I apologize if this has been discussed before. Undoubtedly it has.
But I'm thinking of heading out to a TNiA event. Looks like three sessions for about $100 (with the Koni $25 discount, tell your friends!). I know the events are aimed at getting neophytes out on track, which is great. What's it really like for both novices and more advanced drivers?
I'm curious about this, too.
I'm wondering how orderly it is, if instructors are in the cars, etc...
Helluva bargain, but not worth it if a wannabe hotshot punts me into a tire wall because he thinks he can drive.
Looks like the novices have a fair bit of scheduled extra time - briefings before each session, initial paced sighting laps and a separate driver's meeting.
Well...i will let you know how it is from the viewpoint of a novice entrant also doing the run /work program at about 10pm tomorrow. 
I can tell you that I never would have made it a priority to get into trackdays If I needed to spend the full amount and commit to a whole day at the track thereby missing an autocross. So the program is onto something there.
My impression is that TNiA is really aimed at newcomers and that they'd rather people didn't show up with trailered, caged, race cars on R compounds.
(edit) Just checked their web site and they explicitly say "no race cars, street cars only". I guess the Targa Miata still has a plate on it, but... :)
Hey, it's street legal where I live! I'm pretty sure there's a picture of it at the CA border that says "do not let this car in", though.
It's quite possible I'd show up with one of the other FM cars, the Targa Miata would be like a bazooka at a knife fight. It's interesting that cost has been mentioned a few times, they're not that much less than typical track days around here. That's probably more a reflection of HPR's very friendly pricing than anything else.
The one at Thunderhill is $125 for 3 20 minute sessions. That's not really cheaper than your average track day on a cost-per-minute basis, but it is lower on an absolute track event fee basis.
The real downside to it here is that Thunderhill is a 2+ hour driver from the Bay Area with no traffic. On a week day you're going to be leaving before noon, and not getting home til midnight. I guess that's something you can do without needing a hotel, so that's one cost-savings area.
I'll throw this out there. https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/mappers-track-night-in-america-report/117391/page1/
I will say that the advanced group gets pretty much open passing. The novice group included plenty of between session debriefings and a paced recon lap prior to any groups running. If you don't know the track or just want a more relaxed event then the novice group is good but the intermediate and advanced groups offer the kind of speed most of you will be looking for.
Around here track days tend to run in the $300 + range so $150 or less for 60 minutes is a pretty good deal.
Thanks for that, Mapper. You posted that during the Mitty, so I missed it.
High Plains Raceway has standing open lapping days (usually Friday) that range from $100-180, and they're open for four hours on Thursday nights for $100 during the summer. Very open format, it's sometimes two run groups or, if it's not too busy, no run groups at all. You can even buy punch cards or a season pass for $1000. If I lived less than 4.5 hours away, I'd have that pass.
My wife is the SCCA regional RE and has some experience with them. She'll stop by in a little bit.
In reply to Keith Tanner:
If only that existed everywhere.
Keith Tanner wrote: What's it really like for both novices and more advanced drivers?
I got to go to an event last year, I signed up as a beginner, because I am.
I was in a little over my head, however there were plenty of people who ran the expert group whom seemed to know what they were doing and had all different sorts of hardware. Everyone seemed to have fun. I never felt like I was getting run off the track in the novice group, and the "advanced" groups I watched seemed to be running quickly and spread out.
We just had our first one in April. I was helping and wasn't there for all of the driver meetings but I'll relay as much as I can remember. Everyone gets three 20 minutes sessions in levels of novice, intermediate or advanced. If you class yourself as advanced and realize you're in over your head, you can drop down to another group. You do have to have a legal helmet and you car is teched via a checklist that you go through yourself. The following link might be helpful. http://www.tracknightinamerica.com/pages/what-to-bring There are no instructors in the cars but they talk to you about what you should and should not be doing. Passing is only done if you're waved by. Honestly, the what to expect link here http://www.tracknightinamerica.com/pages/what-to-expect tells you everything I'm thinking of and more.
We had a large novice group and the feedback seemed to be really good from them. This is a great way to get the complete newbie a chance to run on a track and an intro into SCCA. I'm not an autocross newbie but I'm hoping to try it the end of this month but my brake pads need to be changed out before I do that. If you have any questions, feel free to message me.
Thanks!
I've done it 3 or 4 times now, always in the advanced group (where you'd put yourself). So far, I've had an excellent experience at each of the events. The worst experience was tonight when they had to ditch the last session due to a really, really thick fog that settled in over about 10 minutes, but it was communicated clearly, they tried to delay the last session for a while in case the fog would move out, etc. In the end, they're giving us all a credit to use for the next one which is really cool since it's not their fault we got fogged out.
The big deal is that they're emphasizing the friendliness more than anything else, so the rules are a lot looser than a "normal" track day. That said, they can and will react swiftly to anyone they feel is acting in an unsafe manner. I've seen a few people pulled in to chat with them and there was one event where they stopped the intermediate group after a few people made unsafe passes.
At least over here, the advanced groups seem to be pretty decent about point bys, according my friends the beginner ones are too. It seems like the intermediate groups are the ones that will give problems, which makes sense, they're people that levelled up out of the beginner class but haven't really mastered high performance driving.
I know you've got a haul, but for us lucky New Englanders where we have two or three tracks within an hour, it's a perfect way to spend an evening. Depending on how close the track is to you will decide if it's worth it, but for the price I don't think you'll get a better value, at least around here. Sounds like your local track might be on par, though!
Oh, one last note: At least out here they let you ride with other drivers, so you can do some coaching/get some tips during the runs. I believe the rules state that any advanced driver can ride with the beginner and intermediate, but here they just let you ride with whomever.
Background: I run a mostly stock Miata, in intermediate or advanced groups with other sanctions. My dad co-drives with me, in either beginner or intermediate.
I really like the concept of a cheap, weekday track event. PBIR is near work. The timing and convenience make for a great excuse to escape with my dad for some fun. We ran three or four TNIA events there last year, and the first one this year.
On the plus side, they seem to stick to the advertised schedule pretty well. For the events I have attended, they don't appear to have been fully subscribed. So the track is not packed. They do seem to be getting beginners out, most of which run with the beginner group. For one event last year the intermediate and advanced groups were combined, which meant a lot of track time.
On the downside, there are no check rides or instructors in cars. Some of the beginners are downright scary to be on track with. Some beginners make it into intermediate or advanced. A too-high percentage of people do not understand point-bys. This is particularly difficult in a Miata with 130 hp, as I cannot pass in the passing zones on the straights unless they let off. A higher than normal rate of sessions are cut short by Black flag due to accidents. This last event one of my sessions was inexplicably 13 minutes long, so six-seven laps, of which four were stuck behind a poorly-driven BMW that would not point.
In short, it's exactly what you would expect for a cheap, beginner–focused track day with no instructors put on by a capable organizing body.
The thought of someone with no concept of line theory, completely red-misted, blocking traffic or spinning, with no instructor in the car is a bit unsettling.
I'd do intermediate (having done a few track days, auto-x schools and seasons of auto-x) though.
Myself and our SOLO chairperson are doing one in July at Putnam Park. I will definitely be in the Novice group, and you'll notice I'm the one with a big smile that won't go away until the following morning at work.
I'm very tempted to go to the one at Putnam on the 12th, but not sure if it will happen yet. I like the idea mainly because it's an opportunity for me to take something like the wagon to the track, where I wouldn't want to beat on it all day at the track, but would like to get out, get some data logs for tuning purposes, and just see what it can do.
Was interested in the program until I found that there are none with a 100 mile radius of me (At least, maybe more, didn't expand the search radius) which kind of puts a damper on things.
gearheadE30 wrote: I'm very tempted to go to the one at Putnam on the 12th, but not sure if it will happen yet. I like the idea mainly because it's an opportunity for me to take something like the wagon to the track, where I wouldn't want to beat on it all day at the track, but would like to get out, get some data logs for tuning purposes, and just see what it can do.
That's what I was using it for last night after some new shocks/springs/sways on the Rx-8.. It was a low cost, low pressure tuning event.
gearheadE30 wrote: I'm very tempted to go to the one at Putnam on the 12th, but not sure if it will happen yet. I like the idea mainly because it's an opportunity for me to take something like the wagon to the track, where I wouldn't want to beat on it all day at the track, but would like to get out, get some data logs for tuning purposes, and just see what it can do.
I do like the idea that they sound a bit more lax than most groups about what's a reasonable vehicle to take out there. It sound like they go with "if it's not a race car and it's safe to run around the track, go for it"
rslifkin wrote:gearheadE30 wrote: I'm very tempted to go to the one at Putnam on the 12th, but not sure if it will happen yet. I like the idea mainly because it's an opportunity for me to take something like the wagon to the track, where I wouldn't want to beat on it all day at the track, but would like to get out, get some data logs for tuning purposes, and just see what it can do.I do like the idea that they sound a bit more lax than most groups about what's a reasonable vehicle to take out there. It sound like they go with "if it's not a race car and it's safe to run around the track, go for it"
I can't find a picture but there is a local with a stripped Miata (all of the body except pan gone and cage/chassis added) that was out there. It looked as safe as any Locost.
I will echo a previous comment about safety. If you act like an a$$ or put two or more wheels off, expect a black flag and a chat with an official. From what I saw, the two people who spun in the novice group got a friendly debriefing and not a lecture so the welcoming attitude was still there. They did warn that drivers who continued to drive dangerously would be booted out.
That's not to say that the groups were not allowed to run fast. Everyone was able to run to the maximum of their skill level as long as they kept it on track.
MattGent wrote: This last event one of my sessions was inexplicably 13 minutes long, so six-seven laps, of which four were stuck behind a poorly-driven BMW that would not point.
BTW, it's easy to forget this - but there's an easy way to deal with a situation like this. You'll know after a lap or two if you're not going to get the point, so just pull into the pits and tell the starter you want some room. They'll pop you back out again and you'll lose about 30 seconds of track time - but also lose your rolling roadblock. Getting stuck behind someone for one lap is their fault, but you have the ability to make the problem go away.
Keith Tanner wrote:MattGent wrote: This last event one of my sessions was inexplicably 13 minutes long, so six-seven laps, of which four were stuck behind a poorly-driven BMW that would not point.BTW, it's easy to forget this - but there's an easy way to deal with a situation like this. You'll know after a lap or two if you're not going to get the point, so just pull into the pits and tell the starter you want some room. They'll pop you back out again and you'll lose about 30 seconds of track time - but also lose your rolling roadblock. Getting stuck behind someone for one lap is their fault, but you have the ability to make the problem go away.
Yep, at Hallett, we don't even say thing. We just make a gesture with spreading both hands and they know what we're after.
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