An unsavory solution (TKD content)

So, prior to joining the Army I did TKD. A lot. Since I was 11. I was pretty good at it too. Got my black belt, was an assistant instructor, the whole lot. Unfortunately the Army was pretty good at disrupting that. So I did it off and on as I could find time. So now that I'm settled down I'm trying to get back into it. Here's where it gets martial arts nerdy.

I grew up in the World Taekwondo Federation. The only school in my area is American Free Style. Which basically means the bastardize several styles (taking kicks from TKD, forms from some style of karate etc) and call it "free style". I'm not against learning a new style, but despite having my black belt they want me to stat over. From the beginning. And that's a bit of a slap in the face. So I guess my options are either switch to a new style complete, drive an hour for class, or suffer through a horrible bastardization of my style. /rant

Drewsifer wrote: I'm not against learning a new style, but despite having my black belt they want me to stat over. From the beginning. And that's a bit of a slap in the face.

Them: Mmm. Karate better than Kung Fu.
You: FIGHT!

My question is this: are you doing this to be serious with martial arts or are you doing it as a hobby to pass time and exercise?

Even though you start over, you wear the belt and will progress quickly.

I was in a small TKD school run by a female sensei. Possibly because being a woman in business or she was just aggressive, out little club of 50 people took an unusually high percentage of trophies at competition mostly for clean technique. I got out of it because these tournements came up too often for me. Then there's the politics and biased judging. I left.

I started Pen Jak Selat, an Indonesian style. Good workout, interesting stuff, stimulates the mind a bit.

World TKD vs American? What do you want out of it?

Work from that corner.

Dan

"Hey What kind of belt do you have?" "Canvas. You like? J.C. Penny. $3.98"

I specialize in a hybridized sort of system myself. (My teacher's pretty legit though, I wouldn't call it bastardized). Parents are always mad because he won't let kids keep their yellow belts from other schools. It can be tough coming from a standardized system.

In my opinion once you get a black belt or whatever is equivalent, you should get to keep it even if you're going to another school.

Then again, I do think that a lot of schools pass out black belts a little too easily. Whenever I hear about a 10-year-old black belt I feel a bit like that school just spit on my tradition.

For the schools that hand out black belts like they're candy, check out this season's Penn & Teller's BullE36 M3.

Overall, they're kinda harsh, but they tend to be, being an entertainment program and all.

I can understand the frustration of having to start out at square one if you're in it to compete. I can't see where you're coming from if you're just in it to keep in shape and have something to do.

Big thing to remember is that most academies are businesses and are tying to make a buck. The best school I checked out when I was learning was run by a guy out of his back yard. He was fully licensed and all, but didn't look at it as a business. His goal was to get you into shape and teach discipline. He didn't even believe in board breaking or anything like that. He believed in form and fitness. His fees covered equipment, and that's about all.

I thought the only belt for a lot of "styles" back in the old countries was simply whenever the instructor said you were ready.

The whole idea of different belts is really an American thing as we need to have intermediate goals and instant gratification.

Maybe find some people near you via the internet to see if they'd want to meet up a couple times a week to practice or learn your style.

OTOH we have belt factories here. A family starts the business, kids all sign up, they progress up the ranks to become student teachers. Next thing you know it's self perpetuating.

Show up three times a week, pay the dues and get your belt. Don't show up and they may not notice.

VanillaSky wrote: I can understand the frustration of having to start out at square one if you're in it to compete. I can't see where you're coming from if you're just in it to keep in shape and have something to do.

I'm frustrated because I love the style of TKD I did. I love everything about it. I practiced all the forms and self defense numbers by myself when I couldn't go to class (even to this day). The frustration is being told, "Hey we understand you spent 12 years earn your rank in another style. Now start from scratch". Sorry, I'm a pretty proud guy. That sounds like, 'we don't care what you did before us'.

turboswede said: I thought the only belt for a lot of "styles" back in the old countries was simply whenever the instructor said you were ready. The whole idea of different belts is really an American thing as we need to have intermediate goals and instant gratification

If you go back far enough, yes you started with a white belt and when your instructor said you where ready you got "rank". However, the Koreans and Japanese have been doing belts for sometime before martial arts got popular in America.

@3Door4G, I call it a bastardization because I've been to schools similar to this (so maybe being so harsh on this one isn't fair). They often times mix and match different styles so they don't have to answer to any sanctioning body and can stand alone schools. True mixed styles are fine, when done well.

I would either start over with something totally different, but interesting, or take the long drive to the dojo you like. After awhile maybe some of the students who live closer to you would like to meet outside class for extra practice. Don't suffer with a program you don't like. I was in Shotokan for 5 years, earned a brown belt.

I took TKD for a number of years when I was a teen. My sensei was another one of those that believe the clean form was the best form.

I miss him over the styles that seem to put actually hurting your competetor over form

VanillaSky wrote: Big thing to remember is that most academies are businesses and are tying to make a buck. The best school I checked out when I was learning was run by a guy out of his back yard. He was fully licensed and all, but didn't look at it as a business. His goal was to get you into shape and teach discipline. He didn't even believe in board breaking or anything like that. He believed in form and fitness. His fees covered equipment, and that's about all.

Yes, this.

My fencing coach teaches a class through the local adult education division of our county school system, but 90% of what I've learned about fencing I've learned in his garage during 1-on-1 sessions.

Unless you absolutely need to be part of the structure to enter contests or something, I'd try to find a more personal approach.

jg

If the color of your belt is a concern, try Aikido. there are white belts and black belts. Period.

Dan

Another point.

The main reason I rarely have money to spend on my car is that I spend money on my school. The drive is about 45 minutes. I even picked my current job because of its proximity to where I train (the dojo is a small addition to the back of my instructor's house).

Not saying you need to do what I do, but I am saying that if you manage to find a good instructor, a longer commute to practice might be worth it.

I did Shidokan Karate for a while, but never BB'd any style. I'm now starting Shotokan, which is similar but still different, and I wil be just starting like anyone else. If it were me, I would start a new style.

TKD is a SPORT. If you tranfer to a dojo that teaches SELF DEFENSE, whether Karate, Escrima, Ju Juitsu, etc. A lot of what you know is irrelevent and must be unlearned. I know TKD black belts that have never been punched in the face, much less knocked out. The schools they went to were more like aerobics than martial arts. Often when changing styles you have to start over from white belt, that doesn't take away from the black belt you have already earned, it's just a point of reference for where you are.

JG Pasterjak wrote:

VanillaSky wrote: Big thing to remember is that most academies are businesses and are tying to make a buck. The best school I checked out when I was learning was run by a guy out of his back yard. He was fully licensed and all, but didn't look at it as a business. His goal was to get you into shape and teach discipline. He didn't even believe in board breaking or anything like that. He believed in form and fitness. His fees covered equipment, and that's about all.

Yes, this. My fencing coach teaches a class through the local adult education division of our county school system, but 90% of what I've learned about fencing I've learned in his garage during 1-on-1 sessions. Unless you absolutely need to be part of the structure to enter contests or something, I'd try to find a more personal approach. jg

How did I not know that you fenced? My stalking is coming up short. My wife fenced for several years, but had to lay off about a year ago due to ruining her knees doing it. She's currently going through various escalating treatments that will ultimately end up in surgery to one or both of her knees.

DILYSI Dave wrote: How did I not know that you fenced? My stalking is coming up short. My wife fenced for several years, but had to lay off about a year ago due to ruining her knees doing it. She's currently going through various escalating treatments that will ultimately end up in surgery to one or both of her knees.

Been fencing foil for a year or so. My coach is a semi-retired guy who drives a schoolbus for the county. He's this 60-year-old black guy that looks like he's been carved out of wood, which totally sucks. It's one thing to have someone half your age run you until you think you're going to puke up your spine, but I got no excuse I can use on this guy. He's totally throwing off the curve.

jg

I did tkd too back in the days. Even made up to black belt. It was good times competing in tournaments and all. Also know a little shotokan because my tkd instructor is a black belt in it and tang soo do. Yes some school will require you to start from the bottom when learning a new style but depending on the instructor you may skip some belts. For me its not about the style you practice its about the individual practicing it.

914Driver wrote: If the color of your belt is a concern, try Aikido. there are white belts and black belts. Period. Dan

"I've got a blackbelt in akido -- and the boots to match."

4eyes wrote: TKD is a SPORT. If you tranfer to a dojo that teaches SELF DEFENSE, whether Karate, Escrima, Ju Juitsu, etc. A lot of what you know is irrelevent and must be unlearned. I know TKD black belts that have never been punched in the face, much less knocked out. The schools they went to were more like aerobics than martial arts. Often when changing styles you have to start over from white belt, that doesn't take away from the black belt you have already earned, it's just a point of reference for where you are.

I do TKD for sport. I did Kickboxing and Army combatives to get my fill of getting punched in the face. Doesn't have as much allure now that I don't have full health coverage.

And that's just it, I'm not switching styles. I'm staying within my style, but it's a school that basically doesn't have to answer to any of the large Federations. I have studied other styles, however briefly. And every time they invited me to wear my black belt as a mark of respect. If I was starting some form of Karate, I could 100% understand having to start at the beginning. Because I am a beginner. But I'm not a beginner at TKD.

I'm trying slight further schools and looking for private instructors to see if I can find a matching style. If all else fails I guess I'll go try something new.

When it comes to something like martial arts, I think finding an instructor I can work well with is more important than the particular style I would be studying. I'm pretty lucky to have found a good teacher.

DILYSI Dave wrote: How did I not know that you fenced? My stalking is coming up short. My wife fenced for several years, but had to lay off about a year ago due to ruining her knees doing it. She's currently going through various escalating treatments that will ultimately end up in surgery to one or both of her knees.

lolz at DILYSI for believing she ruined her knees fencing :-O

So you'll move up quickly. Big deal. I totally understand them wanting you to start from scratch. TKD has gone downhill majorly. Not all studios are bad, but a lot are buy-a-belt factories. If a studio makes their students work hard and really know their stuff to earn a belt, they shouldn't be allowed to be upstaged by someone who paid money.

If this place is legit, you'll be able to test up super fast. If they put you on a forced slow progression, they're just trying to milk you for cash, and you should leave.

As for the indignity of not wearing the right level belt:

I studied a form of Hapkido a while back. Great style, great school, great martial arts community. As I recall there were three guys who regularly attended that were multiple degree blackbelts in at least one other style and instructors in their own right. These guys regularly went to each others classes and learned the different styles (Hapkido, Judo, Jiu Jitsu, and something else). When they were in another class, they wore the belt they had achieved for that style.

Heck, I went through my first several belt levels just wearing a white belt. I didn't care. What's around my waist was less important than what was in my head and muscle memory.