What is Furious_E going to swap an LS1 into?

So as some of you may have seen in the minor rant thread last night, I was in an accident on the way home from work in my Cramit. Short version of the story is a Transit Connect pulled out in front of me, I had no time to react, and t boned him. Fortunately both he and I are ok and the other driver is totally at fault, but the Cramit looks to be totaled.

On the bright side, the damage appeared to have spared the drivetrain, suspension, and wheels, so the plan is to but it back, part out what I can, and salvage the drivetrain for its replacement, whatever that may end up being. I've never done a buy back from the insurance co before, so if someone could please explain how that works, what I can expect to pay for the car, and how I should attempt to negotiate that into my settlement I would appreciate it very much. I'm filing the claim through my insurance, fwiw.

So here's the fun part: I've got a 109k mile LS1/T56 combo begging to be saved, what am I gonna swap it into? The possibilities are pretty much limitless, but lets narrow it down to the cheaper end of the spectrum (budget is TBD, but lets say sub $5k for now). As some may recall, I had been looking to sell and replace the Cramit anyways, so the intent would be to fill the same role the Camaro formerly did, pretty much a sunny day driver/auto x/hopeful track day car. I'd like something lighter, more nimble, and more communicative than the Camaro was, ideally. This will also be my first go at an engine swap, so I'm not looking for a massively complicated project either.

First thoughts are:

-E36 - Prior to the Camaro I had one and loved it and I can only imagine how much better it could be with mo powah. I'd been considering 302 swapping one anyways, but the LS presents a few additional complications in the E36 chassis from what I understand. But its been done enough, theres the (rather pricey) Vorschlag kit out there, and I think is be quite satisfied with the final product.

-FC RX7-Another car id previously been considering a 302 swap in, I'm less familiar with this chassis, having never driven nor wrenched on one. But I seem to recall the LS fits a bit better than the bummer and the gigantic trans tunnel will accommodate the T56. To a casual observer, appears to be a bit cheaper than the e36 too.

-RX8-Hear wonderful things about the chassis and they're starting to become hugely cheap and plentiful with blown rotaries. I know the swap has been done enough times, but probably still isn't as common as either of the first two. I'm also much less familiar.

-944-Always kinda dug these, but don't know much about this swap. Porsche parts prices also scare me, I want this car to be relatively cheap to build and run. Does the transaxle complicate things?

-E46-Probably the cheap Bimmer to have right now, more so than the e36. Not sure how much the swap differs from that chassis.

I'm quite open to other suggestions, lets see what we can bench build

Uhhhmmm Miata?
It is the answer after all

Miata for sure, but the RX8 would make for a more rounded vehicle when done, almost like an FRS with seats that you can use. I think maybe Mazda built the RX8 with a hand grenade for an engine knowing that this would be a good swap

I can comment on the 944 swap- It's really really fun. I had an LS6 944 for quite a while. 944 parts are much different than traditional porsche priced parts, so that's nothing to worry about.

The swap was straightforward if not really really tight. Custom headers or block huggers are a must, some other stuff like brake booster relocation, motor mounts, creative intake routing, and hydraulic throwout bearing are required, but there's enough documentation floating around on the internet that it isn't too scary at all. You could sell the T56 since you reuse the existing porsche transaxle. You can either modify a C5 bellhousing or buy a custom unit from a couple companies out there that make them now. The clutch is OE 60's mopar ironically, and bolts right up. Pilot bearing adaptor is really all you need for driveline that's 'custom'. Overall, it was a pretty straightforward and fun swap. Once I had all of the parts assembled, the actual swap/install only took a weekend. I was happy with the result, and I regret selling the car more than any other automotive purchase/sale I've done.

That said, I have an e36 m3, and the thought of throwing an LSx in it is a fantasy I've long dreamed about and mentally toyed with. I'd be hard pressed to not go that direction in the future.

Id say Rx8. Awesome chassis that can be awesome-r with v8 powah.

Nb miata. Because thats what I want to do to mine.

Maserati BiTurbo

Smart car!

golfduke wrote: I can comment on the 944 swap- It's really really fun. I had an LS6 944 for quite a while.

So, the transaxle holds up allright? I keep reading about this swap, and it seems fantastical that the stocker holds up.

How about a C4 Corvette? Easiest car to put an LS1 into is generally something that already had a small block Chevy, and a C4 with a blown engine would be REALLY cheap. Or you could get a running example and sell the TPI motor to someone who wants an even easier EFI motor to put in place of a Gen 1 SBC.

P.S. Glad to hear you're all right and that the accident wasn't anything worse.

All your ideas are good. I would probably do RX8.

Z32 300zx Beautiful cars (especially in white or silver) , weighs about 3000lbs, can be had cheap. I'm positive a LS1 swap knock some weight off the car as well. 91+ has the same front brakes as the TT version.

I just happen to (personally) know of an '01 E46 Coupe that got totalled yesterday. Frame/uni tub should still be square, as it got rear-ended and launched into the car in front of it. Has OEM M5 19x9 wheels, too! K-frame is dorked as is the F/L suspension. It has potential, depending on your time/budget/motivation to do Something Completely Different.

What about a new body style Mustang 2005 or later? Pick up an older 6 cylinder manual car cheap. Throe il the LS motor in and tweak the suspension for a really unique ride.

I've seen cosmetically nice but blown motor 2007 model for 1700 locally on Craigslist

Ovid_and_Flem wrote: What about a new body style Mustang 2005 or later? Pick up an older 6 cylinder manual car cheap. Throe il the LS motor in and tweak the suspension for a really unique ride. I've seen cosmetically nice but blown motor 2007 model for 1700 locally on Craigslist

If this has any interest for you and you got a running model, I'd be interested in the 6cyl and trans. We're not very far away from each other for logistics.

In reply to golfduke:

You make a good case for the 944, and I'd be able to recoup a good bit of cash selling the t56. I knew a guy who had a 944 turbo for a while that was supposedly making somewhere around 300 to the wheels. Scared the E36 M3 out of me the few times I rode in it, and I can only imagine what v8 torque would add .

What was accessibility for maintenance like? How would you compare the dynamics and driving experience to your Bimmer?

While I love the idea of a Camaro powered Mustang, I think I wanna step down a weight class or two from a pony car. And a C4 is a little too...GMish...after the Camaro. 300zx is interesting, although the engine bay seems tight as hell even with the stock V6.

Idk how I missed the Answer, but that's a thought. Am I right in that the Miata needs some drivetrain and perhaps chassis upgrades to handle the V8 that the others don't?

Anyone have a good idea how all of these cars compare in terms of space in the engine bay?

yupididit wrote: Z32 300zx Beautiful cars (especially in white or silver) , weighs about 3000lbs, can be had cheap. I'm positive a LS1 swap knock some weight off the car as well. 91+ has the same front brakes as the TT version.

there is also a company that makes an adapter plate to bolt to the nissan 5 speed (which have been proven to hold a good amount of power) which would mean no custom trans mount or custom driveshaft. and with the prices of t56's these days you could sell yours, buy the adapter plate, and still have a few hundred bucks left in your pocket.

Furious_E wrote: 300zx is interesting, although the engine bay seems tight as hell even with the stock V6.

the engine bay on these seem tight because those v6's are super wide DOHC engines, and on the twin turbo models they take up even more space. but since it was made for a wide DOHC engine with an LS1 it opens up a lot of real estate.

wheelsmithy wrote:

golfduke wrote: I can comment on the 944 swap- It's really really fun. I had an LS6 944 for quite a while.

So, the transaxle holds up allright? I keep reading about this swap, and it seems fantastical that the stocker holds up.

It held up very well, I was shocked myself too. I ran a stock 951 transaxle with lsd and a NA 944 5th gear. The only issue I had was that I stripped out 2 stock drive couplings on the transaxle side. A custom, chunky steel unit fixed that issue permanently though. I should also mention that I was putting down 420/430 to the wheels with that car too, so a stock LSx might not have had those issues.

Do you need a truck? I'd find a beat up 70 or 80s Chevy Truck and throw it in there, then lower it and put some nice wheels on it

With the z32 trans you'll still need a new drive shaft but that's cheap. The z32 NA trans is very tough.

Furious_E wrote: In reply to golfduke: You make a good case for the 944, and I'd be able to recoup a good bit of cash selling the t56. I knew a guy who had a 944 turbo for a while that was supposedly making somewhere around 300 to the wheels. Scared the E36 M3 out of me the few times I rode in it, and I can only imagine what v8 torque would add . What was accessibility for maintenance like? How would you compare the dynamics and driving experience to your Bimmer?

Maintenance accessibility wasn't bad at all- remote oil filter made that simple and all plugs/coils were easily accessible from above. The clutch hydraulics are the only real bitch of the swap- bleeding the throwout bearing involved a custom wrench, contortion, and hours of cuss words. Aside from that though, it was as easy to wrench on than the stock motor was, which is REALLY FREAKING LARGE for its actual displacement.

Loaded question honestly. I never got the porsche onto an open track- just autocross and general street hoonery. They are polar opposite cars really. The 944 had probably 180 more hp/torque than the bmw, and I could break sticky 315's loose in 3 gears. The weight difference between the stock 2.5 lump and the V8 setup was only about 30# wet, so suspension manners stayed very 944 (which is good!). It is the only car I've owned that would actually scare me when driving it. It deserved way more respect than my crap driving skills could offer. It oversteered reliably and predictably, and was a riot. The car was semi-gutted and weighed 2700# when I sold it. Think about that power to weight ratio for a second.

My BMW is totally different animal. It's a momentum car to me still. It is so predictably neutral that sometimes I find myself overdriving the car just to have a little fun. Without question, I am a better and faster driver in the e36. It's also more comfortable and confidence-inspiring. I tell everyone that will listen, the e36 chassis is the best handling vehicle that I've ever driven, and I've driven a ton. Maybe that's just personal familiarity, a bit of nostalgia, an unnatural love I have for my car specifically, or a combo of all 3... But I won't ever sell my E36. I may wreck it on track or give it to my son when he's of prudent age, but I love that car in ways that others get uncomfortable around me when I talk about it, haha. I never had that connection with the 944, but that's because I was younger, was terrified of what I'd built while driving it, and ended up selling it before I could truly finish and enjoy it like it deserved. Luckily its owner has done all of those things, happily runs 11's at the drag strip, then drives it home every couple friday nights...

That probably didn't answer your question at all, sorry. I love both cars for very different reasons. IMHO, both are incredibly worth-while swap candidates.

Another note- if back seats are your thing, I'd lean toward the e36. The 944 back seat is laughable.

Buy back is as easy as letting them know you want a payout option of keeping vehicle and if you turn it in. Our buick went to copart, who made state farm an offer on it. That was the buyback for me.

Any Datsun z car, just because i have one and it's a blast.

I'm looking for something else to swap next, i have one donor here and picking another up this weekend

yupididit wrote: With the z32 trans you'll still need a new drive shaft but that's cheap. The z32 NA trans is very tough.

out of curiosity why would you need a new driveshaft if the stock trans and rear end are staying in the OEM locations?

In reply to golfduke:

No, that was actually very telling. I felt exactly the same way about my e36, it was a car I connected with like no other, just completely intuitive and predictable. I was terribly upset when that car was totaled, whereas I don't feel much emotion at all towards the loss of the Camaro.

Back seats are really of no concern to me and will very likely be removed anyways. Practicality in general is really secondary, although space for the dog to ride in back would make a 2+2 more desireable than the Answer.