Will E85 be the next shot in the horsepower wars?

The new Hellcat engine in the Challenger was just announced... at 707 horsepower. It seems likely GM or Ford may try to top that sooner or later.

This has me wondering one thing: The current crop of supercharged engines run on pump gas. Why hasn't anyone built a flex fuel one yet? That should be an easy way to get a pretty significant horsepower bump just from the extra quantity of fuel burned and the higher octane. Blowers and alcohol go together like peanut butter and jelly. Plus, CAFE would only include the 15% of the fuel that's gasoline, unless they changed the rules. What are the odds the next round of muscle cars are optimized for E85?

I am surprised that this hasn't happened to some extent already, HOWEVER, I don't think that E85 is as easy to get out west as it is in the midwest and east coast. That is a pretty good deterant from the manufactures' view. Honda has had Hydrogen cars for years but they aren't available outside CA because a lack of fueling stations.

+1 surprised it hasn't happened already. It's already happened in racing, every ridiculous 4-digit-HP modern drift car runs on E85 or E100.

I am building a E85 SBF for the Rustang per the thread, well my engine guru is

Wasn't the 1000 bhp Konisegg an E85 car? I remember them trumpeting the green aspect.

Availability is definitely a problem. Some states just don't have the stuff.

In reply to MadScientistMatt:

There is already a 1000hp Shelby. Came out about a year and a half ago, although I've yet to find where it states the fuel used.

On the issue of availability, if you don't go nuts with the compression, you could use a flex fuel sensor to have it back off the tune and horsepower when it's running regular gasoline, then deliver the full advertised power when you fill it up with E85.

Small problem to the E85 solution is that you're pumping in an ABSURD amount of fuel to make that extra power. It might not be all that great to have a 855HP muscle car that gets 5 mpg when driven easy and drops to 1.4 when pushed. Hard to get to the next gas station that way....

Keith Tanner wrote: Wasn't the 1000 bhp Konisegg an E85 car? I remember them trumpeting the green aspect. Availability is definitely a problem. Some states just don't have the stuff.

IIRC all but their earliest cars are capable of running on E85 or E100.

KyAllroad wrote: Small problem to the E85 solution is that you're pumping in an ABSURD amount of fuel to make that extra power. It might not be all that great to have a 855HP muscle car that gets 5 mpg when driven easy and drops to 1.4 when pushed. Hard to get to the next gas station that way....

It wouldn't be a problem on the track, if they're flex-fuel-capable just run the gas tank low and fill up with corn juice before the event. Also for measuring engine-dicks on the showroom floor and at cruise night, the number is all that really matters. The guys who don't take their cars on track will rarely use all the engine's power anyway.

I'm surprised they allowed a pedestrian engine to make more than their halo car.....

Plus, the horsepower wars are so crazy now that some automotive journalists are saying that some cars have too much power. Some have said that the Mustang GT 500 has too much power with 662, and Jeremy Clarkson said the Ferrari F12 Berlinetta and the Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG Black series have too much power. What makes SRT think that they won't get the same criticism?

Edit; I read an article on it and they wanted to win the musclecar horsepower war (for now).

In reply to Mr_Clutch42:

Again, the Shelby 1000 puts out 1000hp, so they haven't won. Yes, Shelby is a tuner, but Shelby's are developed by Ford SVT and sold through Ford dealers.

Shelby Super Snakes are also $100k.....

Availability is the biggest weakness for going E85/E99 or E100, unless you are buying 55 drums from the local bulk oil/fuel supplier. Like for myself, at the pump, E85 is not available unless I drive at least a hour and a half one way away, but the one local bulk oil dealer that will deliver close to me gets and sells E85-E100.

In reply to Ranger50:

This conversation was never about cost, it was about the muscle car with the most power. They aren't claiming the Hellcat makes the most power for a certain amount of money. Chrysler is claiming it makes the most power period. Wrong.

bravenrace wrote: Chrysler is claiming it makes the most power period. Wrong.

Where are they claiming this? I haven't seen it yet?

In reply to bravenrace:

Then how they, being Chrysler/Fiat, wrong?

The Shelby Super Snake is an upgrade provided via Shelby and not a rolled off an assembly line. So again, how are they wrong?

I was thinking about E85 for a project last yr,searched for stations offering it in Ontario Canada.....there were 4.

Not so handy.

Ranger50 wrote: In reply to bravenrace: Then how they, being Chrysler/Fiat, wrong? The Shelby Super Snake is an upgrade provided via Shelby and not a rolled off an assembly line. So again, how are they wrong?

I can order a Shelby 1000 from my local Ford Shelby dealer just like I can a Mustang GT. And Ford does the development of Shelbys in-house. That's why Chrysler is wrong.

nicksta43 wrote:

bravenrace wrote: Chrysler is claiming it makes the most power period. Wrong.

Where are they claiming this? I haven't seen it yet?

I can't find it either, but plenty of other sources are representing it as that. Even the OP in this thread alluded to it. Then I heard Ralph Gilles say it in an interview on TV. So maybe they didn't make the claim officially, but I'm not official either, so there's that.

In reply to bravenrace:

Agree to disagree at this point.

If you think it's too powerful, use the black key-fob

the all-new 2015 Dodge Challenger SRT with a Hellcat engine comes standard with two key fobs -- red and black. The red key fob is the only key that can unlock the full 707 horsepower and torque potential of the Challenger SRT Hellcat engine; while the black key fob limits the driver to a reduced engine output of 500 horsepower.

Ranger50 wrote: In reply to bravenrace: Agree to disagree at this point.

We can do that, I guess. Not much fun though...

OK, bravenrace, show me where the Shelby 1000 available on the Ford website. Shelby is like Brabus or Alpina, etc. You can order all sorts of aftermarket stuff and packages from dealers.

What I find on the Shelby website doesn't mention it being developed by ford.

http://shelbyamerican.com/2013shelby1000.asp

bravenrace wrote:

nicksta43 wrote:

bravenrace wrote: Chrysler is claiming it makes the most power period. Wrong.

Where are they claiming this? I haven't seen it yet?

I can't find it either, but plenty of other sources are representing it as that. Even the OP in this thread alluded to it. Then I heard Ralph Gilles say it in an interview on TV. So maybe they didn't make the claim officially, but I'm not official either, so there's that.

I found this article which may be where this is coming from. I don't believe it's coming from dodge.

http://m.nydailynews.com/autos/707-horsepower-2015-dodge-challenger-srt-hellcat-muscle-car-king-article-1.1852483