Towing with an XJ?

I know a big diesel truck is really "the answer," but that's not in the cards.

I'm perfectly ok with an honest answer of "oh hell no" if it comes down to it and i'll figure something else out, but....

I have a 2000 XJ that i'm probably going to go through and do a bunch of suspension and brake freshening to this summer. It's got 178k miles on it, now hasn't given me a single lick of trouble since i bought it a year and a half ago, and it's just generally been one of my greatest purchases of all time. Motor makes GREAT power, it doesn't leak anything, transmission shifts like a dream.

Now the question is.... what can it tow?

I do NOT believe it has the factory tow package.

So... legally speaking, as well as from a common sense standpoint, what can it tow?

IF you were to tow with an XJ (assuming it's really possible), what modifications would you make to it to make your life easier? (Add a leaf in the rear? There an easy way to install rear disc brakes? Trans cooler?)

The idea here is that either this coming season, or 2013, the Escort is going to Nationals. I would REALLY prefer to not drive it all the way out to Nebraska. I also absolutely do not want to replace the Cherokee with a big truck, and i also do not want to buy a 6th vehicle that might get used 5x a year. If i gotta rent something, i gotta rent something, but it'd be nice to use what i already have.

Lay it on me!

After working in the transmission repair industry for so long, I won't say that the transmission is the weak point, but... the transmission is the weak point. Not to mention, when it goes, its berkeleyING EXPENSIVE to replace or rebuild. Expect to pay well over $1000 to purchase a used one. I did find one online for $850 with a cracked case and 136k miles. Its a ZF5HP24. The fact that you got over 100k out of it in the first place (IMHO) is a frickin miracle. Expect about $3500 retail to rebuild it.

I would say if you can keep the tranny cool, it might take 3000 lbs. Keep a close eye on tongue weight. IIRC, the bearings are pretty small in the rear.

Use the Cherokee. It will do it no problem (unless it has the 4cyl, then it will just be slow). The Jeep is built on known-good architecture for that kind of thing - Dana 30 or 44 rear, A500 transmission, full frame, and an engine family that has been in use since 1963.

curtis73 wrote: After working in the transmission repair industry for so long, I won't say that the transmission is the weak point, but... the transmission is the weak point. Not to mention, when it goes, its berkeleyING EXPENSIVE to replace or rebuild. Expect to pay well over $1000 to purchase a used one. I did find one online for $850 with a cracked case and 136k miles. Its a ZF5HP24. The fact that you got over 100k out of it in the first place (IMHO) is a frickin miracle. Expect about $3500 retail to rebuild it. I would say if you can keep the tranny cool, it might take 3000 lbs. Keep a close eye on tongue weight. IIRC, the bearings are pretty small in the rear.

.... It's an Aisin AW4. From what i understand, over 200k miles is extremely common...

Hahaha. He thought you meant a Jaguar.

OH!!!!

Lol i'm sorry..... it's an XJ Cherokee.... Not a Jag. I wouldn't own an XJ, i do not like those.

The Cherokee is a 4.0 Sport 4x4. Aisin AW4, NP242 T-case, Dana 30 axles front and rear. Runs like a beast.

MG Bryan wrote: Hahaha. He thought you meant a Jaguar.

Lol i was in the middle of typing that apparently.

I read his reply and was all like....

Until i figured out what was going on.

Well even if you did have a ZF, I think he's being overly pessimistic about that transmission.

(<---- Jag owner)

I towed a few times with our '87 XJ. I'd imagine a 2000 would have a better time with the HO engine and such. I wouldn't want to tow much more than 2500lbs worth of car though.

MCarp22 wrote: I towed a few times with our '87 XJ. I'd imagine a 2000 would have a better time with the HO engine and such. I wouldn't want to tow much more than 2500lbs worth of car though.

I'm not real worried about power... more worried about brakes, rear suspension, the fact that it's a pretty light and short truck, etc etc etc...

If the car weighs more than 2500lbs, then i'm building a different car.

I bet showing up to Nationals towing a ratty looking Escort behind a Jag would be classy as berkeley, though.

MG Bryan wrote: Hahaha. He thought you meant a Jaguar.

Curtis sucking thumb in the fetal position in 5...4...3...2...

MG Bryan wrote: Well even if you did have a ZF, I think he's being overly pessimistic about that transmission. (<---- Jag owner)

Without ZF, Honda, and 09A trannys we'd be bankrupt. Seriously, 36% of our business was Honda, 18% ZF, and 12% VW. That's via our sales software. That's an incredible 2/3 of our business from three types of tranny.

curtis73 wrote:

MG Bryan wrote: Well even if you did have a ZF, I think he's being overly pessimistic about that transmission. (<---- Jag owner)

Without ZF, Honda, and 09A trannys we'd be bankrupt. Seriously, 36% of our business was Honda, 18% ZF, and 12% VW. That's via our sales software. That's an incredible 2/3 of our business from three types of tranny.

I only have experience with the ZF, but if you treat it right it reciprocates. Most people don't; so it E36 M3s all over them, goes into limp mode and proceeds to rape their wallet.

On that note, and in an effort to stay relevant to the thread, it's worth having a transmission cooler on whatever you do decide to tow with. A temp gauge is a good idea too. I know nothing specifically about the Jeep though.

Trans temp, water temp, or both?

I use my thumb as a temp gauge. I did install a trans temp gauge on my HD tow rig, but if I'm just towing smaller stuff I stop periodically and check the fluid. With a good tranny cooler I've never found my fluid to be hot. Without a tranny cooler I sometimes burn my hands on the fluid.

1. TRANS COOLER!!! can't stress this one enough.
2. an adequate trailer/loaded properly. If you don't know how to do this, please learn before you throw your car on there for a long trek.

other than that you should be good to go.

Although I kind of weep for you if you think a 180k 4.0 is making "great" power.

icaneat50eggs wrote: 1. TRANS COOLER!!! can't stress this one enough. 2. an adequate trailer/loaded properly. If you don't know how to do this, please learn before you throw your car on there for a long trek. other than that you should be good to go. Although I kind of weep for you if you think a 180k 4.0 is making "great" power.

By "great power" i mean it runs as strong as any 4.0 i've ever seen. I never feel like it needs more power, but then again, i've never loaded it down with more than say... 1000lbs. (Couple motors in the back)

Anyways, you would think that the vehicle is perfectly adequate to tow with with the addition of a trans cooler?

Any recommendation as to whether or not i should beef up the rear suspension or not? If so, how/with what?

Is there an easy rear disc brake swap for this thing? Or is that just not worth doing?

A quick check says that depending on how it's equipped your tow rating is between 2000 and 5000 lbs.

I guess your truck is more like 2000 since you don't have a tow package. So depending on what the car weighs and what trailer you use, I'm guessing you'll need a transmission cooler, a hitch, new gear oil in the axle, and a brake controller.

Do you have a trailer already or is that part of the equation not worked out?

go to neow lots of good resources relative to the xj, and what is swappable, what suspensions work etc.

MG Bryan wrote: A quick check says that depending on how it's equipped your tow rating is between 2000 and 5000 lbs. I guess your truck is more like 2000 since you don't have a tow package. So depending on what the car weighs and what trailer you use, I'm guessing you'll need a transmission cooler, a hitch, new gear oil in the axle, and a brake controller. Do you have a trailer already or is that part of the equation not worked out?

Hrmmm... maybe my research sucked. Didn't realize the rating was different, but that makes sense.

If i add all those things... does that give any legal ramifications with DOT for towing over my "rated" amount?

Don't have a trailer yet, but i do know of a couple i could borrow, and buying one is probably something i should do at some point, anyways.

I'm not sure what Mr. DOTman would say. I've never really looked into that aspect of it. I prefer to just tow with something that is grossly overrated for the job.

What does the sticker list as the GCWR?

MG Bryan wrote: I'm not sure what Mr. DOTman would say. I've never really looked into that aspect of it. I prefer to just tow with something that is grossly overrated for the job. What does the sticker list as the GCWR?

Not real sure... i'll check it out this weekend. I really never drive the thing, it gets driven 8 miles a day by SWMBO 6 days a week.

I towed my ITA Mr2 all over Florida with a 1994 XJ 4x4. The car and trailer combo was aproximatly 4000lbs and I never had any issues. Don't plan on going over 60 or so and give your self lots of space between traffic to stop

As you have already mentioned the brakes are the weak point. They are adequate at best with out a trailer behind the truck. Make sure they are in proper working order. My brakes were stock and I just drove slow and tried to keep a big cushion of space to stop in front of me. I can't speak for towing specific suspension modifications but my truck did have an add-a-leaf in the back and aftermarket rancho shocks (It had a 3 inch lift).

Get a big tranny cooler in the front and also make sure your cooling system is operating correctly. XJ's have small radiators to begin with and the factory cooling system can also be a weak point.

pimpm3 wrote: I towed my ITA Mr2 all over Florida with a 1994 XJ 4x4. The car and trailer combo was aproximatly 4000lbs and I never had any issues. Don't plan on going over 60 or so and give your self lots of space between traffic to stop As you have already mentioned the brakes are the weak point. They are adequate at best with out a trailer behind the truck. Make sure they are in proper working order. My brakes were stock and I just drove slow and tried to keep a big cushion of space to stop in front of me. I can't speak for towing specific suspension modifications but my truck did have an add-a-leaf in the back and aftermarket rancho shocks (It had a 3 inch lift). Get a big tranny cooler in the front and also make sure your cooling system is operating correctly. XJ's have small radiators to begin with and the factory cooling system can also be a weak point.

Would you say the truck would have towed better without the lift and maybe just good shock and the add-a-leaf in the back?

My cooling system works well now, but i'm giving thought to going through it over the summer anyways so i won't have to worry about it for years. It really doesn't have much miles put on it... we've had it for a year and a half and put 6k miles on it.

Do you think upgraded brakes (strong pads, good fluid, maybe even stainless lines) would make a huge difference, or is the larger issue of "light truck + trailer = scary enough to skip that idea and just make sure i'm using a trailer with a brake setup?

I'm loading up a cart right now with a B&M SuperCooler and trans temp gauge, trailer harness, and a hitch just to see what sort of money i'm looking at.

Honestly... this all doesn't seem so bad so far.

I'm going to wait for more opinions, but so far it seems like the general consensus is that the truck should be just fine for a ~4000lbs package, correct?

You definitely want trailer brakes.

MG Bryan wrote: You definitely want trailer brakes.

Because i'm paranoid about brakes... i'm kindof thinking trailer brakes, rear disc swap, and a Vanco upgrade all around.