The ST we deserve, but not the ST we need.

In reply to pinchvalve :

My beef over the Forester XT (and it's even-rarer and stranger brother, the Baja XT) was that they were the heaviest vehicle to get the turbo 2.5L but still got the least-powerful 2.5T. The STi had 300hp, the Legacy GT had 250hp and the Forester/Baja XT had 210hp. Granted, now that I own a 165hp NA Baja, I would gladly take another 45hp.

Also, I looked up the performance specs of the '17 Edge Sport and it does 0-60 in 5.6s and a 14.2s quarter mile at 92mph. It seems like if the trans is properly geared, with the power bump, the ST could be into the 13s and run low 5 second 0-60mph blasts. How much faster does a CUV need to be? Hope Ford gives it some stout brakes.

i'd like to see a comparison of this new Edge ST vs. a regular Edge with a tune, i know these ecoboost's take real well to a tune and i'd imagine you could easily get more then the 20 hp bump with the ST package.

NickD said:

Also, I looked up the performance specs of the '17 Edge Sport and it does 0-60 in 5.6s and a 14.2s quarter mile at 92mph. It seems like if the trans is properly geared, with the power bump, the ST could be into the 13s and run low 5 second 0-60mph blasts. How much faster does a CUV need to be? Hope Ford gives it some stout brakes.

E36 M3. Which means it's probably as fast as my Mustang. That's just ....  

That's not such a hateful thing to look at. I hope it Spurs some competition in that segment. I must be getting older because CUVs are becoming more appealingl.

Ive been thinking lately about the small suv/crossovers. 

Is it just me, or are they essentially lifted station wagon/hatchbacks? Slam them a few inches, and see what i see....

Let's say, for whatever reason/rationalization, I had decided a hot SUV was the ticket.  Would I spend circa $45k on a Ford Edge ST when circa $50k gets me into a Porsche Macan?  

pres589 said:

Let's say, for whatever reason/rationalization, I had decided a hot SUV was the ticket.  Would I spend circa $45k on a Ford Edge ST when circa $50k gets me into a Porsche Macan?  

The Macan S is the closest in power and that starts at $55+k. And the Ford would likely be cheaper to own in the long run, cheaper parts and consumables and such.

If you want to talk bad value, look at the Chevrolet Equinox. We have new '18s on our lot for $41-$43K and they only have a 170hp 1.5T.

In reply to NickD :

This article claims the 8 speed will be standard across 2018 Edge models. But you're right, it's not for me. I'm not convinced that there is much call for a kinda sporty mid size crossover, so I don't know that GM should be overly concerned anymore than they should've been in recent years with the "Sport" trims of the Edge, Flex and Explorer being sold. That being said, I think it makes sense for Ford to offer this from a business perspective. It gives them a chance to pad margins with minimal investment. I understand that. But it waters down the ST brand a little if this thing isn't a blast to hoon around (and lets be honest, what are the odds of that?). It seems like Ford probably knows that buyers for this thing aren't going to throw it into corners, so they did the minimum requirement to put a slightly different shine on existing hardware, slap the right badge on it and up sell it while marketing the heck out of the "ST" brand. It's not going to get people excited in the same way as a full effort like a Jeep TrackHawk, Durango SRT, or the various flavors of German Hot Rods that seem to get a lot more unique hardware and more impressive specs. And parking lot bragging rights are what buyers of these mega SUVs really crave. They buy them because they're ridiculous, not because they're slightly more capable through corners.

In reply to NickD :

Isn't the Macan all about image?  Most people that care about any of these vehicles are only interested in appearance of cost.  

Porsche badge on a little SUV > Ford badge on any sized SUV

LATE ADDITION EDIT: How did someone spec up an '18 Equinox like that?  Smaller of the two engines at top end pricing?

In reply to pres589 :

Fair enough. Then again people are lining up to drop $400k on a Ford when that money would get them into a more prestigious-sounding brand in a market that is arguably the most image-related (the supercar market)

pointofdeparture said:

This is novel and unexpected, but what would REALLY get me into a Ford dealer is a ST variant of the upcoming Ranger.

They could call it... wait for it... THE POWER RANGER!

I kill me.

Once you start adding options that comes standard on lower market cars then that Macan will be 70k lol. Porsche will option you into a mortgage payment.

pres589 said:

In reply to NickD :

Isn't the Macan all about image?  Most people that care about any of these vehicles are only interested in appearance of cost. 

I've seen a Macan S hustled around an autocross course, and it was astonishingly competent for what it is.

NickD said:

pres589 said:

Let's say, for whatever reason/rationalization, I had decided a hot SUV was the ticket.  Would I spend circa $45k on a Ford Edge ST when circa $50k gets me into a Porsche Macan?  

The Macan S is the closest in power and that starts at $55+k. And the Ford would likely be cheaper to own in the long run, cheaper parts and consumables and such.

If you want to talk bad value, look at the Chevrolet Equinox. We have new '18s on our lot for $41-$43K and they only have a 170hp 1.5T.

Don't forget the GLA45 AMG. $50K and up depending on the option boxes. 375hp and a claimed 4.3 0-60. I think the most shocking thing is that Ford is playing (or attempting to) in this arena. 

mazdeuce - Seth said:

NickD said:

pres589 said:

Let's say, for whatever reason/rationalization, I had decided a hot SUV was the ticket.  Would I spend circa $45k on a Ford Edge ST when circa $50k gets me into a Porsche Macan?  

The Macan S is the closest in power and that starts at $55+k. And the Ford would likely be cheaper to own in the long run, cheaper parts and consumables and such.

If you want to talk bad value, look at the Chevrolet Equinox. We have new '18s on our lot for $41-$43K and they only have a 170hp 1.5T.

Don't forget the GLA45 AMG. $50K and up depending on the option boxes. 375hp and a claimed 4.3 0-60. I think the most shocking thing is that Ford is playing (or attempting to) in this arena. 

Yeah, but then you are at the mercy of corporate Mercedes when it breaks due to a known design flaw 

It looks like the 2019 regular Edge model will only have a turbo 2.0L.  The ST will be the only model with a different engine.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/2019-ford-edge-four-cylinder-only-more-standard-safety-tech-news

NickD said:

mazdeuce - Seth said:

NickD said:

pres589 said:

Let's say, for whatever reason/rationalization, I had decided a hot SUV was the ticket.  Would I spend circa $45k on a Ford Edge ST when circa $50k gets me into a Porsche Macan?  

The Macan S is the closest in power and that starts at $55+k. And the Ford would likely be cheaper to own in the long run, cheaper parts and consumables and such.

If you want to talk bad value, look at the Chevrolet Equinox. We have new '18s on our lot for $41-$43K and they only have a 170hp 1.5T.

Don't forget the GLA45 AMG. $50K and up depending on the option boxes. 375hp and a claimed 4.3 0-60. I think the most shocking thing is that Ford is playing (or attempting to) in this arena. 

Yeah, but then you are at the mercy of corporate Mercedes when it breaks due to a known design flaw 

Massaging chair in the waiting area. Totally worth it. 

In reply to Snrub :

Ahhh, so the ST is essentially taking the place of the old Sport and then getting further upgrades. That makes sense.

rslifkin said:

In reply to STM317 :

I'm curious what the differences in suspension, etc. are from the Sport.  Depending on the price difference between Sport and ST, it might be a big enough difference if there are adequate non-power improvements.  

My understanding is that the "Sport" model will be no more.  

In my opinion this is a solid move.  The ST package not only gets more power, which is nothing to sneeze at with a 335hp twin turbo v6, but it also gets revised suspension, larger brakes, fully manual paddle shifters, additional seat bolstering, and summer tires, in addition to the cosmetic tweaks inside and out.  

So, while this may elicit a "huh"? from "car guys" who bemoan another CUV... that's where the market is, and a legit ST package is less confusing than a "Sport" model.  I'd say it's a solid move in branding the ST packaging in terms of brand awareness.  The ST version, regardless of model (Fiesta, Focus, etc.) is something special.  

I see entirely too much complaining over this thing's existence.  CUV's are basically jacked up hatchbacks on car platforms, and Ford isn't the first to play in the hot CUV sandbox... X5M, SQ5, SRT8 GC, etc. etc. 

It's not something I'd buy, but I'm happy it exists.  

rslifkin said:

So when do we get the RS version with the 3.5 EB?  Preferably turned up to Raptor power levels...

There's a fair bit of support for the 2.7 currently as most of the Ford/Mazda tuners and hard parts manufacturers picked up the platform after DISI/Duratec aged out. I bet you could massage 425+ out of that Edge pretty easily.

I'm not a huge fan of this but what makes money makes money. If they're profitable enough occasionally they let the engineers loose on an affordable funship

Dusterbd13 said:

Ive been thinking lately about the small suv/crossovers. 

Is it just me, or are they essentially lifted station wagon/hatchbacks? Slam them a few inches, and see what i see....

We've had this discussion before. 

I wanted to "complain about this thing's existence" but I can't.  It's a sleeper factory hot rod that looks like any other trendy crossover on the road.  I love sleepers.  The more I think about it the more I want to drive one.

In reply to BlueInGreen44 :

Yeah, I have no real need for a crossover, but I'd like to take one for a rip. I think it could be amusing to hoon. I'd probably throw an exhaust and intake at it, which would ruin the sleeper effect, but Raptor noises from a CUV would be funny.

Yeah, 335hp/380lb-ft in a crossover this size with a properly geared 8-speed auto ought to feel downright jaunty.

To me the question is whether it will be appreciably faster than a heavier, less (sportingly) pretentious Flex Ecoboost you could have gotten 5 years ago.   

I can't say that any 2.7 car is slow, but the acceleration numbers in the equipped cars are slightly underwhelming vs expectations. For example, the Fusion Sport with 325hp and AWD doesn't get down the 1/4 mile much quicker/faster than the standard array of ~270hp FWD sedans. If you compare it to a BMW 340i xdrive that's also a ~320hp awd midsize... It's REAL ugly.  Lincoln's 400 hp 3.0 version is fairly slow compared to other 400+hp sedans.  Roughly the same acceleration as my old ~340hp Lexus that weighed the same..Etc

 If the Edge ST runs ~14.2 in the 1/4, it'll still be fast for an SUV, but it won't really be differentiated in the sense that a Focus or Fiesta ST is in a whole different ballpark than other trim levels. 

Vigo said:

Yeah, 335hp/380lb-ft in a crossover this size with a properly geared 8-speed auto ought to feel downright jaunty.

To me the question is whether it will be appreciably faster than a heavier, less (sportingly) pretentious Flex Ecoboost you could have gotten 5 years ago.   

  

I can't say that any 2.7 car is slow, but the acceleration numbers in the equipped cars are slightly underwhelming vs expectations. For example, the Fusion Sport with 325hp and AWD doesn't get down the 1/4 mile much quicker/faster than the standard array of ~270hp FWD sedans. If you compare it to a BMW 340i xdrive that's also a ~320hp awd midsize... It's REAL ugly.  Lincoln's 400 hp 3.0 version is fairly slow compared to other 400+hp sedans.  Roughly the same acceleration as my old ~340hp Lexus that weighed the same..Etc

 If the Edge ST runs ~14.2 in the 1/4, it'll still be fast for an SUV, but it won't really be differentiated in the sense that a Focus or Fiesta ST is in a whole different ballpark than other trim levels. 

The old Edge Sport ran 14.2s in the 1/4. With the moderate power and big torque bump and more gears (which hopefully aren't geared like that Lexus 8-(or is it 10?) speed) then I would expect this thing to run high-13s or quicker.