What's the best way to get into HPDE?

A couple weeks ago I went to one of those events where they let you rent a supercar and take it on a track.  Surprisingly they let me actually beat on it a bit and I had a blast.  I want to start taking my C5 Z06 to track events, but I'm confused on how I can actually get into the sport.

I've seen some tracks require drivers go through an accredited driving school program, others just require a certain amount of time on a track, and I've also seen some require a competition drivers license.  I wish I could just go to a track to get some seat time and get better, but it seems it won't be that simple.  

I'm in PA so I can go to tracks in PA, NJ, VA, OH, and MD.  I'm taking this winter to do more research on HPDE and how to get into it, and I also need a helmet, new tires, and to do some maintenance.  I plan on doing whatever it is I need to do to start early spring.    

A lot of HPDEs are also schools, where you get an instructor. Look for one of those to start with. As far as the car goes, it sounds like you're on the right track. Concentrate on maintenance, flush the brake fluid, make sure your tires are not corded or too old, and go have fun. Honestly, a C5 Z06 is a lot of car, so it'll be a while before you have enough experience to start finding it's limits.

And yes, get an SA-rated helmet. Might as well wait for the 2020s now.

A school is a great choice as your first event -- I highly recommend the one that BMWCCA puts on (it's open to other makes as well).

I did a quick search here on our website, and here is what I came up with:

8 Easy Steps To Get On Track
Column: 10 Steps to Fulfilling Your Motorsports Dreams

Hopefully these help, and good luck!

Step 1: get an SA2020 helmet.  I got something like this off of Amazon and it has been perfectly fine for four seasons now.

Conquer SA2020 helmet

Step 2: bleed your brakes and replace the fluid with some good quality DOT4 fluid.  There are a bunch that will work fine, I like Motul RBF660.

Step 3: if your tires are less than five years old and have decent tread, you're probably fine.  If not, replace them with some decent summer tires.  DO NOT get super high-performance track tires, it will slow down your learning process dramatically.  Regular summer street tires like Michelin Pilot Sport 4S, Continental Extreme Contact Sport, BF Goodrich Sport Comp 2 or Yokohama S.Drive are perfect.  Check your brake pads; if they have lots of life left, they should be fine.  If not, replace them with a "sport" type pad- something like Stoptech Sport or Hawk HP+.

Step 4: pick who you want to run with.  A next step to consider would be Track Night in America, which is run by SCCA.  It's a great place for a beginner to get on the track cheaply and figure out what it's all about.  It definitely has it critics because beginners get on the track with no instruction, but I've been to a bunch of them and I've seen very few incidents.  Don't be a dummy and drive within your limits.  If that goes well, find an HPDE operator that does instructed novice session and spend as much time with the instructor as possible!

Since you're in the area (I'm in CT), I'd recommend looking at the MassTuning events (Look up MassTuning Trackfest on the bookfaces), NASA NE(National Auto Sport Association NorthEast region) or SCDA.  I instruct with MassTuning and NASA and have a blast with their events.  Feel free to email me via this board for specifics.

Edit:   ShinnyGroove  covered all of my tech recommendations, and I think the guide that Colin linked to above goth the rest, but drink a bunch of water and relax :)

There's a bunch of us instructor-type-people around this site, so ask away for any specific questions.  We're used to working with complete novices, so don't feel like you have to prove anything or you're not good enough or whatever. 

If you just want to go out on your own, you can get going with Track Night in America.  That'll let you sign up and go out on track and have fun with your friends.  But if that seems a bit overwhelming, it's okay, I'd just recommend signing up for one of the groups I mentioned above.

Depending on where you're at exactly, the tracks I regularly get to in your probable range are Palmer (MA), Thompson (CT), NYST (NY), Pocono (PA), NJMP (NJ), Watkins Glen (NY).  

Helmet, basic maintenance, power adders. During level 1 and level 2 passing is limited to the straights and often with point by, so to win your rookie season of HPDE horsepower is necessary evil. 

(I'm kidding, but it's one of the rare times on track where I wished that I had more power, instead of more tire).

"There's a bunch of us instructor-type-people around this site, so ask away for any specific questions.  We're used to working with complete novices, so don't feel like you have to prove anything or you're not good enough or whatever."

With this in mind, here's a newbie question.. I'm now in a convertible with no optional hardtop (1959 Berkeley).. I get the impression that for a standard HPDE, a roll bar is optional(?), or at least dependent on the venue(?).  I'm in the middle of the build now, and at this point it's easy to fab in roll bar mounting pads to the frame with an eye toward needing a bolt-in/removable roll bar in the future (the Berk is heavily modded and now has a true frame)..  This street car will only rarely see a track but, but if I get hooked on track driving, I can see this evolving into wanting to race door-to-door in the future.. Booohoohoohoohaahaha!

....All of this is to ask:  Do I need a roll bar for HPDE, and in the eventuality that I do, is a 'bolt in' roll bar acceptable? (I don't want a roll bar permanently mounted in the car)... and finally, I was thinking of a 3-leg 'hoop' type for this tiny car (very sexy Cobra-esque!).. 

**TMI- I have been to one HPDE driving event a few years ago in my modded Honda N600 (Buttonwillow, CA)... it was humbling and fun all at once.. the only drawback was the main guy/instructor was a bit of a turn off.. ..impatient with our many silly questions.. not the welcoming, patient, empathetic teacher like you'd hope for as you need a bit of first-time hand holding..  ..also, very much an aside; I was struck that there were almost no other 'old' cars there.. I don't know why I thought there would be, but most cars seemed to be 15 years old or newer.. just struck me as odd..

Thanks for indulging this very 'me'-centered question about getting out there in a convertible :-)

--ccrunner

ccrunner said:

....All of this is to ask:  Do I need a roll bar for HPDE, and in the eventuality that I do, is a 'bolt in' roll bar acceptable? (I don't want a roll bar permanently mounted in the car)... and finally, I was thinking of a 3-leg 'hoop' type for this tiny car (very sexy Cobra-esque!).. 

The vast majority of track organizations will require a roll bar to run an open car on track.  In the 20 years I've been doing track days I've seen 2 or 3 events that allowed convertibles to run without.

And yes, unless you specifically look for a group catering to drivers of vintage cars, expect most of the cars out there to be 5-15 years old.

You need a benchmark and progress tracker.

I am sure there are plenty of high end gizmos out there, but I also think you can get a phone app that will track your progress around the course. Race Chrono or some such?

No idea how it works, but a person I work with uses it for his track days and it shows his laps as an overlay on the course.  This will also give you something to "race" against that is more than just lap times.

I like the FRS for an intro to track day car because, as Jeremy Clarkson says "If it all goes wrong and you are about to crash really bad, you can just open the door and step out; not like you will be going very fast" or words to that effect.

I’ll second the SCCA track night, I took my daughter to one as her first time on track.

About your third event get Harry’s Laptimer for you phone to track you progress.

My first event was with the BMWCCA, they run a nice event also.  Basically look at the track schedule, call the number on the list and whoever is hosting it will welcome you with open arms.

When I decided to get into HPDE I started with a stock 92 Mustang GT on all seasons,    timed my run with just better pads and cooling ducts as a baseline.  

Added better suspension, shaved two seconds, added more seat time, shaved two seconds, added rain, didn’t go any slower?  I must suck in the dry.  

Added more tire and another round of suspension, shaved two seconds.   Hooked for life.

Go to a PCA, BMW or Audi club event. Search motorsportsreg for events near you.

DO NOT DO THE SCCA TRACK NIGHTS OF AMERICA as a first event in my opinion. Burned by an awful experience even though I had 5 years of experience and wont ever touch one again. 

And remember, you can't win an HPDE event. 

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

ccrunner said:

....All of this is to ask:  Do I need a roll bar for HPDE, and in the eventuality that I do, is a 'bolt in' roll bar acceptable? (I don't want a roll bar permanently mounted in the car)... and finally, I was thinking of a 3-leg 'hoop' type for this tiny car (very sexy Cobra-esque!).. 

The vast majority of track organizations will require a roll bar to run an open car on track.  In the 20 years I've been doing track days I've seen 2 or 3 events that allowed convertibles to run without.

And yes, unless you specifically look for a group catering to drivers of vintage cars, expect most of the cars out there to be 5-15 years old.

Chin doesn't require a rollbar in a convertible.  You do run with the top up.

Sign up at http://motorsportreg.com/ to get notification of events, you specify the distance you're willing to travel.  I get special emails occasionally with deals on some events due to low registration.  The sponsors of the events are renting the tracks and need to maximize revenue.

sergio said:

And remember, you can't win an HPDE event. 

But you can certainly lose.

maj75 (Forum Supporter) said:

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

ccrunner said:

....All of this is to ask:  Do I need a roll bar for HPDE, and in the eventuality that I do, is a 'bolt in' roll bar acceptable? (I don't want a roll bar permanently mounted in the car)... and finally, I was thinking of a 3-leg 'hoop' type for this tiny car (very sexy Cobra-esque!).. 

The vast majority of track organizations will require a roll bar to run an open car on track.  In the 20 years I've been doing track days I've seen 2 or 3 events that allowed convertibles to run without.

And yes, unless you specifically look for a group catering to drivers of vintage cars, expect most of the cars out there to be 5-15 years old.

Chin doesn't require a rollbar in a convertible.  You do run with the top up.

 

A novice in a slow car may not have a lot of fun at a Chin event. Around here they tend to be loaded with good drivers in heavy artillery.  I'm an intermediate/advanced driver in most other groups, but in a Spec Miata I'm about on pace with the Solo drivers in Chin's Novice group. Last time I ran with them I was the only car in the session with less than 300hp. I basically never get a clean lap in Intermediate 1, constant point-by's.  I love Chin's events, but usually run my Cayman S. 

It just depends on what group you decide to run with. Some have a pretty strict ladder system, but there are a lot where you can basically just arrive and drive. Many of the clubs/groups have their events listed on MotorsportReg.com but if you want to be more thorough you can pick through the schedules of the tracks you're interested in running and go from there. If you're running a C5 Z06 I'd at the very least get a second set of brake pads/rotors, since the car has the potential to really tax them going into braking zones. I ran DTC-70s on mine which were ok. Those cars also really like to cook the oil, so I ran M1 15W-50 and made sure to keep an eye on the oil temps whenever I could. An aftermarket oil cooler is advisable. Due to the car's bottom-feeder intake it has a tendancy to pick up lots of dirt/debris and fill the rad/AC condenser, so I'd recommend cleaning those out or just replacing them. For me it made a huge difference on my oil/coolant temps. I could go from only being able to turn 2-3 laps before slowing down to being able to run full bore for 15 minutes or so. 

In reply to ccrunner :

As others said, almost every club will require a roll bar due to insurance.  I've been to I think two events that didn't require them out of over 100. 

Bolt in is likely fine.

I would avoid going to the modern marque clubs, such as BMWCCA or PCA or whatever.  Most of the people there will be in new M3s or Caymans and a whole lotta vettes, and you might struggle with being run down in an older ride.

Around here we have a club called the Northeast Corvair Council.  I'd be looking for clubs like that, or a local tuning club who is focusing on street cars popular with "the kids.". At the mass tuning events we get everything from new GTRs to 80s civics and pickup trucks from the old craftsman truck series.  We've had some older open wheel cars on track with us with no drama.

ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) said:

maj75 (Forum Supporter) said:

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

ccrunner said:

....All of this is to ask:  Do I need a roll bar for HPDE, and in the eventuality that I do, is a 'bolt in' roll bar acceptable? (I don't want a roll bar permanently mounted in the car)... and finally, I was thinking of a 3-leg 'hoop' type for this tiny car (very sexy Cobra-esque!).. 

The vast majority of track organizations will require a roll bar to run an open car on track.  In the 20 years I've been doing track days I've seen 2 or 3 events that allowed convertibles to run without.

And yes, unless you specifically look for a group catering to drivers of vintage cars, expect most of the cars out there to be 5-15 years old.

Chin doesn't require a rollbar in a convertible.  You do run with the top up.

 

A novice in a slow car may not have a lot of fun at a Chin event. Around here they tend to be loaded with good drivers in heavy artillery.  I'm an intermediate/advanced driver in most other groups, but in a Spec Miata I'm about on pace with the Solo drivers in Chin's Novice group. Last time I ran with them I was the only car in the session with less than 300hp. I basically never get a clean lap in Intermediate 1, constant point-by's.  I love Chin's events, but usually run my Cayman S. 

I recently had that experience in my Miata at Watkins Glen with the BMWCCA...  I've raced there plenty of times and was respectable as far as lap times go, but at a place like that when you're about 250hp down from mostly everyone else, you're hurting.

In reply to ccrunner :

I instruct at PCA events and I bring my 1972 Datsun 1200. While few people bring older cars everyone is very receptive. As for the roll hoop just put one in the car and be done with it.

For the original poster, just check events in your area there should be plenty that you can start running right away, albeit in a student group.

Tom1200 said:

In reply to ccrunner :

I instruct at PCA events and I bring my 1972 Datsun 1200. While few people bring older cars everyone is very receptive. Ad for the roll hoop just put one in the car and be done with it.

For the original poster, just check events in your area there should be plenty that you can start running right away, albeit in a student group.

Thank you Tom, and everyone else for sharing your insights and experiences.. this track day stuff is intimidating when you're so far out of your depth.. I'll definitely fab in the needed frame pads for a 3-leg roll bar (bolt in).. I don't want to be turned away for failing to meet such an easy requirement.. As for where to run and what group- I don't want to be the super slow, in-the-way guy.. I'll definitely  be with the newbies for awhile   ..this may take some time to sort out as my tiny Berk now has a VFR (bike) powerplant, so once I grow into the car and actually learn to drive it, I have no idea if I'll end up bombing around with the FRS's, or be out there with a faster group.. 

First things first- gotta get the car sorted and get a roll bar in it 

thanks again guys-

--ccrunner

A lot of advice here, but don't overthink your first event. Checkout motorsports reg and find a good weekend with one of the many groups. 

Are your brakes recently bled and have good fluid and decent pad life? 

Do you have a helmet or can borrow one?

Good, have fun!

I see too many people "over prep" their car before they even have driven a single event. I like to go back to this video to remind people how low the bar is for having fun on track.

Trackdaze is an amazing organization with a very good novice experience. Never felt rushed and the instruction was superb. Its been a while but they also had a pretty good price for a single day novice group was like $235.

They are mainly at Summit Point, Dominion Raceway and VIR but those are the local tracks to our area.

I've served as instructor (even Chief Instructor) for just about every one of these HPDE groups over the last 25 years. I would strongly recommend joining the BMW CCA and starting with their program. All you need is a car and a helmet.