The Rav4 Hybrid has picked up where the Prius V left off. The Prius V was a great size and as such they command a premium on the used market. I suspect the Rav4 Hybrid commands a similar premium.
The Rav4 Hybrid has picked up where the Prius V left off. The Prius V was a great size and as such they command a premium on the used market. I suspect the Rav4 Hybrid commands a similar premium.
It sure seems like the answer is go older with a nice low mileage Mazda5, or pick a 3 row CUV.
Which, let's face it, a 3 row CUV basically is a less practical minivan but... I tried that logic too and now we have a Mazda 5 because it's, um, "not a minivan" :P
For what it's worth, the Kia Carnival is a minivan that looks more suv-like, if looks are a factor in the minivan perception.
Mrs Frog loves her Kia Carnival. Hauls two adults up front and four kids in back with two in car seats. Mr. Frog can drive with his seat fully back. Not as tall as most mini-vans. Looks a bit more CUV-like. 3 rows. We have hauled 6 full size adults.
When you are doing life with car seats those automatic electric sliding side doors are a big plus. Take her to lots with the kids and the car seats.
Otherwise, your desires (high mpg, cuv-like, 3 rows) and your price wishes (late model, low price) don't coincide. I want a new Z51 C8 before Christmas for $80K....
Transit Connect is a minivan, no?
3 row SUVs like my highlander have nearly zero storage space behind the third row seats. You can take the gang to a meal but not to San Diego unless you max out a rooftop box. Gargantuan storage space when NOT using the third row.
We picked up a brand new 2021 Traverse earlier this year for $36k+ tax, front wheel drive only (we have my truck if we need a 4x4). 3 rows, but the third row stays stowed 99% of the time. The big GM V6 is really nice, and the 9 speed auto its coupled to is one of the slickest shifting big speed units I've ever driven. I rented one of these for two weeks on a business trip and really liked it. The kicker? That GM V6 packs a 300HP wallop, that accelerates this family mobile from still to 60 in 6 seconds, and has to be electronically speed-governed to 130 mph. On a recent trip to SC we saw over 27 mpg on highway tanks; kicking around town it's usually in the lower 20's.
Our kids are still in child seats, and with them in the third row we have put an adult in between them. IIRC the width of the Traverse is about equivalent to a Sienna. We also hauled a hutch back from Ohio with it and the four of us, and all our luggage on board.
My mine gripe against minivans is not the image- it's that I hate sliding doors. I had a minivan rental and the infernal electric doors always had a mind of their own and took FOREVER to make it up. I want a berkeleying door that opens when I pull the handle, and shuts when I slam it, like the berkeleying Neanderthal that I am.
In reply to Boost_Crazy :
I use a Cargo carrier if we go on big trips or during the Christmas when we are likely have big items to bring back. I have the captains chairs in the 2nd row so there is a little more space then the regular haulers, that have a bench. I can also put two kids in the 3rd row and fold the captains chair as well for more room.
My wife drives a 22 Highlander XLE Hybrid. Very nice interior and has gotten 37mpg regularly (in warm weather).
only downside? the CVT Hybrid drivetrain is...lackluster.
To clarify, the big trips would not be made with 6 people in the car. Only occasionally would we haul 6 people, and usually just back from PHX airport with some luggage.
I have a rooftop box as well.
STM317 said:In reply to pheller :
How does the desire for so much space square with your wife's desire for compact vehicles that are easy to fit places?
Something like a Rav4 hybrid would be much easier to meet your price/fuel efficiency goals and seems totally reasonable for 2 adults, 2 small kids and their stuff.
Married 20 or so years I'll say your first question is complete nonsense.
I agree the explorer or highlander seem to be the easy button with the grand Cherokee as the outsider.
How tall are you pheller and are the kids front facing or rear facing?
Personally I am 6'2" and if I had to have a rear facing seat behind me, there is no way I could use most the CX5/CX50, RAV4, Escape, CRV. It would get pretty tight for leg room in those SUVs for the kid too imo. I couldn't imagine using one of those size SUVs with two kids tbh.
Regarding the CX9, I could work if the rear seats are being used as only occasional things and you aren't carrying much luggage. It is a great SUV, drives way better then most other three row SUVs and doesn't feel like a big three row SUV. But the third room is small and with the third row up there is very little storage room. So I think that could be an option but the mpg will just meet your minimum. Ours got a bit over 23 mpg mixed driving.
pheller said:The reason we're purchasing this vehicle is for daily kid hauling tasks. Which means we need that added space all the time.
...which is precisely the minivan's design brief.
I'd work on convincing her / finding one she will accept.
OP's wife should start a car company and build something that hits all her targets.
FWIW our 18' Explorer Platinum 3.5 EB only gets 21-22 on the highway.
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:OP's wife should start a car company and build something that hits all her targets.
Actually yes, even without kids a car that hits all this and gets 30or so mpg sounds great.
Maybe try to prioritize the wants she has? Take out holding 6 and a Maverick could actually work well, gets good MPG, could get a tonneau cover for the bed and it has stuff room, back seat from what I've seen is pretty spacious for the size, isn't huge by any means, is new and under your budget, has ground clearance for gravel roads and isn't a minivan.
But doesn't hold 6
Friend's wife feels the same way but thinks the new Kia minivan looks enough like an SUV that she wants one. ...
Also Mercedes made that one not-a-minivan minivan. Even an absurd AMG version
For that renting on occasion option, check Turo. It's an airBNB for cars and I've had great luck in major metros
chandler said:STM317 said:In reply to pheller :
How does the desire for so much space square with your wife's desire for compact vehicles that are easy to fit places?
Something like a Rav4 hybrid would be much easier to meet your price/fuel efficiency goals and seems totally reasonable for 2 adults, 2 small kids and their stuff.
Married 20 or so years I'll say your first question is complete nonsense.
I was trying to determine whether the desire for this large capacity and capability was actually something that's coming from wifeheller, or if that's pheller's preferences or vision for this vehicle coming through as some sore of compromise.
If wifeheller wants something relatively inexpensive with 3 rows that carries a bunch, gets fantastic fuel efficiency, and isn't a minivan, she's out of luck. But if all she really wants is something like a slightly larger Fit, or something Mazda 5 sized and pheller is adding other qualifiers, then my advice changes.
The OP says that wifeheller wants the smallest tool that will get the job done. She likes Honda Fits and Mazda 5s. He goes on to say that HE finds legroom to be an issue with carseats behind, and that she might be convinced to consider something larger. To me, that implies that pheller is currently looking for a different vehicle than wifeheller and is trying to find a unicorn that could be a compromise between what each one wants individually, rather than just getting something that she might be more comfortable with.
Duke said:pheller said:The reason we're purchasing this vehicle is for daily kid hauling tasks. Which means we need that added space all the time.
...which is precisely the minivan's design brief.
I'd work on convincing her / finding one she will accept.
Agreed.
Vans excel at space. They are almost entirely interior volume. You can get a MUCH smaller footprint on the outside for the same space inside. I don't have advice about convincing a wife, other than to throw chocolate-covered xanax and slowly back away. Avoid eye contact.
Can you make or find one of those x-ray pictures of a van interior and overlay it on something like an Acadia or Highlander to show her how much more space they have? Ex in-laws always leased a Sienna, so I had lots of experience in three of them. Lovely to drive.
Toyota Highlander
Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:Duke said:pheller said:The reason we're purchasing this vehicle is for daily kid hauling tasks. Which means we need that added space all the time.
...which is precisely the minivan's design brief.
I'd work on convincing her / finding one she will accept.
Agreed.
Vans excel at space. They are almost entirely interior volume. You can get a MUCH smaller footprint on the outside for the same space inside. I don't have advice about convincing a wife, other than to throw chocolate-covered xanax and slowly back away. Avoid eye contact.
Can you make or find one of those x-ray pictures of a van interior and overlay it on something like an Acadia or Highlander to show her how much more space they have? Ex in-laws always leased a Sienna, so I had lots of experience in three of them. Lovely to drive.
"I don't have advice about convincing a wife, other than to throw chocolate-covered xanax and slowly back away. Avoid eye contact."
Thats gold right there brother.. I've got nothing to add other than to take her out and get her to drive as many different vehicles as you can. You might be surprised at what she likes. How about a later model Kia Sorento, they drive smaller than they are, are available with seating for 6 (third row) and should just hit the bottom of your fuel mileage scale. A quick search turns up prices in the mid 30's for 2020 models. May be able to get into a 2021-2022 Sorento hybrid for upper 30's.
To be clear:
- I want as much as space as possible because if my portion of the family finances are going towards a new vehicle, I want something that I will never say "damn, I wish I would've brought the truck." Currently, we exceed the capacity of our small cars frequently and inevitably drive the truck.
- "Wifeheller" is the opposite - she'd rather have as small a vehicle as I could drive comfortably with a carseat behind me and space for her to ride in the back 3-across with the kids. That last part - "ride 3-across with the kids" is actually where we find some common ground. That excludes a minivan, but it does require a much larger vehicle that a CRV/Rav4/Forester. A Mazda5 or Transit Connect would not fit this criteria because they are both relatively narrow.
- "Riding in the back 3-across with kids" is a temporary requirement - once both kids are forward facing I'm not sure how much we'll do this.
- I would love a hot-rod wagon of some sort, and it'd probably meet our needs. I've always loved estates like the Mercedes, Audi and Volvo wagons. But I want at least one vehicle in the driveway that can haul 7 people because family visits a few times a year and driving two cars (or renting something) is a pain.
The long term goal is to get the largest vehicle my wife is happy to drive, an RV/Motorhome, and then I can finally get my mid-life-crisis toy. We will offset the loss of the truck with tougher tires on the family hauler, a mild lift, and a small utility trailer.
In reply to pheller :
I know left field, but...
What about a full size truck, crew cab with a short bed and the tiny turbo engine.
I know, it has a frame but they really do seat 3 across the rear with ample room. Staying with the turbo 4, they actually can get respectable mpg.
I mostly recommend it because you've mentioned truck a few times.
Sorento/Sante Fe. C'mon peeps you're slipping. Inlaws have the 3 row Sorento and love it. Comfortable, capable easy to drive and parks easy. Third row is actually usable.
when you gotta get littles in and out of a car seat, minivan all day every day. power sliding doors and giant apertures for the motherberkeleying win.
double that win when the kids are able to open the doors themselves and you're not the shiny happy person who's kids are slamming the doors into the cars next to you. especially when the car next to you is also yours.
triple that win because the speed of the power door slows the littles' exit capability.
but if you can't sell her on that, i say the newest EcoBoost Flex you can find.
You want a European style compact MPV. The three sold in recent memory are the Mazda 5, Ford C-max, and Prius V. I think the C-max plugin hybrid is the interesting choice of the three. My wife and I just traded in a Ford Flex for a low mileage Mazda 5. There are a few left on Carvana. The lower price should pay for the mpg deficit for a while.
The Ford Flex was great with the best headroom and the best second row head/legroom of any minivan or 3 row unibody suv I test drove. We sold it because we started getting into 3.5 ecoboost transverse engine issues and after buying a full sized truck, we didn't need two big cars.
We were pretty close to buying that V70R that was in the For Sale forum last month. 5 real seats, built in boosters in the rear, and the option of 2 extra rear facing seats for kids and occasional use.
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