Only made 281hp and 325ft lb torque.
All out of puff by mid 4k rpm
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Ford 2.3 turbo with h1c blowing into m62. 24psi total. 18 degrees timing. 10.8:1 afr.
MAT of 28c at 6500rpm
If my charger was out of its efficiency range surely it would be pushing inlet temps way high..
Im suspecting my ranger cam is to blame. Retarded 8 degrees to try pushing the power band up a bit...
Any tips??
What ECU? Still pulling through a VAM? At a certain point you just can't suck any more air through those things.
Did you run the cam timing less retarded as a baseline?
don't know the details really but I know of a few street motors making nearier 400. good size compressor and lots less pressure,more rpm
I assume you mean 2.3l Lima, and not 2.3l Duratec. Both were in rangers..... Both will be cam limited due to the Ranger, too.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:What ECU? Still pulling through a VAM? At a certain point you just can't suck any more air through those things.
Did you run the cam timing less retarded as a baseline?
He's running MegaSquirt, so MAP-based.
alfadriver said:I assume you mean 2.3l Lima, and not 2.3l Duratec. Both were in rangers..... Both will be cam limited due to the Ranger, too.
Yep, the old Lima engine. He has a build thread here with more details. It is quite a lovely build:
OK. If it's got a big giant air filter and unrestrictive intake prior to the turbo then I would think you might still be able to get something from advancing the ignition timing, and playing with the cam timing.
Sorry forgot to mention Ms3 pro with ls coils. Full sequential fuel and spark.
Big cone filter in the fender area getting fresh air from headlight inlet.
Still trying to Work out how to use knock control. There is a wideband gm sensor on the block but I can't get my head around it yet.
24 psi... 24 psi?!
Good Lord, there has to be something big going on with that low power. On my similar-displacement Honda K24, if I set boost to 24 psi, it would be making around 520 hp. You'll get it figured out.
In reply to kb58 :
That's because the K24 is a good and relatively modern engine- I would only expect low 300s out of this thing with the boost he's running.
Yeah that's why I was a little pissed..
I've had it at 27psi on 94gas no sign of audible detonation.
Right. I was expecting 330.. Maybe the charger is zapping my top end away.
You need a bigger turbo. It's falling off. Probably a cam change to make the most of it too. Also can you see intake charge temps at various points in the system?
freetors said:You need a bigger turbo. It's falling off. Probably a cam change to make the most of it too. Also can you see intake charge temps at various points in the system?
I have the pulls datalogged.
Max IAT is at 6500 rpm at 28c.
At 4800rpm where i made most power my iat is 21c.
This holset should be well big enough.. No?
It doesn't sound like you're having heat problems. If you can get some more pressure sensors in the system, I'd be curious to see not just manifold pressure, but also pressure between the turbo and blower.
On second thought, those temps are really good. You say that you have 24psi total. I think it would be very illuminating to see what boost pressure your turbo is putting out. Remember that both the turbo and supercharger compress air at some predictable pressure ratio. So let's say your supercharger operates at a 2.0 PR (just throwing a number out, it may be more or less). With 24 psi after the supercharger that means your turbo would only be putting out 12 psi. This is nothing! As evidenced by your low charge temps. Your turbo may very well still be in the left side of the map! Crank that boost!
Also I think an important point about turbos and superchargers that many, if not most people don't know, is that boost pressure is really pretty irellevant. X amount of boost does not imply Y amount of power. Boost pressures are really only meaningful as a comparison between the same engine type and charger type. A larger turbo will always make more power at a specific boost level. And it will do it while making less heat too! The caveat here is that with turbochargers, when the size goes up relative to your displacement is you are moving your powerbound up, and if you can't raise the redline that powerband gets narrower too. Engines don't care about boost pressure. Engine power production is determined by the volumetric flow rate. Would you rather have your engine running at 1cfm at 10 psi or 10cfm at 1 psi? I know which one I'd want!
In reply to rslifkin :
I have about 12psi from blower...
In reply to freetors :
Top left is turbo only boost
Bottom left is total boost
Top right is exhaust back pressure
Bottom right twin needle gauge is pre and post intercoolers. Dash switch flips between the water to air ic between turbo and charger, to the fmic after the charger.
Also the turbo on its own coud barely touch 6psi at 6500rpm. Its got a massive turbine housing.
The supercharger on its own gives 5 psi.
Aim is to compound beyond exhaust back pressure...
https://www.flickr.com/gp/157274311@N07/90FA2D
Edit
That link don't work... I'll try something else
https://www.flickr.com/gp/157274311@N07/90FA2D
Ok think thats it??? Is it working??
Just a quick video on the way to work..
Those intake temperature numbers are highly suspicious given the claimed boost. When I was doing pulls at 15 psi, I burned my hand touching the intake side of the intercooler. Is there an intercooler on your car and was a big fan pointed at it?
In reply to kb58 :
2 intercoolers. One water to air between turbo and charger and one air to air after charger.
I thought hard about my inlet temps.. I'll take your suspiscion as a compliment!
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Love this build so much. It looks like you've got your boost ramping figured out. The compressor is not maxed out. The peak power at 4k I would attribute primarily to your cam. I wouldnt be surprised if retarding it those 8 degrees did help quite a bit. As i said in another thread, with a roots blower you can somewhat afford to give up low end torque since you will still end up with far more than an NA build at any rpm no matter what. Looking at your dyno sheet you can currently hit 200wtq around 2800 rpm. That seems like a pleasant amount of torque in a small car at low rpm.
On one of my turbo caravans i attempted to go as fast as possible with minimal work on the stock tiny turbo. The stock engine makes peak power at 4800 rpm and could spool the turbo way below 2000rpm. I retarded the stock cam 6 degrees in order to delay boost onset and try to rev it out far enough that i wouldn't fall below 4000 rpm on shifts. It did end up working. In 1st gear i would rev it out to the 6200 rpm limiter, which is basically unheard of for those engines to be driven that way with a stock top end. A retarded Ranger cam is not ideal but i think it will be an improvement in your case.
Damn, that thing is awesome. I saw your previous threads but had no idea this was going in a Capri.
In reply to Vigo :
Hi Vigo.. So I'm gonna pull the valve cover and really check my cam position for sure.. If I was a tooth out advanced and then had it retard 8 degrees i could actually be in an advanced position.. If everything is as it should be i need to start looking at performance cams.
I have the modified ecternal wastegate recirv/bypass valve plumbed with a mac valve controlling it now.. I get full boost to inlet at 50% tps.
In reply to EvanB :
Thanks. Mk1 Capri is pretty cute.
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