I didn't mention Aluminum.
My dad had an old Sportpal that you could do burpees in. It paddled like a battleship but you had to TRY to tip it over.
I had a Grumman 15 foot. It was indestructible, tracked well but the stability wasn't all that great.
Aluminum gets hot, though.
Also: Don't neglect looking at a squareback with a small outboard. I understand that the "gheenoe" style boats are good for swamps and blackwater rivers.
berkleying canoe thread...
I worked with a guy at a camp who could do a roll in a full size (16'?) Grumman aluminum canoe. It was amazing. That's the extent of my experience with aluminum. My white water boats are plastic, but I like 'glass for anything that has to go fast. Sure, you can't abuse it. But that just means you don't abuse it.
My favorite solo canoe is a cedar and canvas Chestnut belonging to my uncle. I think it's 14'. Gorgeous little thing, not for dragging on rocks.
My parents have a "stripper" canoe that was made by a shop class. It looks like a cedar strip, but it's got a 'glass shell over top and no internal ribs. Heavy but tough. It's a cargo canoe, big flat bottom. I've taken it on a few trips. The fun thing about it is that we never bothered to put a keel on it. It tracks well enough until it gets about 15 degrees off straight, then it goes into a snap spin. Great for teaching you how to manage the stern. Between the big flat bottom and the lack of a keel, it is a poor choice for a windy lake and a light load.
I'll just say that if you end up going with kayaks, get one per person. 2-person kayaks are much less maneuverable, ESPECIALLY when it comes to hauling them out of the water, and you'll have way less cargo room with them.
Toyman01 wrote: It's going to be 95% flat water rivers and swamps. No rapids, but some waves in the larger stretches of the rivers. I know the lower Waccamaw River can get 1'-2' swells on a windy day, but hanging to the leeward edge should keep me out of the worst of them. Probably 75% of the trips are going to be camping trips, some of them multi-day, with the occasional day trip thrown in.
OK, that helps. The bigger the boat, the more it can carry. But, the harder it is to manuever in the water. Two smaller boats can snake their way through things that a bigger boat will be jammed up in.
A flatish bottom will give you lots of initial stability. This mean the boat will sit generally level and stable when you get into it, and for mild leaning over and such.
Don't ignore secondary stability! This is the way the boat flares out on the sides. Pretty lines that curl back in are devistating when you do accidentally lean over past the initial stability of that flat bottom. It's here that a boat with pretty lines tends to flip right over. A boat that continues to flare out in width will drop that section into the water, and stabilize again. Catch is, the boat is wide and harder to paddle as a result.
For these two reasons, I tend to go with a moderately narrow bottom for mildd initial stability, flaring for good secondary stability. This keeps the craft from being excessively wide.
A round bottom fore and aft virtually cannot go in a straight line. A bit of keel greatly helps, especially if there is this fore/aft roundness. Too much keel means you cannot get the boat to turn worth a darn.
A tail fin or rudder can help you greatly both with going straight, and turning, and especially for your own imbalance, which will have you constantly curling to one side or the other.
If you can't roll a kayak, don't get a "real" one with a skirt. You'll likely get hurt and or panic when upside down, and it's a real pain to get back in when you're out on the water. Skirted kayaks are also astonishingly hot.
Sit on top kayaks are some of the most fun boats to paddle around with. They are the miata of the paddle boats. Never tried taking one for a weekend camping trip, but there are models well suited for it, and with a few waterproof stuff sacks, it can certainly be done.
Don't discount rowboats. Yes, the heavy wooden things you paddled in summer camp are inherently awful. But, ever seen a rowing shell moving on the water? Look up "Adirondack Guideboat" for a splendid example of what a rowboat can be and do.
If you only have one car, paddle upstream from your launch point. Regardless of how minor the current is. All day paddling upstream will be reversed in two hours of downstream work.
Being a member of the GRMS board, you might want to explore some of the interesting things like fish fin propulsion, as well the use of an electric trolling motor, or even sail (though sails don't work worth a darn in a swamp).
Plastic boats are virtually indestructable. They go boing and pop over anything. If it gets dented, you kick it and pop it back out. Pretty easily repaired in use with duct tape. UV will take its toll after a few years in the sun. These can be moderately heavy.
Aluminum boats are terribly loud, also virtually indestructable, and pretty durn heavy. They also stick on every rock they hit. Aluminum is pretty rare now days, especially in kayaks.
Fiberglass is highly variable, but generally is the lightest, and while very strong pound for pound, because the pounds are minimal, they are typically rather fragile. When smashed into a rock, they can shatter out large areas. These tend to be the prettiest and most expensive boats. Especially if you look at an epoxy glass over wood boat.
A few names you may want to look into, just for interesting reference, "adirondack guideboat", "sea kayak", "pirogue", "punt", "pram" and "Dingy".
And if you're wondering if you could build one yourself, the answer is yes. Even I've been able to do it.
Great post, Foxtrapper!
If I was going to build a boat, I think I'd try an Adirondack guideboat or a soutuvene.
I have a hobie adventure island. The mirage drive is awesome!
Mirage drive is $$$ but pretty awesome.
This is the kind of boat I would have killed for when I used to hike 2 miles to get to fishing spots in the Adirondacks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8kgN8E5bGxY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TszHiC6fjDg
My plan is to build my own kayak. Check out Chesapeake Light Craft
T.J. wrote: My plan is to build my own kayak. Check out Chesapeake Light Craft
I like this. Maybe for the future I'll look into building one.
In reply to foxtrapper:
Thanks Fox, Good info there. I appreciate it.
Expedition Rowboat is what I want to build this winter for the Everglades Challenge
In reply to mad_machine:
I am thinking hard about building a Core Sound 20. Not for the EC,but folks do enter them in that race.
I just looked at the Everglades Challenge. That is a heck of a race!
If you ever have to tow anything behind a canoe.. a kayak, another canoe or a dock..
Tie a bungee cord inline with the rope... It will help a lot!!
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