What's "The Answer" for sedans...?

In reply to Indy-Guy :

I think the question is poorly defined. Maybe discussing exactly how Miata is The Answer would clear it up, but I think it's down to the idea that it's a hoot and a solid vehicle and a bunch of other superlatives. Or do we even mean "the answer to 'which sedan?'" or do we mean "most like a Miata with four seats?"

I've seen a lot of other requirements and antirequirements in the last few pages that I doubt are unanimous. Several people seem to have leapt to the conclusion that sedan just means appliance and sporting character doesn't matter at all. I guess I would have assumed "fun to drive in a sporting manner" was way up there. Maybe I missed a clarifying post. I guess my interpretation would fall closer to the "what sedan should I get if I'm only not getting a Miata because it doesn't have enough interior space?"

I'm throwing another vote in for the 6MT G35 sedan. Cheap, durable, handles well, chirps third hard, heaps of aftermarket, etc. E90 with the N52 would be another solid answer because they made about a zillion of them, they drive fantastic and they're fairly reliable.

Ransom said:

In reply to Indy-Guy :

I think the question is poorly defined. Maybe discussing exactly how Miata is The Answer would clear it up,

Valid point. Miata is only the answer for a rather narrow GRM set of criteria.  I don't own one because I tend to need more utility with my DD.  Miata just doesn't really work for me except as a fun occasional hooner.  I couldn't really have one as a DD.

Curtis73 said:

Ransom said:

In reply to Indy-Guy :

I think the question is poorly defined. Maybe discussing exactly how Miata is The Answer would clear it up,

Valid point. Miata is only the answer for a rather narrow GRM set of criteria.  I don't own one because I tend to need more utility with my DD.  Miata just doesn't really work for me except as a fun occasional hooner.  I couldn't really have one as a DD.

I would very respectfully disagree, Curtis.  I think the board generally understands what "The Answer" means, especially as it applies to the Miata.  There might be slight disagreements but it reminds me of the situation for somebody buying a .22 rimfire rifle--the Ruger 10/22 is "The Answer".  I suspect there are lots of products which would follow a parallel situation.  FuzzWuzzy listed:

So we have:

1) Low buy-in

2) Cheap maintenance (if DIY)

3) Available as a manual

4) Sporty

5) Does sedan things

6) Can seat 5

I think that's fairly concise and accurate with the possible addition of "aftermarket support".  I might substitute "entertaining/fun to drive" for "Sporty".  The question of front/rear drive and manual/automatic I would leave for individual tastes.

Of the suggestions so far, I was surprised at how well the suggested WRX and the Lexus models fit the criteria.  I hadn't considered those.

Rather than focusing on "this is a pointless discussion because the criteria are too vague" or "there are too many possible options" I'm simply enjoying the conversation.  We don't have to come up with a definitive solution or even a group of candidates--I'm just enjoying the sharing of points of view from people I find interesting.  

:)

At the risk of derailing the thread, what do we think of g35s with autos? Still fun or sucks all the fun out? 

My first thought was Mazda 6 or 3, depending what size sedan you wanted.

Any Honda Accord from day one to today.

You've all been given the answer. You just suck at listening.

poopshovel again said:

You just suck at listening.

It’s true. Just ask my mother (or wife)  

poopshovel again said:

You've all been given the answer. You just suck at listening.

Apparently 

P71 > v1 cts-v

But not as good as a simple Honda Accord.    

Purple Frog said:

Any Honda Accord from day one to today.

I had a 99 Accord coupe, five speed, F23, four wheel disk brakes.

I tried to make it more fun. Did the factory part version of a front BBK, and a lightweight flywheel when the clutch finally went bad at 205,000 miles. 

Still, would have had to have an engine swap for me to want to keep it. Really just too slow.

A lot of people are mentioning the Infiniti G35/G37. The only two things I have against the G35/G37 are that the infotainment system controls everything (and is outdated) and that they stopped putting manuals in the sedans around 2011-12. That said, if you can stomach a... GASP... automatic transmission, the 7 speed in the later G37 is excellent. I've been considering one (or a later Q50 3.0T) myself in AWD S trim for a future "Answer".

I had an 06 G35 sedan with the 6 speed. It was a nice car, but I never really connected with it. My main gripe with it was the factory flywheel. It seemed WAY too heavy and killed the character of the engine for me. I also found it pretty tough to get a smooth 1-2 shift, even after 2+ years of ownership. On the plus side, it was fast, handled well, and mostly easy to work on

In reply to Floating Doc : 

I drove an ‘00 accord until 225k, so I feel your pain. The problem with the 6th gen is that there just isn’t any good engine options. The f23 isn’t as good as the f22 that preceded it and the j30a1 is probably the worst iteration of the j series. Couple that with no manual trans and an auto transmission that has a penchant for self immolation, it’s just really hard to have fun with the car. The best option is an h22 swap, but given the cost, you’re better off buying a 7th gen, 3rd gen TL, or TSX. 

Curtis: I don't want a BMW because they're too expensive to maintain.

Also Curtis: I want a Jag XJR.

Considering the things we all value most - smiles per mile more than most, as well as our DIY nature - I think an LS swapped E39 is the closest you can get to "the answer."  That would put you in E39 M5 territory (which is a fantastic car all around) for less money, with less maintenance and easier to find parts/modifications. 

And I have NEVER understood even the slightest bit of love for P71s.  Are they reliable?  Sure.  Nothing else about it is good though.  The seats aren't comfortable, they're just soft.  And the suspension is horrible, the power sucks, the gas mileage sucks, and they're just plain ugly.  There's nothing sporting about them.  Rant over.

In reply to Ian F :

Yeah, but if we're going to be rational, we're all going to have to leave.

infinitenexus said:

Considering the things we all value most - smiles per mile more than most, as well as our DIY nature - I think an LS swapped E39 is the closest you can get to "the answer."  That would put you in E39 M5 territory (which is a fantastic car all around) for less money, with less maintenance and easier to find parts/modifications. 

 

I have often thought it would be a fun project to get a needy old Rolls Royce, strip out the engine, transmission, HVAC, ICE and electrics, and rebuild it with modern hot rod components - but otherwise leave it looking stock on the inside and outside. I don't know if it would work to make the car more reliable and less maintenance intensive, but it would be an interesting project.

I came here to say crown Vic. Apparently it's been done. I also don't know why they have a reputation as gas hogs. The one I drove had 3.73 rears and still managed low-mid 20s. Granted I drive like a very old man most of the time, but still. Speaking of 3.73 gears, what a bang for the buck. Some lighter mustang wheels with 245 or 255... death wheel the springs... you won't be competitive but you'll be smiling.