Winches & trailers

I have a winch in my enclosed trailer for use in loading cars, mounted on the centerline.  It seems, though, that most cars don't have a centerline winching hook, usually it's located on one side or the other, presumably because it's anchored onto the frame rail rather than the comparatively flimsy structure in front of the radiator.  This wasn't an issue with my Miata because I usually drove that into the trailer and only used the winch occasionally when I broke it badly enough.  Now I'm taking the M3 to the track, though, and it has a clutch that's not really well-suited to creeping up inclines, so I'm using the winch every time I load it.

The problem is that when winching it in, as the angle gets more and more offset to the right, the winch cable tends not to want to wind upon across the drum but instead starts piling up on that end.  This doesn't spool properly (not enough clearance inside the winch) and appears to be making some kinks in the cable.  I can usually mitigate this with a bit of fiddling, but it's a PITA and I'm trying to figure out what to change to make it work with less micromanagement.

One person suggested I should be using synthetic rope instead of steel cable.  I didn't even know that existed, so I went and looked it up, and while it appears to have some benefits, I don't see anything suggesting it would really help here.

I've thought about trying to add a centerline winch point to the car, but that seems like it probably involves welding a bunch of extra steel (ie, weight) onto the front.  Someone else suggested moving the winch over to the right as well, which is theoretically possible, but is a bunch of work and would compromise storage.

Some pictures.  Here's the front of the trailer, the winch goes in the cabinet in the center, and pays out through the slot below the door.  I didn't pick this mounting point -- that's where the previous owner had installed his winch, and I just reused the existing mounting holes.

The winch cabinet.  The winch itself is a Warn 3700.  The slot in the cabinet face might be part of the problem, I'm not sure -- it's the same width as the winch rollers, but that means when the cable is angled to the right it winds up rubbing against the edge of the slot.

Here's the car with the offset hook in red:

Any thoughts?

I have the exact same problem so I am very interesting in hearing the options. 

I put a hook on both sides and a strap between them and winch off the strap

Snatch block seems to be the easy answer here

When I installed the winch in my trailer I fabricated a bracket to hold a roller fairlead flush with the front of the cabinet.  Doesn't completely solve your problem, but it keeps the cabinet from being damaged. 

Kinda describing the problem: the shorter the trailer, the greater the angle on the winch as the car gets further in.  My trailer is a 24' V-nose, with the winch very close to the nose, so the angle for me never gets too acute.

If I were solving the problem myself, I would add a roller fairlead to the cabinet for starters, and then look for tubular bumper structure with an integral central tow hook.

fiesta54 said:

Snatch block seems to be the easy answer here

Came here to say the same thing.  I have the same issue you do, and my plan it to make two anchor points on my trailer (on the left and right) where I can mount up a snatch block to get the cable to either side.

Patrick said:

I put a hook on both sides and a strap between them and winch off the strap

I do the same but my car is so old that it has "old school" bumpers and not the plastic covers that all car have today.

What I have see done is to place the winch off to the side of the trailer and turned 90 deg. to the load. Then place a pulley in the correct place on the floor to align the winch with the attachment point on the car.

I would rather see wenches on trailers.  

The best way to not damage anything is with a bridle.  The small j hooks should fit into slots in the bottom of the rocker panels where the jack pads are plugged in and the winch pulls from the center ring.  

https://zips.com/parts-detail/aw-direct-v-bridle-with-cluster-hooks-3-tpv70dl

Edit:  The instruction to use the slots in the rockers are for most BMWs, other cars may have their slots in other locations, usually in front subframes and ahead of the rear wheels. 

fiesta54 said:

Snatch block seems to be the easy answer here

That's basically a pulley on a cable, right?  What kind of geometry are you suggesting?  Does the pulley get anchored on the right side of the trailer (so that it lines up with the hook on the car)?  If so, does that require rotating the winch by about 30 degrees?

Or does the pulley get anchored on the left, so that keeps the line going into the winch straight?  Now that I think about it, the previous owner welded an eye to the frame of the trailer over on that side for which I've never quite understood the purpose -- maybe that's what it's for?

Wally said:

The best way to not damage anything is with a bridle.  The small j hooks should fit into slots in the bottom of the rocker panels where the jack pads are plugged in and the winch pulls from the center ring.  

 Hm, that looks interesting as well.  Looks like it's got three hooks on each end?  Do the ones you're not using come off?

Mine is mounted center because I never know what I'm dragging up there. The rolling load is usually low enough that pushing the cable over with my foot takes care of the pile up. I just give it a shove every couple of seconds. Problem solved. 

I’d move the winch into the other cabinet to line up with your tow loop before I started playing with snatch blocks. To use the block the winch stays where it is and you’d want the pulley more or less in line with the tow loop so the cable pulls straight from the car to the pulley, then changes directions to the winch.  The problem would be either you need to keep the block a fair distance away from the winch so the line doesn’t pull at the side too much or a second snatch block in front of the winch to allow the line to load more evenly on the drum.

Patrick said:

I put a hook on both sides and a strap between them and winch off the strap

Simple, cheap, easy, and effective. 

In reply to codrus :

The unused ones are all permanently mounted to use on a variety of vehicles.  You can usually order them with just the hook you want (the mini J hook) instead of the cluster.

Wally said:

I’d move the winch into the other cabinet to line up with your tow loop before I started playing with snatch blocks. To use the block the winch stays where it is and you’d want the pulley more or less in line with the tow loop so the cable pulls straight from the car to the pulley, then changes directions to the winch.  The problem would be either you need to keep the block a fair distance away from the winch so the line doesn’t pull at the side too much or a second snatch block in front of the winch to allow the line to load more evenly on the drum.

Yeah, using a single snatch block to keep the line going straight forwards from the car seems like it would make the problem worse rather than better.  I'm not sure how important it is to keep the line pulling the car straight here -- there's plenty of traction, so I'm not concerned about it sliding sideways.

Moving the winch into the other cabinet is going to impact the storage utility of the cabinets pretty significantly, so I'd prefer to avoid that.  The bridle is looking like a good, simple solution.

They also make the bridles with chain instead of nylon that are a bit less expensive.     https://zips.com/parts-detail/b-a-v-chain-r-t-mini-j-hooks-g70-v-chain-11-8lug7

Using a snatch block solves pulling the car straight but is going to side load the wire to one side of the winch drum just the same problem as you have now. The bridal with a second attachment point seems the simplest solution. 

I'm just going to put my winch on one side of the trailer, aligned with where my tow hooks are, so it just pulls straight. 

I use a similar winch- no cabinet. 

I stand on the cable (with shoes with decent soles) and manually work it across the drum as needed. 

SVreX said:

I use a similar winch- no cabinet. 

I stand on the cable (with shoes with decent soles) and manually work it across the drum as needed. 

The space between the inner fenders in my trailer is narrow enough that I generally need to be tweaking the steering wheel to get the car to line up where I want it while winching (wireless remote).

Have you tried adding or moving the fairlead to in front of the cabinet? Also, I thought they made powered fairleads to help control the wrap of the cable. Although I couldn’t find anything on a quick google. 

spitfirebill said:

I would rather see wenches on trailers.  

On Craigslist they're the same thing.

I would mount the winch further back in the cabinet and stick a sturdy eye bolt right behind the slot in the cabinet door. It will keep the cable going straight into the winch with whatever you are dragging into the trailer. 

that bridle is probably your best bet. Cheaper and easier than modifying anything on the trailer or the car.