. The straight 6 you see is a 2JZ mounted in a Model A hotrod
If I were to use an inline 6 I would likely go for either a Barra I6(or one of its earlier versions, such as the Intech or even just a crossflow I6) or I would go for the Jaguar AJ6. The AJ6 has the distinction of being the only DOHC I6 that is all aluminum and can be run on a distributor....which means you can do fun things like triple sidedraft Webers and not have to mess with EFI(though arguably tuning triple Webers is more of a hassle than EFI to begin with)
In reply to buzzboy :
Thanks buzzboy - that's the 6 I was asking about. So another 2JZ - got it.
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