The “cost of racing” thread...

I’ve seen a few “what’s it cost to race” type of threads around here lately. Maybe we can compile them into one megathread.

I ran my 190E 2.3-16 in a total of 4 race weekends last summer: 2 with the BMW CCA and 2 vintage racing festivals. More details in my build thread: https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/build-projects-and-project-cars/87-mercedes-190e-23-16-vintage-racer-build-pic-hea/62702/page1/

So, what was the "damage" for a full season of racing?

• Two bent BBS wheels (beyond repair): About $500 loss
• Used transmission to replace the one I broke: About $1100 installed
• New clutch: About $600 installed
• One set of 225/45/15 Hankook Z214s: About $1000 mounted/balanced
• One set of Raybestos ST43 pads: $380 for all 4 corners
• One brake master cylinder: About $175
• Fresh Schroth harnesses, window, and center net: About $600 with hardware
• Maintenance (wheel bearings, trans/diff fluids, tech inspections, etc.): About $1000
• Entry fees (4 race weekends): About $2400
• Hotels (12 nights): About $2400
• Fuel (maybe 16 tanks = 288 gallons): about $800

I'm not counting the bodywork (bent hood/fender plus paint), because that happened on the drive to Mosport ... so I guess it wasn't directly related to racing.

A quick back-of-the-envelope calculation for my racing expenses for the 2017 season comes out to about $11000, or around $2750 per race weekend! That's surprisingly high considering I'm a relatively novice racer, running a (slow!) car at the back of the pack, in amateur club racing. I'm running cheap tires (Hankooks instead of Hoosiers) and using them at least twice as long as my competitors do. I didn't have any major incidents. Remember, I'm driving the racecar to events, which means no tow vehicle or trailer, and lower fuel cost. So, this is pretty much as low-budget as it gets.

Thanks for posting this, it gets scary once you start adding things up.

Adam

Wow, really high costs. You should have camped to save a big chunk of money :)

I can probably add a pretty good data point at the end of this season. So far it's been expensive (for me) with a transmission failure and other issues associated with buying a very used race car. However, I think my total will be quite a bit lower than 11k. I am towing the car but will only be camping, packing food, running used Hoosiers, etc. My entry fees also appear to be lower. My guess is the total will settle to around $750-900 per race weekend if I don't include initial investment items such as the vehicle purchase or driver gear. 

In reply to RyanGreener :

Yeah, I was kind of surprised at how much I spent on hotels: about $200 a night on average.

At this stage of my life, camping isn’t much fun for me. I really need a good night’s sleep and a hot shower/shave to function the next day. 

A few more bills to pay and the car will be ready to go, how ever i'm old. when I wake it's coffee, shower s..t and shave, might pass on the shave but the rest is mandatory, I am practiced on being cheap but we will see.

Thanks for the post. Love and study Economics and always interested on what folks spend in racing.

In reply to LanEvo :

Yup, totally understand. I'm a hotel guy myself....until I eventually get my enclosed trailer!

I'm one of the "arrive and drive" team members for a LeMons team...national effing champions by the way....

My share of the entry fee is $900 for a race weekend

My airline ticket is around $200 round trip...the races are in the northeast/mid-Atlantic and I live in Atlanta

Rental car is about $100 for the weekend

Hotel is "free" because I use rewards points from my credit card.  Like LanEvo, I'm not into camping or even staying in a trailer or RV.  Call me a diva, but I just need my quiet night sleep, hot shower and personal space/time to unwind.  I'm not a late night person or party guy, so I usually head back to my hotel pretty early...I enjoy those few hours of peace and quiet, as I don't get them at home.

Incidentals such as buying ice for our coolers, bribe bags, supplies I need at the track (Poweraide, protein shakes, etc...) are around $40

Total spend per weekend is around $1250

I have found that I average about $500 per day between entry fees, fuel, meals and hotels and I just do time trials. I find that splitting a room with friend helps reduce some cost. My idea of camping is staying at a non brand name hotel. Like others have said a good night's sleep is worth the expense. I try not to look at the total at the end of the season as it is usually more than I thought I would spend. It nice when you can make it through the year without any significant repairs. 

For wheel-to-wheel in cars, it looks pretty reasonable.

You can hardly do it cheaper with motorcycles.

That sounds about right actually. If I included just running costs, gas, and easy consumables I'd be at around 1200 a weekend pulling an IT car to a racetrack that's about 100 miles away. But if I included the cost of upgrades and hard part replacements, then split that up over the number of weekends I run per year, I'd be at around 2500 a weekend. Not including maintenance on the truck. 

And I get a big savings on labor since I do all of the in-season stuff since I have alignment equipment and a tyre changer at home. I can only imagine what kind of bill I'd rack up if I paid a shop to shuffle used Hoosiers across race wheels like I do now.

EDIT: Ok, I miscalculated a bit. The $2500 figure did include a full set of tyres and new lights for the trailer. But trailer parts are dirt cheap.

In reply to boxedfox :

The way I calculated it is this. The racecar is already built. I’m totally ignoring the cost of the car, the race prep, and development costs over the last 7-8 years or so. At the start of the season, the car was ready to race. So, assuming we’ve already got a race-ready car, how much did it actually cost me to enjoy that car for 4 race weekends?

To me, that included all the routine maintenance I needed (wheel bearings, fluids, tech inspection), updated safety equipment (harnesses and nets had expired), consumables (brakes, tires, gas), event expenses (registration fees, hotels), and stuff that was damaged (wheels, transmission) or wore out (clutch, brake MC) while racing.

Klayfish said:

I'm one of the "arrive and drive" team members for a LeMons team...Total spend per weekend is around $1250

We’re in the same ballpark. I own the car, so I’ve got to cover those costs myself. Plus, you’re ignoring hotel costs since you’re using credit card rewards. I’d argue that’s still an expenditure of sorts (in the sense that you could just as well have used those rewards for other stuff).

I did maybe two years of racing a Spec E30, possibly one of the cheapest cars ever to run. While it was fun, it wasn't enough fun to justify the drain on my bank account. Running expenses on the car were low, mostly fuel, tires and brakes. The price of spec tires kept going up. Entry fees at some of the tracks I went to nearly doubled over several years. I raced for two years, took some time off and just did instructing and HPDEs and reassessed. After another racing buddy had his car taken out by a complete bone-headed move by a car he was lapping I decided it wasn't worth it to me. I sold the race car and bought a dedicated HPDE/TT car instead.  I still get to drive fast but with much lower entry fees, running costs and reduced likelihood of having my car destroyed by someone else.

Racing is a great sport, but it is a sport for people with a greater income than mine.

Man has racing got expensive since I was last on track. 

LanEvo said:

I’m totally ignoring the cost of...............

This is the proper way to calculate racing costs. 

LanEvo said:

Klayfish said:

I'm one of the "arrive and drive" team members for a LeMons team...Total spend per weekend is around $1250

We’re in the same ballpark. I own the car, so I’ve got to cover those costs myself. Plus, you’re ignoring hotel costs since you’re using credit card rewards. I’d argue that’s still an expenditure of sorts (in the sense that you could just as well have used those rewards for other stuff).

No doubt.  I'm with SPG and until they combined with Marriott, there were races where the closest SPG hotel was far away so I just paid for a hotel room nearby.  I tried the non-name brand flea bag places, and some were pretty damn crappy.  We're going to drop the credit card because my racing is the only thing we use the reward points for...they're just piling up and sitting.  So add maybe $100/night to my costs..so the new total will become $1450-$1550.

mazduece-Seth, a thousand times yes!  I don't really want to add up how much I've spent overall, it would be enough to pay cash for an awful nice toy.  But it's worth every penny...the friends, the racing, the experiences.

Agree. I’m not saying it’s not worth it. I totally believe in spending money on experiences rather than stuff.

I was just a little surprised at exactly how much I spent for just 4 race weekends, especially considering I’m pretty far down towards the bottom of the “low budget” end of the spectrum.

I've got a slow, reliable car that’s cheap to run. I’m easy on the hardware. I seem to be one of the few guys left who’s still driving to events rather than investing in trailers and tow vehicles. My only real luxury (if you can call it that) was staying in decent hotels. Even if I stayed at fleabag motels, it would only save me a couple of hundred bucks per weekend. 

In reply to Klayfish :

I'm with you here; even in the three months I've spent around racing, I've discovered that I'm more into the experience of driving rather than the cars themselves. And heck, driver mods are some of the more reliable ones out there, right? 

LanEvo said:

Agree. I’m not saying it’s not worth it. I totally believe in spending money on experiences rather than stuff.

I was just a little surprised at exactly how much I spent for just 4 race weekends, especially considering I’m pretty far down towards the bottom of the “low budget” end of the spectrum.

I've got a slow, reliable car that’s cheap to run. I’m easy on the hardware. I seem to be one of the few guys left who’s still driving to events rather than investing in trailers and tow vehicles. My only real luxury (if you can call it that) was staying in decent hotels. Even if I stayed at fleabag motels, it would only save me a couple of hundred bucks per weekend. 

With you 100%.  Totally agree.  Definitely won't do the flea bag motels either, just wasn't for me.

Wizard_Of_Maz said:

In reply to Klayfish :

I'm with you here; even in the three months I've spent around racing, I've discovered that I'm more into the experience of driving rather than the cars themselves. And heck, driver mods are some of the more reliable ones out there, right? 

Yes, driver mods are very reliable.  Understanding the car you're driving, what it can and can't do, and learning some level of mechanical sympathy goes a long way. 

The experience of being on the race track is what it's all about, at least for me.  Not gonna lie, the faster the car is, the more fun it can be.  I love driving class A cars when I get the chance.  But I've had the opportunity to drive the following vehicles on a race track: Rolls Royce Silver Shadow, Citroen SM and a pick up truck with a Seasprite boat body attached to it.  They were all a blast, and I doubt many people can lay claim to having similar experiences.

I keep every receipt because being cheap I want to know so I can always evaluate if it's worth it. 

The car after 30 years has $8800 in it, this may go down as I sell off some more stuff but not by much. 

I have a $7,000 camper van (cheap motel on wheels) with a $500 trailer. We've both of these for over a decade. 

My built up motor that went kablamo cost me $92 per event, I use one set of tires per year (two vintage race weekends and 4 track days) at $886 per set.  Gassing up the van sets me back $375 - $390 per year depending on the price of gas. Race gas for the Datsun runs me $240. Entry fees for the vintage events are $975 (instructing at track days covers the entry). As I'm only doing 6 events a year my futile replacement costs are really cheap; the motor only holds 3 1/2 quarts and the tranny uses 1.2 liters. $39 last year. 

So one the average year I'm spending $3000 - $3200 per season on the Datsun. I run local events (the track is 60 miles from my house) so that obviously cuts down the costs. I have calculate the extra expense for out of town events and the van would swallow another $120-$150 in gasoline. 

If I amortize the cost of the van and trailer plus consumalbles that adds $785 per season. 

Amortizing the cost of the Datsun is a little more discuss because from 89 - 91 is was an autocross car while we were converting it to a road race car. Then in 96 & 97 I ran the Showroom Stock Miata, I only did one or two events with the those two years. Then from in 98 I sold it only to get it back in 2003. So I've actually only run the car for something like 20 seasons. So I'll call that $450 per season for the car.

For just the Datsun I'm spending $4500 per year if we calculate the cost of the car and tow vehicle.

Now throw in the F500 I autocross; I've had it 4 years and have $4000 in it (it's actually $3986) and I've purchased two sets of tires (it came with a fresh set) so I'm spending $750 a season. I do 6-8 events a year with it. Max spend on entry fees are $240, I use 16 gallons of fuel $115 (uses pre-mix). The autocross site is 9 mile from my house so the van needs $6 in gas so right on $50 per year. All in I'm at $2,100 to $2,200 per season for autocross (I could a more exact number if I went to the garage and got the receipt book). So autocross is racer pricey for seat time but we all knew that.

So if we add my autocross and track events I'm spending $6,000 to $6,800 every year. 

It hasn't been until recently (last 6-7 years) that I could afford to spend this amount. For many many years my anual budget was $3,000. I bought used tires, had a more Miley tuned motor (it did 62 races) and used the stock 4 speed gearbox. 

If I really want to go total low  budget for vintage races I'd go with a 1.6 Miata, drive to events. I'd leave the house at 4 A.M. Saturday for out of town events and only get a room on Saturday night. You could also run used race tires or 200 tread wear to stretch the budget even more.  Doing that would make it possible for me to do 5-7 events for about $1800 -$2100 a year. We have an NA Miata that is now a spare car that's got Spec Miata suspension on it so I'd just need a cage (I have an extra race seat) and belts. We'd have $3,800 in it race prepped as we only have 3K in the car.

With all of the above said the one thing to remember is I'm running between 5th to 9th overall in the Datsun (depending on the group I get put in) out of groups of 18 to 25 cars. I'm a better than average driver so that helps, an average driver would probably be 9th to 15th with the car.

You can go racing for stupid cheap if you don't care where you finish or what you drive.  The trick for me is I've never owned a new car. The most I've ever spent is 17K for the 2011 Outback I purchased 4 years ago. 

Please don't look at thus as a highjack post. Here was my cost for racing a oval kart in 2015 with two different drivers.

4x8 New open trailer: $500

Class 2 Hitch and Wiring for 2004 Crown Vic: $250

2005 Laser roller from an old racing buddy: $500

6.5 Hp Predator engine with Quick Release Throttle Cable Plate and Heat Shield: $200

Used Bully Two Disk Clutch after rebuild: $300

Set of New Maxxis ELs rolled with prep:$300

Other parts, tools, and kart stand: Already had.

Per race cost for dirt oval tracks.

Entry Fee: $25-$40 depending on the event.

87 Ethanol-free.Gas for Car and Kart: $25 for 90 miles round trip. 

Oil: $ 10

Gate fee: $12

Tire Prep: $25 quart. 1.5 Races per quart, Plus $10 for WD-40, Gloves, and Hand Soap.

Luckily, No major Kart damage.

Tom1200 said:

I keep every receipt because being cheap I want to know so I can always evaluate if it's worth it. 

The car after 30 years has $8800 in it, this may go down as I sell off some more stuff but not by much. 

I have a $7,000 camper van (cheap motel on wheels) with a $500 trailer. We've both of these for over a decade. 

My built up motor that went kablamo cost me $92 per event, I use one set of tires per year (two vintage race weekends and 4 track days) at $886 per set.  Gassing up the van sets me back $375 - $390 per year depending on the price of gas. Race gas for the Datsun runs me $240. Entry fees for the vintage events are $975 (instructing at track days covers the entry). As I'm only doing 6 events a year my futile replacement costs are really cheap; the motor only holds 3 1/2 quarts and the tranny uses 1.2 liters. $39 last year. 

So one the average year I'm spending $3000 - $3200 per season on the Datsun. I run local events (the track is 60 miles from my house) so that obviously cuts down the costs. I have calculate the extra expense for out of town events and the van would swallow another $120-$150 in gasoline. 

If I amortize the cost of the van and trailer plus consumalbles that adds $785 per season. 

Amortizing the cost of the Datsun is a little more discuss because from 89 - 91 is was an autocross car while we were converting it to a road race car. Then in 96 & 97 I ran the Showroom Stock Miata, I only did one or two events with the those two years. Then from in 98 I sold it only to get it back in 2003. So I've actually only run the car for something like 20 seasons. So I'll call that $450 per season for the car.

For just the Datsun I'm spending $4500 per year if we calculate the cost of the car and tow vehicle.

Now throw in the F500 I autocross; I've had it 4 years and have $4000 in it (it's actually $3986) and I've purchased two sets of tires (it came with a fresh set) so I'm spending $750 a season. I do 6-8 events a year with it. Max spend on entry fees are $240, I use 16 gallons of fuel $115 (uses pre-mix). The autocross site is 9 mile from my house so the van needs $6 in gas so right on $50 per year. All in I'm at $2,100 to $2,200 per season for autocross (I could a more exact number if I went to the garage and got the receipt book). So autocross is racer pricey for seat time but we all knew that.

So if we add my autocross and track events I'm spending $6,000 to $6,800 every year. 

It hasn't been until recently (last 6-7 years) that I could afford to spend this amount. For many many years my anual budget was $3,000. I bought used tires, had a more Miley tuned motor (it did 62 races) and used the stock 4 speed gearbox. 

If I really want to go total low  budget for vintage races I'd go with a 1.6 Miata, drive to events. I'd leave the house at 4 A.M. Saturday for out of town events and only get a room on Saturday night. You could also run used race tires or 200 tread wear to stretch the budget even more.  Doing that would make it possible for me to do 5-7 events for about $1800 -$2100 a year. We have an NA Miata that is now a spare car that's got Spec Miata suspension on it so I'd just need a cage (I have an extra race seat) and belts. We'd have $3,800 in it race prepped as we only have 3K in the car.

With all of the above said the one thing to remember is I'm running between 5th to 9th overall in the Datsun (depending on the group I get put in) out of groups of 18 to 25 cars. I'm a better than average driver so that helps, an average driver would probably be 9th to 15th with the car.

You can go racing for stupid cheap if you don't care where you finish or what you drive.  The trick for me is I've never owned a new car. The most I've ever spent is 17K for the 2011 Outback I purchased 4 years ago. 

When I Vintage raced  my costs were similar except my entry costs  were paid for by customer in exchange for supervision  and any needed mechanical work.  He also paid transportation  because I hauled both his and my car using his trailer and suburban. 

Tires would last at least a season. But oil was a major expense.  5 &1/2. Gallons plus tranny plus the quick change.  

The engine went 14 years between overhauls.