Teen Locator.. HELP

My sister is turning 18 tomorrow (just started senior year of HS) and has gone through a lot of physical/emotional issues that have included my parents calling the police on her for threatening physical violence towards them. She keeps saying that she will move out when she turns 18. Reasonable questions (how will you pay for this?) have been matched with terrible/scary answers (I'll turn tricks).

A month ago my parents finally told her to go for it. It hasn't come up since they called her on it. Internet history at the house and cell phone bills show no evidence of her making arrangements. I'll let you know tomorrow if it was a bluff or not.

SlickDizzy wrote: I find it interesting that as our nation goes through the ethical controversy of the NSA's wiretapping activities that such behavior is frequently encouraged and exercised on a DIY or familial level.

Family business is family business, not the government's.

mtn wrote: I have to disagree with this. Graduating high school is easy.

Yep. Also, hanging out with unsavoury types is hanging out with unsavoury types. I find it humorous when people describe these people as "good people". They aren't, they're low-lifes. Always will be. And if your son hangs around those people, he probably will be too. Birds of a feather and all that. Successful people don't hang around unsuccessful people.

Duke wrote:

SlickDizzy wrote: I find it interesting that as our nation goes through the ethical controversy of the NSA's wiretapping activities that such behavior is frequently encouraged and exercised on a DIY or familial level.

Family business is *family* business, not the government's.

Ever read the terms of service of any of those tracking apps? You'd be sorely disappointed in just who's business it is.

Regardless, think about it. Family or not, getting people comfortable with the fact that such surveillance is not possible but simple and raising kids with the mindset of "better not step out of line EVER because you are ALWAYS being watched" will create an interesting society of adults some time down the road. If you were raised in a household where you were tracked day-in, day-out until you left, that's a startling precedent to justify (or at least be ambivalent to) the gov't doing the exact same thing.

Just an observation, as someone in the marketing field. These things are pretty nefarious. Track your children with apps so we can follow their movements, gain access to their info, build a profile and serve them advertising eternally. It's job security for us.

Sorry if I'm missing something here, I tried reading thru all posts. Why is he still driving? Failing a course to graduate, easy, no more driving until grades are brought up. Walking everywhere is a great motivator to teens and it's not cool. Constantly being picked-up by punch card friends and druggies also puts you at the bottom of the food chain and eventually they forget to pick you up anyway. School too far away? Offer to drop off at the front on your way to work every morning.

The solution is to simply take his car away. When he has to ride the bus to the smoke shop, he won't think it's so cool anymore. When he has to ride Big Yellow to school, he won't be able to impress his friends by doing other things, so he won't bother.

HiTempguy wrote:

mtn wrote: I have to disagree with this. Graduating high school is easy.

Yep. Also, hanging out with unsavoury types is hanging out with unsavoury types. I find it humorous when people describe these people as "good people". They aren't, they're low-lifes. Always will be. And if your son hangs around those people, he probably will be too. Birds of a feather and all that. Successful people don't hang around unsuccessful people.

Some of my best friends in school were the types that "adults" back then would see as "unsavory losers." They did drugs, they smoked, they drank, they listened to punk music and wore ripped-up jeans and did donuts in the school parking lot in their cars.

Most of those people make 6-digits in professional careers these days. Meanwhile, our whistle-clean valedictorian, who never did any of that stuff, manages a Hallmark store in a mall.

Kids need a chance to experiment and figure out who they are. Most will grow out of the phase, or learn from their mistakes. Some won't. And some other kids who have an uneventful childhood will turn out to be total failures as adults. Kids need to get into a fight or two, crash a car, get in trouble a time or two, do stupid things, and learn from all of it, IMO.

when it comes down to it, though.....no matter what you do, your kid WILL do what he intends to do, and WILL do stupid things, no matter how much you chastise or surveil him.

It really comes down to this: He will do these things and HATE you. Or he will do these things and NOT hate you.

Can I put my vote in for more relevant information when the original post is made?

There is a ton of thought put into this issue well before some very pertinent info was given (recent bad break-up, military brat, born abroad, moved, finally in the States etc.)

Also for context - I was a military brat as well. I lived in 3 countries, 6 states, went to high school overseas (where my parents trusted me with a car, amazingly, that almost killed me at least 10 times doing stupid things because there were no real traffic laws to worry about). So I can sympathize with constant moving and trying to fit in with people and how difficult it is.

But now, I would have never wanted to live in one place for a long time. All that moving and meeting new people and learning new places made me who I am today, and I still keep in touch with many friends who I met all over the world. Fitting in at a new school is indeed tough, and sometimes the lowest-common denominator is the "trouble crew" to get into. Frankly, because that group is more accepting of people who don't fit into a clique, which are so much more common here in the US than they are at DoD schools in other countries....

I'm actually sad that my daughters will probably live their entire childhoods here in suburubia outside DC, living typical suburbia existances, and won't know much about the rest of the world other than reading about it and occasional trips. And won't have the exiciting childhood experiences that I did, thanks to so many laws and so much oversight here in the USA.

irish44j wrote: Most of those people make 6-digits in professional careers these days. Meanwhile, our whistle-clean valedictorian, who never did any of that stuff, manages a Hallmark store in a mall.

Hurray for your anecdotal evidence, congratulations on forming an argument based on essentially nil.

Seriously though, if you equate doing drugs to "figuring out who they are", I can't be bothered to comment any further.

Would anyone here consent to wearing monitor if their wife asked them to? Their insurance company?

I understand the parental instinct to want to know but there is no scenario where I would willingly submit to that myself so it would be coercion. Like a DUI ankle monitor. It is a punishment in its own right.

I wouldn't do it to my sons. I'd cut out the services I provide that make trust necessary if I can't trust them.

HiTempguy wrote:

irish44j wrote: Most of those people make 6-digits in professional careers these days. Meanwhile, our whistle-clean valedictorian, who never did any of that stuff, manages a Hallmark store in a mall.

Hurray for your anecdotal evidence, congratulations on forming an argument based on essentially nil. Seriously though, if you equate doing drugs to "figuring out who they are", I can't be bothered to comment any further.

Say whaa.... nevermind. We all have had different experiences. My kids' are going to parallel Irish's- 10 and 6, and the older has lived in 3 states so far, 5 houses, 4 schools. And we've had it good. I worry about the military child thing, but we're going to have to take it day to day.

For what it's worth, I hung out with some of those "losers" Hitemp is talking about. Poor kids were directionless, but total salt of the earth. berkeley the whole idea of "successful people hang out with successful people". On that logic, douches hang out with douches (and I'm not talking about the "losers" here). I am successful in my career as a military officer, but I hang out fine with enlisted folks, I hang out more comfortably and easily with people who make <$50k/yr than those who are high flyers at [insert consulting firm here] and always out for the next "contact". What kind of life is that?

To the OP's question: I wouldn't go there (I don't think). Give him enough rope to hang himself, hope that the lessons you taught him growing up are in there somewhere, and most of all, talk to and listen to him. Even if he doesn't talk, talk to him. Tell him you love him, but he has to decide how he is going to live... you can't do that for him any more. Then let him go. This is from a kid's perspective- I'll let you know how it goes as a parent in a few years.

Thanks for the feedback guys.

He's a new man after texting and data had been removed from his phone on Monday. Now he talks and is doing homework with no issues.

Tonight we chatted peacefully and is turning the corner. Just 3 days though. We'll see what this next weekend does.

I'll consider the mileage check though. He pays for gas anyways and has to budget that.

I'll keep the gps off the list for now.

M3 said...

He had a pretty bad break-up with his girl in May, after that, he's not been the same.

Thanks for being my counselors.

=======

I'm glad the phone thing seems to have worked, but... is anybody being HIS counselor on the subject of the break-up? That kind of incident, especially if it's the first, can be a real derailment, and as a good parent you'll want to satisfy yourself that your kid is on the way to healing, and not just SAYING he's on the way to healing.

Good advice here overall. Since he is already over 18 Anything you give him is a gift. He is On His Own. If he doesn't appreciate this cut it off. If he likes your money he is subject to your rules. Not unlike the rules of life. Unless you are the government you cant afford what you cant pay cash for. Life lessons are hard. Probably harder on you than your son. If he needs your hard lessons thats fine. Whatever keeps him from depending on your income into his 40's and beyond.

irish44j wrote:

HiTempguy wrote:

mtn wrote: I have to disagree with this. Graduating high school is easy.

Yep. Also, hanging out with unsavoury types is hanging out with unsavoury types. I find it humorous when people describe these people as "good people". They aren't, they're low-lifes. Always will be. And if your son hangs around those people, he probably will be too. Birds of a feather and all that. Successful people don't hang around unsuccessful people.

Some of my best friends in school were the types that "adults" back then would see as "unsavory losers." They did drugs, they smoked, they drank, they listened to punk music and wore ripped-up jeans and did donuts in the school parking lot in their cars. Most of those people make 6-digits in professional careers these days.

And I take it they also weren't failing the classes that they needed to pass to graduate? My point was that if he isn't going to graduate, there is seriously something wrong. It is not hard to actually get a high school diploma.

FWIW, I was lazy in high school. Like I said, 2.6 GPA, 32 ACT, 11 hours of college credit. Didn't hurt my career at all. Your career (for business type folks) doesn't start in high school, it starts in college.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20130924/BIZ01/309240098/Milford-entrepreneur-featured-Walmart-web-series

mtn wrote: And I take it they also weren't failing the classes that they needed to pass to graduate? My point was that if he isn't going to graduate, there is seriously something wrong. It is not hard to actually get a high school diploma. FWIW, I was lazy in high school. Like I said, 2.6 GPA, 32 ACT, 11 hours of college credit. Didn't hurt my career at all. Your career (for business type folks) doesn't start in high school, it starts in college.

I will say that while I was lazy yet did ok in HS, I seriously wish I paid more attention in math class. So it didn't suck as much when I got to college.

I would compare his high school experience to mine, but I was having hundreds of seizures a day.

Do you have a project car that you work on together? Do you go to the track together? Might be a good segway to more positive things and a good bonding exercise. Does he have a job? I vote make him float his own deal, then he'll have to get his e36m3 together and teach him the value of things. It's a tough time for people, they have all sorts of hormones berking their heads up, they think everything is the end of the world, they think that life is short, they have only immature hormone infested chaotic relationships, and we wonder why the smoke dope and get in trouble. I was a huge berk-up when I was that age (could be argued that I still am). When I was his age I was a spoiled prick, and My life's been harder for it. Talk to him with respect and as a peer, guide him if you can. I wish the best for you and him, but it ain't gonna be easy for either of you.

"Yep. Also, hanging out with unsavoury types is hanging out with unsavoury types. I find it humorous when people describe these people as "good people". They aren't, they're low-lifes. Always will be. And if your son hangs around those people, he probably will be too. Birds of a feather and all that. Successful people don't hang around unsuccessful people."

I agree with this too, my friends were all "unsavory types" and I brought myself down by associating with them. It's like the saying "dress for the job you want". The things you associate with on a regular basis, mould your perception of what acceptable behavioral norms are. Also as your life progresses, these become your contacts when you need references or an "in" at some place you want to work. Winners, hang with winners. Period.

lol i got like straight ds in high school, did what i wanted and my parents respected my privacy, went to community college, transferred to a university, (* that route saved a TON of money probably 10s of thousands) and got a computer science degree and had only As and Bs. High school is literally meaningless. Not figurative really "literal". It literally meant nothing to me, at all. It was just a baby sitter for a teen.

The degree plus joining the USAF reserves and getting a security clearance? You can imagine that I am doing well, lol. To work the job i'm doing now I don't even need a degree, I could have started doing this at age 18 instead of starting it at 25. However if I want a promotion, which i'm getting soon, I do need a degree which I do thankfully have. Before I was in the reserves I was making great money but now i'm making double.

I also make money on the side beta testing video games (not 'open beta' or free tester nonsense, actual testing). I spent all my homework time in high school playing Half-Life or Quake 2 and making mods when I wasn't with friends. Good way to get into that. I probably after sophomore year didn't do any homework at home, either did it 15 minutes before class or not at all. Maybe if I spent more time making mods I might be a developer right now like my friend whose in town for the gaming (gambling gaming) convention this week in vegas.

I am pretty much proof that allowing your child to be a child and working for grades is a complete wasted effort and you are only ruining their life and creating resentment. I have a very good almost friend level relationship with my parents.

Whats funny is that all I did in college was attend class, hang out with my friends and got drunk and smoked weed pretty much every week and sometimes multiple times that week. I just made sure that my money was being spent well at school by finishing my work when it mattered. Also worked 40 hours a week while going to college and saved enough money so that I didn't have to work the final year, I think if you spend your own money rather than living off your parents it helps a lot as well in terms of motivation. I laugh whenever people say college is too expensive i paid for it with minimum wage for the first 2 years! After I got the community college degree I got an IT job and worked it for 1 year paying for my last 2 years. I'm guessing people complaining about cost probably are trying to attend a worthless money wasting school like Northwestern or something. Those graduates never know E36 M3 as well. I guess lecture halls only breed ineptitude.

I remember one of my mom's bosses raised their child with a strict regimen and he even wasn't allowed to watch TV. If I was that person and I worked with real life me and realized that I am probably making less money I would be furious that my life was literally wasted and my childhood teen years didn't exist. Lots of great memories from back then, and I cherish them.

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote: Would anyone here consent to wearing monitor if their wife asked them to? Their insurance company?

Insurance company? Maybe. I'd give the progressive Snapshot a try if it weren't banned in NC. http://www.progressive.com/auto/snapshot-how-it-works/

I never drank in high school (still don't), all of the unsavory kids, thought it was cool to get "wasted" on the weekends....or more accurately, maybe they thought they were cool when they bragged about it on Monday at the lunch table. I was unaffected by such peer pressure nonsense. If anyone had tracked my movements, they would have found that I was taking my mom's '86, 5.0 liter cougar on road courses that I made up. I would keep racing the clock over and over again in an effort to become a better driver.