The lightweight sporty wagon thread.

Inspired by the sporty wagons thread. Lets discuss lightweight wagons. Preferably those that handle well and get decent mileage. Only 3 come to mind immediately. What others do you guys know of?

Saturn SW2 (95)
124hp
124tq
25/35mpg
2400lbs
Engine swap options: None. Stock motor responds well to bolt ons. ST prep would put it around 135 at the wheels.
Trans swap options: MP2 (SOHC model) which gives longer gears and a 0.62:1 5th. ~2800rpm @ 80mph. Fck yeah. Also, the 5th can be swapped separately without removing the trans.
Aftermarket: Poor.
Suspension: McFail on all 4 corners. Goofy front swaybar. Fitting > than a 15x8/225-45 would be difficult.

Protege 5 (2002)
130hp
135tq
25/31mpg
2700lbs
Engine swap options: Mazdaspeed turbo motor?
Trans swap options: ?
Aftermarket: Probably decent.
Suspension: McFail on all 4 corners?

Corolla Wagon (95)
105hp
110tq
2400lbs
28/34mpg
Engine swap options: A bunch? 20V 4age? 2zz?
Trans swap options: See above?
Aftermarket: ?
Suspension: McFail on all 4 corners?

What spawned this thread is my eventual urge to replace the car I sold earlier this year:

What else is out there? Old ass escort? Anything in the <2500 range that could benefit from a decent high-power swap and still get good mileage?

Jensen GT?

There are JDM Corolla wagons that came with 20Vs in them, the BZ-touring (looks like the '95 wagon, but with a sporty body kit) and the Z-touring (never liked the shape of it...looks like a hearse). Aftermarket's not bad for them, and yes it's McP on all four corners.

There are the older TE-series 'rolla wagons too, they're even lighter and RWD

Gets killed on the gas mileage, but the early Impreza.

What do you consider sporty? Are you thinking beyond power:weight? FWD is a pretty immediate deal killer for me when I think "sporty" with very few exceptions. I mean, with that list above, an old Cavalier wagon would be on par, and I don't consider those particularly sporty. At the same time, some of the old Japanese wagons were RWD and really light, but had horrible suspensions and engines for the most part.

Oh yeah, and what do you consider lightweight?

Bryce

Toyota Sienna with 2JZ and manual floor shifter.

2000 Hyundai Elantra Wagon. 140hp/133tq, 2600lbs, 4 wheel disc brakes, 23/32mpg

The Beta turbos really well.... they like boost. Later Tib suspension parts work nicely (sway bars, struts/springs). Finding one not ragged out would be the hard part.

How good are you at swapping WRX bits into a 90's Loyale wagon?

AMC Hornet Sportabout / Eagle Wagon can be pretty light (started life in the 2700's IIRC).

ProDarwin wrote: Inspired by the sporty wagons thread. Lets discuss lightweight wagons. Preferably those that handle well and get decent mileage. Only 3 come to mind immediately. What others do you guys know of? Saturn SW2 (95) 124hp 124tq 25/35mpg 2400lbs Engine swap options: None. Stock motor responds well to bolt ons. *ST prep would put it around 135 at the wheels. Trans swap options: MP2 (SOHC model) which gives longer gears and a 0.62:1 5th. ~2800rpm @ 80mph. F*ck yeah. Also, the 5th can be swapped separately without removing the trans. Aftermarket: Poor. Suspension: McFail on all 4 corners. Goofy front swaybar. Fitting > than a 15x8/225-45 would be difficult. Protege 5 (2002) 130hp 135tq 25/31mpg 2700lbs Engine swap options: Mazdaspeed turbo motor? Trans swap options: ? Aftermarket: Probably decent. Suspension: McFail on all 4 corners? Corolla Wagon (95) 105hp 110tq 2400lbs 28/34mpg Engine swap options: A bunch? 20V 4age? 2zz? Trans swap options: See above? Aftermarket: ? Suspension: McFail on all 4 corners? What spawned this thread is my eventual urge to replace the car I sold earlier this year: http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/ProDarwin/94%20SW2/IMG_0455.jpg What else is out there? Old ass escort? Anything in the <2500 range that could benefit from a decent high-power swap and still get good mileage?

FWIW, Mazdaspeed turbo motor when talking about the P5 is actually the same motor that's in the P5. Just with a terrible turbo kit.

If you want more reliable power in a P5, the best combination of easy and cheap lies with a KL V6 swap.

The easiest way but probably harder on the wallet is to turbo the stock motor. Unfortunately, i would personally NOT bother with turboing the stock motor unless step 1 was: Build motor.

Escort wagon has potential. BP swap is easy. KL swap is also not bad.

If we really want to get dumb, Camry wagon. Dump a 3sgte in one. Alternatively, find a V6 model and do a 5spd swap.

Honestly out of your options there, i'm liking the Corolla wagon.

Ford Focus comes in a wagon. Is it sporty? Yeah, kinda, I guess.

How old can we go? Datsun 510 wagon is sporty.

I always liked these:

I use to have a 2000 Escort manual (replaced it with that Lancer from the other thread), it was the epitome of driving slow cars fast. Lots of hand-brake turns in the snow and I couldn't get much under 28mpg in the city. A co-worker suggested a turbo....

The Elantra wagon would get my vote though.

This list isn't soley for me, lets spread the love to all of GRM. What I meant by sporty was you can toss a stiff suspension on them, a rear swaybar and wheels and tires and have a lot of fun. None will compete with a Miata, but wont be embarrassing at a track day either. Yes, a cavalier wagon has similar specs to the above list, but is a complete turd-pile.

I ruled out the Subarus due to terrible mileage, but the older imprezas would qualify as lightweight. I was thinking that the P5 would be at the upper end of "lightweight". Was targeting more around the 2500 range.

Good call on the Elantra.

With the added info, i am changing my vote solidly to Corolla and refusing to budge.

Hmmmmm, what about a Volvo 1800ES???

VERY cool bone stock,.....

OR with a few mods

WAAAAAY classier then anything else so far......

The elantra is my vote. It can handle copious amounts of boost, and it can be found for challenge money

ProDarwin wrote: Yes, a cavalier wagon has similar specs to the above list, but is a complete turd-pile.

Tell that to X-Args and his Cavalier Wagon he had in Lemons. They made it to at least 9th in one race which is a very good finish, much better than an actual turd pile would do. They can be made to handle and can be made fast and reliable.

Ford Fairmont gets my vote....

My 74 AMC Service Manual shows a 232/Auto Hornet Sportabout at 2908 Lbs, and the AMC I-6 is a very, very heavy all-iron motor. There could be some potential here...

Craigloveswagons wrote: I use to have a 2000 Escort manual (replaced it with that Lancer from the other thread), it was the epitome of driving slow cars fast. Lots of hand-brake turns in the snow and I couldn't get much under 28mpg in the city. A co-worker suggested a turbo.... The Elantra wagon would get my vote though.

Wrong! My 1994 escort manual wagon is about the same car, but with 22 LESS horsepower! ;)

Joey

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: With the added info, i am changing my vote solidly to Corolla and refusing to budge.

What motors can be easily dumped in a Corolla? Just a 4AGE?
Just looked up the old escort. 88HP? Holy crap? How easy is a swap that makes >150hp?

When I say easy swap, I mean no custom fabbing mounts and whatnot. Like order off the shelf only.

Javelin: The AMC is cool, but a little obscure. Would definitely be a cool build.

I'm not choosing a new car, or even seriously considering anything. Simply daydreaming and looking at all the options. Figured this could be a good thread to consolidate small, lightweight GRM wagon information.

I'd got for an Escort wagon and start swapping bits. When done I don't expect much but the shell and interior (ewww) of the escort would remain, but it could be made into a hell of a cheap fun wagon.

i want my '79 corolla wagon back.

bad.

dont forget teh focus wagon.

it ditches the IRS of the hatchback in favor of a torsion beam

but the rest is pretty much the same I think.

ProDarwin wrote:

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: With the added info, i am changing my vote solidly to Corolla and refusing to budge.

What motors can be easily dumped in a Corolla? Just a 4AGE? Just looked up the old escort. 88HP? Holy crap? How easy is a swap that makes >150hp? When I say easy swap, I mean no custom fabbing mounts and whatnot. Like order off the shelf only. Javelin: The AMC is cool, but a little obscure. Would definitely be a cool build. I'm not choosing a new car, or even seriously considering anything. Simply daydreaming and looking at all the options. Figured this could be a good thread to consolidate small, lightweight GRM wagon information.

4age (including silvertop and blacktop), 4agze, 7afe, "7age," etc etc etc... Pretty much any "A" motor. I'm also reasonably sure that there's a few people working on the details for swapping in the newer "ZZ" motors, which could be 180hp out of the box.

As for the Escort... simple turbo setup would be easy for 150hp. Or a BP swap (EGT/protege donor) would get you around 130hp, add some bolt ons. Or turbo it (stupid easy with that layout) for well over 200. KL swap can be pretty much bolt in with some parts bin engineering (also read: don't do what i did), and will get you up to 200hp out the gate.

Where the escort gets REALLY interesting is if you have a decent MX3 V6 donor. Everything, and i mean damn near EVERYTHING will swap over and bolt up. You want wider track? Use MX3 suspension stuff. Better brakes? Mx3 stuff. Cooler interior? MX3 stuff. Everything you need to mount a V6? MX3 stuff. The trans for the V6? MX3 stuff.

You can make an MX3 look like an Escort Wagon, but handle, sound, and feel like an MX3 V6. It won't weigh more, either.

I'm still going with Corolla because there's more aftermarket, and i'd rather sit inside a Corolla than sit inside an Escort. And i think they look better. And the swaps probably take less time. (Not that the Escort is harder, just more time consuming, imo.)