'64 Dodge Dart - what should I do with it?

Update: I know I posted this like 2 years ago, but some changes happened recently...

I have a '74 Plymouth Satellite with a 360 that I built for it many years ago. I put in all the right stuff- aluminum heads, intake, 4 barrel carb, cam, double roller timing chain, headers, etc. And a 727 with a shift kit. The plymouth, however...well, it sat, and sat, and sat some more...until just recently when I worked a trade for the engineless body in exchange for a '51 Plymouth as a parts car for my '49 that I'm gradually restoring. So, last night, I and a few Yeungling Porters, pulled the 360 and 727 from the Satellite in prep for its trip to its new home.

So, I now have a 360 (which, built like I did, should be good for about 300HP) and trans sitting on my garage floor...and that 64 Dart still under a car cover in my front yard.

I'm glad I came back to check this thread- I was worrying about the rear axle (which is a 7-1/4, since the Dart was a /6 car) but now I'm thinking Mustang 8" rear end and front spindles. That'll give me choice of ratios (ideally I'd like somewhere between 3 and 3.5, to work with the engine and torque converter I've got, and the weight of the car) out back, and nice discs up front. And 4.5 x 5 bolt pattern wheels, which are pretty much ubiquitous.

I'm getting re-excited about this...

volvoclearinghouse wrote: I'm getting re-excited about this...

I rode to High school in a '64 dart. That funny shape gets me excited too.

Ahem.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYBTOGxj88E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjsscD7nNdo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxfRZTe6Sh4

The 727 can fit in the early tunnel. You'll probably need to hammer flat the pinch weld where the tunnel meets the firewall.

You are going to need A-body big ball joint upper control arms to bolt in the 4.5" wheel bolt pattern spindles. Any upper control arms from a '73-76 A-body will do the trick, or some aftermarket tubular ones.

The headers from the Sat won't fit. Early A ones are expensive. Early A manifolds are a bit restrictive. Some guys have been successful in adapting Magnum truck exhaust manifolds to the early A's. Requires a little grinding on the driver's manifold to get some clearance for the steering column. I have a buddy that's thinking about giving this a shot now.

The six cylinder center link doesn't dip down as much as the V8 one so you might run into some rubbing there. Might be able to dimple the oil pan if you can't locate a '64-66 center link.

The V8 motor mounts are different, but the K-member is the same between the 6 & 8. So if you find a 273 powered early A snag the mounts. Otherwise there are some aftermarket options.

What I was going to suggest has already pretty much been said. I had a '64 Valiant which I ultimately sold after it developed rust that was far more expensive to fix than I could afford.

Personally, if it's a track car only I'd build something like a 340 4-speed that'll rev. As mentioned, the early A bodies are light, so I'd try to take advantage of that. The disc swap (sold the Duster I'd bought for that, too) is a great idea. While I love the Slant 6 for its own virtues, I'm not wild about the turbo idea. Just seems like a whole lotta work for the hp available... Maybe it's just me.

A 340 is the only answer.

340 is the expensive answer. Especially since he has an aluminum headed 360 sitting there ready to go.

30-35 years ago 340 was the only answer. There are a whole lot more 360s to choose from, and good pistons for them are readily available now.

In reply to Rob_Mopar:

A 360 is sufficiently "like" a 340 (per my post) that it'll do.

Conveniently, the 64 has manual steering, no power assist, so the headers clearing the steering component is less of an issue.

I have 360 to 318 K member adaptors from the Satellite, which originally had a 318 (long gone) and 904. There will be some adapting going on, that's for sure...same with the brakes, which as I said I may ditch the Mopar pieces for whatever is junkyard-cheap and available. I don't see many 70's Mopars in the yards anymore...

this

Jumping in late: small block/4 speed/cage/vintage race!

I've thought about caging it and looking at some vintage race series...But I'm primarily looking at a low-buck build with whatever I've got on hand + whatever I can score easily at the pick n pull. A cage is always a good idea for a daily driver though, right? ;-)

The Sat would have had the spool mounts in it. The '64 uses sandwich mounts. I haven't seen it done, but I suppose a bracket that bolts to the K where the stock '64 mounts went could be made to mate up with the spool mounts. If you go that route, you need to post pics here.

Don't rule out the '80's for brake parts. You can snag the spindles/calipers/rotors from a M-body (Dippy/Gran Fury/5th Ave). Then you only need the later A upper control arms. They aren't hard to find. I might know where some are...

The Ford 8" rear is probably the cheapest/easiest option for the rear. I can't argue that. But finding '70's Fords in the yard are probably as hard to come by as the Mopars.

In reply to Rob_Mopar:

Which rear end would be easiest to fab rear disc brakes?

stroker wrote: In reply to Rob_Mopar: Which rear end would be easiest to fab rear disc brakes?

Explorer rear end?

I have a welder, I've fabbed engine mounts before.

Anything can be made to fit anywhere. Its just metal. If you can cut it and weld it back together, you're all the way there.

In reply to Rob_Mopar:

What about a rear from a Dodge pickup? Seems like that would work, and it's not like those are hard to come by.

The "best" Mopar rear would be an 8 3/4 to swap in. Uses a drop out center section like an 8 or 9" Ford. Non C-clip axles, uses retainers and adjusters at the ends. Can replace tapered roller bearings with sealed Green bearings if you don't want to mess with adjusters, or if the adjusters you have are shot. New adjusters aren't currently available.

A-bodies had the narrowest housings of the Mopars. On all the A-body 8 3/4's they used the 4" bolt circle, so cut down C-body, cut down truck, or aftermarket axles are needed for the the 4.5" bolt circle.

The drawback is 8 3/4 A-body rears are '67-72 only, and weren't all that common new. Performance models had them, and cars ordered with a towing or HD suspension got them.

The 8 3/4 stayed in production in the other models into '74. Was completely phased out by the '75 model year.

If you are willing to narrow down another housing, sky is the limit. C-body and truck housings are the widest, along with the '71-73 B-body wagons. You'll need to move spring perches, or just replace them with some aftermarket ones.

The housing ends are available new. I can't remember from who right now. Same as a passenger car Dana 60. Probably Moser and/or Strange have them.

For the easiest bolt-in Mopar rear with a 4.5" bolt pattern, it's the 8 1/4 from a '73-76 A-body. Look for a 318 car. Not all of them had them. Some had the weak 7 1/4. But if you found a donor with the 8 1/4 rear it probably had the matching disk brakes and upper control arms needed for that swap.

If you want to cut and mix parts you can make a non C-clip 8 1/4 or 9 1/4. The 8 1/4 wouldn't be worth the effort to do that with. The 9 1/4 can be. It's almost as strong as a Dana 60 but it's lighter. Used under tons of trucks. Use the new 8 3/4 / Dana housing ends with some custom axles. Gets expensive though.

No 9 1/4 were factory made that are narrow enough for an A-body out of the box.

An F-M-J body 8 1/4 is the next closest fitting rear, but it's a little wider. Would be very tight under a '64 Dart.

Easiest Mopar rear to fab disks for probably would be the 8 1/4. Snag some of the back of a 8 1/4 equipped Jeep GC. I think the Liberty too. Grab all the hardware, brackets, etc. Should bolt right up to a 9 1/4 as well.

The early Dakota rear is 5 on 4.5", but the housing is wide. I made some rough measurements and the outer flange to flange width is close to the '73-74 B-body. That's too wide for an A.

Moving outside of Mopar, the Ford 8" from a '60's-early '70's Mustang is a straight forward swap. I suppose the 9" would be too, but the Mustang guys want them. I think an 8" from a Maverick or Granada would be the correct width too. But you would have to measure to be sure.

I'm not sure on the 8.8 Exploder rears. I think they are offset to one side and use two different axles. I've heard stories of swapping the shorter longer tube for a short one off another housing and using the matching axle shaft to make a centered and narrower Explorer rear for swapping, but I haven't looked into it myself. I'm sure there are a couple GRMers who have mess with them though.

8.8 out of an SN95 would come with discs and the pinion is centered, I think, maybe worth looking into?

In reply to pres589:

I was thinking about that while typing my thesis above. Next SN95 that comes into my shop I'm taking a tape measure to it.

In reply to Rob_Mopar:

Box flares remove all width issues

This is Mr. Volvo Clearinghouse's car, I'll leave the box flare option up to him.

road race pro touring, what should be done to every old big american car

gorgeous and perfect example http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnIlun5BQqo

to volvoclearinghouse:

i recently bought some mopar stuff out of a storage locker. there is an unused set of long-tube headers with the number "4200" stamped on the flanges. there is no brand identification on them, so my google-fu didn't find the original application for these headers. the only part in this pile of parts that was tagged was a Tilton bellhousing, which has a paper tag on it with handwritten "67 barracuda small block".

if these headers would make your life easier, i would send them to you for $75 plus shipping from 48187. i can take pix, measurements, etc, if you'd like.

Just another '64 Mopar pic ...