Tires - How old is too old?

In reply to Cloud9...68 :

Please do Follow up!

And yes the info is all over the place. But it seems well stored does ok . . 

Yes, he said as long as the tires aren't mounted (and therefore have the weight of the car pressing on them), it's even OK if they see sub-freezing temperatures.  I will definitely do a session this Saturday, and I'll let everybody know how the tires perform.

My buddy has a 1966 Chrysler 300. We drove to a tire shop across town on front tires that were 25 years old, and rears that were 30 years old. Not saying they're perfectly safe, but 10 year old tires sound pretty fresh.

Suprf1y said:

Knurled. said:

FWIW, I also believe that summer tires should be thrown out after two seasons and winter tires are only good for one.

We don't usually get much snow here but we switch to snows every winter and because of that can often get 8-10 years from both sets of tires on our vehicles. I checked the date on a set I'm putting on one of my summer cars the other day and it's 2009. I'll probably use them til they wear out, a few more years. 10 years is the rule I've always heard but I've never had a problem stretching that.

Not getting much snow is exactly why they should be changed out often.

I might put 10k on snow tires over a single season.  10k of mostly driving on non-snowy roads.  The rubber ages quickly.  The second season is noticably not as good as the first, and the third season they are no better than all-season tires when it is snowy.

I figure, winter tires are cheaper than wrecking a car, and if it means spending $600/year for new winter tires, that is money well spent.  People will spend $1000+ for autocross tires that are only good for 30-40 runs before they are aged out, and that is so they can maybe win a 99 cent trophy.  Why not spend a fraction as much for tires that get aged out in a similar fashion but have a MUCH bigger dividend?

And driving to work and back in crappy conditions on NEW tires is way more satisfying than driving on some parking lot with purple crack for 40-60 seconds.  IMO.  It's all Lawnmower Man "LOL I AM GOD HERE" all the time.

And then you add active AWD and other enhancements, and you find yourself getting a personalized license plate of a video game cheat-code, because it is just so berking awesome it is almost unfair...

dean1484 said:

Knurled. said:

FWIW, I also believe that summer tires should be thrown out after two seasons and winter tires are only good for one.

Please let me know where I can come get the take offs. What you are tossing in the trash to me are just broken in.  I bet your tire store really likes you. 

I am the tire store :)  (I usually buy tires online/from Summit since it's still cheaper than our "wholesale" pricing)  After two years, my winter tires are rock hard and down to 7/32.  They're junk.

Something like the first 50% of tread loss in a tire is 90% evaporation.  This is why tires seem to wear quickly at first, then wear like iron afterward.  The softness has evaporated away, they have lost their rubberiness, and also GRIP like iron.  So I usually junk tires after the tread depth is half of new, which takes two years for winter tires and three years for summer tires at the very best.  I consider this to be REALLY pushing it, because I am really cheap, and I know I am sacrificing performance and safety in order to squeeze out another year before having to buy more tires.

(note:  I have only been in one TA.  It involved old tires in the winter, and buying the city a new fence.  That was, uh, 22 years ago...)

Knurled. said:

The rubber ages quickly.  The second season is noticably not as good as the first, and the third season they are no better than all-season tires when it is snowy.

I'm gonna call bullE36 M3 on that, at least for most snow tires on the market (especially studdable ones that aren't as soft).  The Nokians I've been running on my Jeep were just barely starting to harden up at year 4 (and still worlds better than even brand new all seasons on the same vehicle).  And the new set I put on the following year was honestly not a whole lot better than the worn set. 

I've also found my snows tend to have a more consistent mileage vs wear curve than most summers do.  The snows only wear a bit faster in the early part of their life while it's significant for the summers.  But I've also found with the summers that even at the end of season 2 (where I'm usually wearing them out) they're not noticeably down on outright grip, they just tend to be a little less grippy in cold weather at the beginning / end of the season until they warm up a little (while new ones need less warmup in that weather).  And I've seen some that start to lose wet grip with age (but other tires don't seem to). 

25 years of RV owning  has told me that those tires suffer more than anything else on the road. Many, tempted to say most, motorhomes are loaded to very near max gross weight before you fuel them up, and are overloaded when you and the family get in. Then there's luggage and water tankage  and propane and... 

My first rig, a Chevy p30 chassis on 19.5's, blew tires fairly regularly. I bet it was half a ton or more over max gross pretty much at all times. Luckily, was mostly rears and the 2 times a front let go, I caught it and parked it before they blew up. Now Moby, our current road castle, weighs 22k empty and has a max gross of 30, so lots of headroom. But it rides on 22.5 semi truck tires. And weighs 22k empty. And if any tire blows, front or rear, I will be looking at major fiberglass repairs. So.. the 2400 bucks worth of tires I put on it in 2014 that have about 10k on em, are gonna get thrown away in another 3 years tops. I figure I have a bit more time in low UV western Washington than I would in say Texas.

In reply to Jay_W :

Huh I am surprised you overloaded 19.5's!

The ones I am getting are rated at 6005 each in a dual, 6395 as a single. so in theory I have 24k worth of tire rating on the rear....

rslifkin said:

Knurled. said:

The rubber ages quickly.  The second season is noticably not as good as the first, and the third season they are no better than all-season tires when it is snowy.

I'm gonna call bullE36 M3 on that, at least for most snow tires on the market (especially studdable ones that aren't as soft).  The Nokians I've been running on my Jeep were just barely starting to harden up at year 4 (and still worlds better than even brand new all seasons on the same vehicle).  And the new set I put on the following year was honestly not a whole lot better than the worn set. 

I've also found my snows tend to have a more consistent mileage vs wear curve than most summers do.  The snows only wear a bit faster in the early part of their life while it's significant for the summers.  But I've also found with the summers that even at the end of season 2 (where I'm usually wearing them out) they're not noticeably down on outright grip, they just tend to be a little less grippy in cold weather at the beginning / end of the season until they warm up a little (while new ones need less warmup in that weather).  And I've seen some that start to lose wet grip with age (but other tires don't seem to). 

I agree with you. I put Blizzacks on sometime after Thanksgiving most years and they are off by Easter at the latest.  Our snow season goes from mid October to May.  The reason they don’t go on earlier and come off later is 45f degrees is about the maximum temp proper winter tires should operate in.  

Not 45 average, but 45 as the upper level of operation.  My set is still sticky and plenty of tread left going on their 5th winter. 

In reply to frenchyd :

My tire swap points are usually determined by low temps rather than highs, as I won't run my summers if it's going to be below freezing when I'm leaving for work in the morning.  So the snows occasionally have to suffer through an extra warm early spring day of 60+ degrees, but I make a point to be gentle in that weather to keep the heat down a bit.  

Shipping company lost them! I sad. 

What's your ass worth to you? When I inventoried with ATD we E36 M3canned car tires that were 5 years old stored in a heated but not air conditioned warehouse. I don't know about truck tires we're all just spitballing here with no solid info. If there's a reputable truck tire retreading operation nearby you might discus with them whether they would retread that old a carcass but I'm still spitballing.

In reply to java230 :

I cannot recall what the weight rating of those (Toyos from Les Schwab) tires were but I bet it wasn't near as much as the ones you've found. I just recall a few too many sessions with the bottle jack on a road shoulder under various less than amusing conditions...

Well, it rained again yesterday, so I wasn't able to do a session on my new-to-me 2014 vintage 275/35-17 Maxxis RC1's.  And the track will be closed next weekend, and won't open again till 10/30, so my only chance in this coming Wednesday, but there's a major (for Texas) cold front coming in tonight, which is forecast to bring a bunch of rain with it, so things aren't looking good for the foreseeable future.

frenchyd said:I agree with you. I put Blizzacks on sometime after Thanksgiving most years and they are off by Easter at the latest.  Our snow season goes from mid October to May.  The reason they don’t go on earlier and come off later is 45f degrees is about the maximum temp proper winter tires should operate in.  

Not 45 average, but 45 as the upper level of operation.  My set is still sticky and plenty of tread left going on their 5th winter. 

I'm not swapping tires when the temps get over 45, which is a regular thing around here in the winter.  Winter tires work when it is 65 degrees better than summer tires work when it's 35.  And what happens if you're driving somewhere warm for a little bit?  I'm not going to carry a set of tires and swap over halfway there and halfway back...

They're sacrificial wear items, and just a rolling expense to deal with, I figure.  I'm already spending 60-80% more on fuel because I just had to have AWD, I can't bitch about $600 for tires every now and then.  That is like people who buy huge expensive trucks and complain about having to put DEF in them.

purplepeopleeater said:

What's your ass worth to you? When I inventoried with ATD we E36 M3canned car tires that were 5 years old stored in a heated but not air conditioned warehouse. I don't know about truck tires we're all just spitballing here with no solid info. If there's a reputable truck tire retreading operation nearby you might discus with them whether they would retread that old a carcass but I'm still spitballing.

That's pretty excessive IMO, but someone else higher up in the food chain probably did the liability math on that.  With good climate control and no UV attacking the rubber, five years is nothing for a stored tire.

I can also see people rejecting them, at which point it makes no sense to have them in stock if there's too much liability of them getting boomeranged right back.  Our tire supplier will allow us to reject tires over three years old, no questions asked, but that is a really rare occurrence.  (And where else you going to find, say, a whitewall 205/75-14?  There's a reason it hasn't moved...)

One thing I have always wondered about retreaders is how they know the carcass hasn't been abused by being run low on air for its load.  I suppose if the tire lasted long enough to wear out then it most likely had a well maintained life.

Canoes are good for 3 years apparently. 

Tires I run 5 to 7 years. 

In reply to GameboyRMH :

  Since most Motorhomes weight tends to be near the load ratings of the tires, motor homes should have as good a tire  as you can afford.  That said,  decades ago it wasn't uncommon to drive tires until the tread wore out or visible cracks showed.

 I don't doubt newer is better, but I do doubt 7 year old tires  would suddenly blow out on their 10th birthday.