Sleepers are great. That doesn't really look like a sleeper to me, and I'm not too warm and fuzzy over "another trendy crossover".
To yupididit: Try to name a feature that isn't on the standard Macan that I am going to miss. Going through the configurator, the only thing I probably care about is the paint ($700 for a nicer shade of white, because red isn't worth $3200) and maybe good floormats just because I didn't go through that far.
The old Edge Sport ran 14.2s in the 1/4. With the moderate power and big torque bump and more gears (which hopefully aren't geared like that Lexus 8-(or is it 10?) speed) then I would expect this thing to run high-13s or quicker.
I don't know if the two gears and negligible power bump over a Fusion Sport is going to make up for the ~700lb weight difference, and the Fusion Sport seems to 'barely' crack 13s in most tests. Either way, the Edge will be fast. I just wonder if there will be enough 'new content' in the ST that it doesn't just cheapen the ST level and i don't see them getting that 'new news' with acceleration.
If the current Fusion Sport were called an ST, wouldn't we be disappointed that they were throwing the name around like that because it doesn't handle?
pres589 said:Sleepers are great. That doesn't really look like a sleeper to me, and I'm not too warm and fuzzy over "another trendy crossover".
To yupididit: Try to name a feature that isn't on the standard Macan that I am going to miss. Going through the configurator, the only thing I probably care about is the paint ($700 for a nicer shade of white, because red isn't worth $3200) and maybe good floormats just because I didn't go through that far.
Im a fancy fellow then 
In reply to Vigo :
I think the current Fusion could be an ST with suspension, brake, seat, and most importantly, tire tweaks. The motor is the easy part. I know YOU could make it better with an afternoon and a pile of the right parts, and so could Ford.
I've been in a Maccan and a GLA45, not to mention a Cayenne (which is WAY bigger) and they all had handling and acceleration limits that were higher than stock Corvettes of recent memory. There's no reason Ford can't make the Edge worthy of the ST badge, and the Fusion for that matter. Now whether they will or not, we'll see.
Yikes, just saw where the '18 Yukon Denali starts at $45k and only has a 252hp 2.0T that is slower than the '16-earlier 3.6L V6. I'd certainly take the Edge ST over that.
In reply to NickD :
Are there people that will be cross shopping a full-size, RWD biased, body on frame, luxo SUV with 3 rows of seating to a mid-size, unibody, FWD biased, 2 row sport crossover? They seem like different buyers to me.
In reply to STM317 :
Whoops Terrain Denali, not Yukon. Yukons start at like $75k these days, Yukon Denalis will break $90k if optioned right.
In reply to NickD :
That makes way more sense!
In reply to STM317 :
Also, the fact that this is the shifting mechanism on the Terrain earns it instant penalty points in my book.
I think the current Fusion could be an ST with suspension, brake, seat, and most importantly, tire tweaks. The motor is the easy part. I know YOU could make it better with an afternoon and a pile of the right parts, and so could Ford.
I've been in a Maccan and a GLA45, not to mention a Cayenne (which is WAY bigger) and they all had handling and acceleration limits that were higher than stock Corvettes of recent memory. There's no reason Ford can't make the Edge worthy of the ST badge, and the Fusion for that matter. Now whether they will or not, we'll see.
I agree with you. I'm basically just predicting that the Edge will be the first ST that didn't elevate the base model into a whole different league.
Also, i'm pretty ok with button shifters on an auto. I like the current crop of knobs/buttons better than the stupid 'tiny regular shifters' they were putting in high end cars back in the early 2000s.
Newsflash to those bemoaning another sporty CUV. The market isn't buying sedans. IT's already been announced that that Fusion will not be replaced. CUV's are todays family sedans. Until the pendulum swings beck the other way the ship has sailed.
What excites me most is that unlike the old Edge Sport you can get the tow package with it. We're on our second Edge. Our 17 had the 2.0L Ecoboost and our 18 has the Duratec V6. The only reason we didn't get the Sport was the tow hitch as we regularly tow a 1,900lb (empty) pop up camper. I'm excited about this. We loved our 16 Explorer Sport, the best 'car' we've ever had. This could be epic :)
Note. Someone will point out the Sport was available with the tow hitch, but that was a dealer installed option not factory installed. As these are my company cars, I can only order factory options.
Vigo said:The old Edge Sport ran 14.2s in the 1/4. With the moderate power and big torque bump and more gears (which hopefully aren't geared like that Lexus 8-(or is it 10?) speed) then I would expect this thing to run high-13s or quicker.
I don't know if the two gears and negligible power bump over a Fusion Sport is going to make up for the ~700lb weight difference, and the Fusion Sport seems to 'barely' crack 13s in most tests. Either way, the Edge will be fast. I just wonder if there will be enough 'new content' in the ST that it doesn't just cheapen the ST level and i don't see them getting that 'new news' with acceleration.
If the current Fusion Sport were called an ST, wouldn't we be disappointed that they were throwing the name around like that because it doesn't handle?
700 pounds??? The difference is less than half that. FuSpo: 4128, Edge Sport: 4437. Granted, that's because the FuSpo is kind of a fat pig for what it is, but still.
Adrian_Thompson said:Newsflash to those bemoaning another sporty CUV. The market isn't buying sedans.
THAT is exactly what we're bemoaning.
Duke said:Adrian_Thompson said:Newsflash to those bemoaning another sporty CUV. The market isn't buying sedans.
THAT is exactly what we're bemoaning.
Then get out there and start buying them. If people want them, they'd buy them. Automakers sell cars people want to buy, not cars that cheapskates may buy in 5-10 years when they are down to 25-50% of original sale price.
Adrian_Thompson said:Duke said:Adrian_Thompson said:Newsflash to those bemoaning another sporty CUV. The market isn't buying sedans.
THAT is exactly what we're bemoaning.
Then get out there and start buying them. If people want them, they'd buy them. Automakers sell cars people want to buy, not cars that cheapskates may buy in 5-10 years when they are down to 25-50% of original sale price.
Just did that for DW, thanks. And in a couple years, I'll buy another one for me.
No one is arguing that automakers try to sell what they think people will buy. We're bemoaning what so many people seem to want to buy.
In reply to Adrian_Thompson :
I dont see many people here bemoaning another sporty crossover. I think most of us understand why Ford has gone this direction considering what market research seems to show. What I see, is people questioning whether this will be worthy of the ST badge or not. With previous ST models, Ford has taken mundane vehicles and given them unique engines, suspensions, exterior design, etc and they've come up with sporty, engaging stuff that competes at the top of it's class in performance. I guess we'll have to wait and see if it's performance backs up its badges or not. But on the surface, this looks like a less complete effort to some.
STM317 said:In reply to Adrian_Thompson :
I dont see many people here bemoaning another sporty crossover. I think most of us understand why Ford has gone this direction considering what market research seems to show. What I see, is people questioning whether this will be worthy of the ST badge or not. With previous ST models, Ford has taken mundane vehicles and given them unique engines, suspensions, exterior design, etc and they've come up with sporty, engaging stuff that competes at the top of it's class in performance. I guess we'll have to wait and see if it's performance backs up its badges or not. But on the surface, this looks like a less complete effort to some.
The one time I will get into this- IMHO, it's pretty awesome that people are concerned about the worthiness of the ST badge. That says a lot that it's even a question to ask.
Especially when the idea of a "unique engine" is added- and none of them really are- the Fiesta ST motor was the economy motor in the Escape, and the Focus ST motor was the "v6" for the Escape, Fusion, and Edge. The entire reason you can get the vehicles so reasonably is that the engine is very mass produced for another car.
This is really no different- it's a performance engine for that particular car, but almost the same as the high volume engine used for another car.
It's pretty amazing that Ford has gotten into a position where one even needs to question what ST means.
In reply to STM317 :
Sport Vs ST is way more than badging. I wont go into it for obvious reasons, but there are very specific parameters a vehicle has to meet before receiving the ST label, the sport didn't meet those.....
In reply to STM317 :
This is EXACTLY my issue with the Edge ST. Personally, I think it's silly, but Ford may just sell a boatload of them. I've known several people that complained that they'd have bought a Focus ST if it was offered with an automatic, so maybe this isn't too far off the mark.
Adrian_Thompson said:In reply to STM317 :
Sport Vs ST is way more than badging. I wont go into it for obvious reasons, but there are very specific parameters a vehicle has to meet before receiving the ST label, the sport didn't meet those.....
Cool! That's reassuring
I hear the phrase "Not unique/different enough" being bandied around. I'm baffled. It has an engine that is now specific to only that trim level in the lineup with modifications (tune and exhaust, I'm guessing) that give it a 20hp/40lb-ft bump. The only trim level to have paddle-shifters on the 8-speed auto. Upgraded ST-specific suspension. Upgraded ST-specific brakes. Upgraded interior. Unique front and rear fascias and badging. Unique 21"(!) wheels. How much more do you want Ford to change?
alfadriver said:STM317 said:In reply to Adrian_Thompson :
I dont see many people here bemoaning another sporty crossover. I think most of us understand why Ford has gone this direction considering what market research seems to show. What I see, is people questioning whether this will be worthy of the ST badge or not. With previous ST models, Ford has taken mundane vehicles and given them unique engines, suspensions, exterior design, etc and they've come up with sporty, engaging stuff that competes at the top of it's class in performance. I guess we'll have to wait and see if it's performance backs up its badges or not. But on the surface, this looks like a less complete effort to some.
The one time I will get into this- IMHO, it's pretty awesome that people are concerned about the worthiness of the ST badge. That says a lot that it's even a question to ask.
Especially when the idea of a "unique engine" is added- and none of them really are- the Fiesta ST motor was the economy motor in the Escape, and the Focus ST motor was the "v6" for the Escape, Fusion, and Edge. The entire reason you can get the vehicles so reasonably is that the engine is very mass produced for another car.
This is really no different- it's a performance engine for that particular car, but almost the same as the high volume engine used for another car.
It's pretty amazing that Ford has gotten into a position where one even needs to question what ST means.
This sounds very vintage. What was it that started muscle cars? Big car engine in a small car? Add some sporty flair and you're selling cars! It's a good time to be an automobile enthusiast.
NickD said:I hear the phrase "Not unique/different enough" being bandied around. I'm baffled. It has an engine that is now specific to only that trim level in the lineup with modifications (tune and exhaust, I'm guessing) that give it a 20hp/40lb-ft bump. The only trim level to have paddle-shifters on the 8-speed auto. Upgraded ST-specific suspension. Upgraded ST-specific brakes. Upgraded interior. Unique front and rear fascias and badging. Unique 21"(!) wheels. How much more do you want Ford to change?
I think the part of your statement that I bolded is a big part of the perception. The engine has been available in this vehicle in lesser performing variants before. Instead of taking it a step further, they just eliminated the option in the lesser performing variants. That leaves room for people to associate the ST with the previous, lower performance versions of the Edge. Instead of having the sportiest trim level trickling down into the lower ranges, it seems like the lower ranges are trickling up into the sporty model. It's the opposite of the effect that halo cars should have. All previous ST vehicles have engines that aren't available in any other version of that model. If the Edge had never gotten any form of the 2.7 until now, then it would make it seem a lot more special.
The market has spoken, and it says "water down the ST brand"
Proud owner of a ~300whp Fiesta ST that I love dearly.
STM317 said:NickD said:I hear the phrase "Not unique/different enough" being bandied around. I'm baffled. It has an engine that is now specific to only that trim level in the lineup with modifications (tune and exhaust, I'm guessing) that give it a 20hp/40lb-ft bump. The only trim level to have paddle-shifters on the 8-speed auto. Upgraded ST-specific suspension. Upgraded ST-specific brakes. Upgraded interior. Unique front and rear fascias and badging. Unique 21"(!) wheels. How much more do you want Ford to change?
I think the part of your statement that I bolded is a big part of the perception. The engine has been available in this vehicle in lesser performing variants before. Instead of taking it a step further, they just eliminated the option in the lesser performing variants. That leaves room for people to associate the ST with the previous, lower performance versions of the Edge. Instead of having the sportiest trim level trickling down into the lower ranges, it seems like the lower ranges are trickling up into the sporty model. It's the opposite of the effect that halo cars should have. All previous ST vehicles have engines that aren't available in any other version of that model. If the Edge had never gotten any form of the 2.7 until now, then it would make it seem a lot more special.
So you are equating that since the OLD model could get a turbo V6 that the fact that the NEW model can only get a turbo v6 in the ST lowers the status of the car?
Unless I'm missing something, you can't get a turbo V6 in any other variant of the 2019 Edge. So that engine is unique to the Edge ST.
Seems like you are nitpicking that the Edge Sport came with this engine, and now they renamed that to Edge ST. Especially since this engine is available in the hundreds of thousands in a plain old pick up truck.
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