Back to School?

Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:

South Florida, Palm Beach county (private school)

- Starts in person on August 10. Masks required. My kids bring in lunch so I did not pay attn. but I believe the kitchen is closed. 
- If you don't feel comfortable sending your kids, you can do zoom and keep them home. Not sure until when. 

As of today, my 3 kids would do it through zoom. I will wait until the week before to make the final call. 

My understanding is that you can switch either way. Say you start virtual and want to go to class, you can do that. It works the other way around as well. 

Since I wrote the above they have changed the start date to August 24th. The rest of the info stays the same. 

Also I wanted to share how my school approached the online teaching last school year and how they will, at least, start this year.

My experience was with kids in 2nd, 5th and 7th grade.

School was closed the week before spring break, on March 16th and remained closed until March 31st. This gave the school a total of two weeks to prepare. In those two weeks they set up one day to pick up all the kid's books, each grade had a different time slot. If you have multiple kids all the books were given to you at the same time and you went to the youngest kid's time slot.

Every two days or so the principal would send a survey through surveymonkey asking different questions; ie. if you had a laptop for each of your kids. The school would provide you a laptop if you did not have one.

Every classroom got a camera and microphone/speaker. If I had to guess it would be some sort of tablet mounted pointing at the white board.

The week before classes started every teacher started uploading videos on youtube so that kids would start seeing them and outlining how they were going to approach classes, they also laid certain rules. Among the rules, was that they had to wear their uniform and could not be eating or drinking during class.

Classes started and it was like a regular class day, just via zoom. Everymorning they would recite the Pledge of Allegiance and because its a catholic school they would do a prayer.

My wife setup our dining table for them with all their books, computer, pencils, etc. I bought the youngest one some over the year headphones and the other two I gave him some old apple iphone headphones.

It was basically the same as if they were in the school. The main difference was that they had to share space together and that PE class was pre recorded on youtube and they never did any of it.

The problems we had were minor. The youngest one could not see the whiteboard as he wears glasses and the teacher would use a pink pen and I had a small 13" laptop. Every friday we would receive a surveymonkey and on the comments, I suggested using black or blue pen and that got fixed.

This August, they are most likely staying home. I dont feel like bringing them yet and I am lucky that my wife can work from home and if she needs to go to the office one day I can stay home and cover for her. 

Not sure this helps anyone but I thought I would share our experience, which to me was quite positive given that it was never tried and there was not much time to prepare. 

Our school did nothing like that with our kids.  Maybe the higher classes did, but we had one in 1st and two pre-k.  
 

We were sent the in person and online schedules.  To keep ours at home, we need to purchase more computers.  Also, with all of them together, it's tough to keep em all focused. 
 

We still plan to ship them to school.  We are dual income, and have the MIL at home.  We talked and just don't think we are at the point to do full schooling. 

As discussed, we are part of the problem. We planned for school out of the home.  Also, we stopped with a more manageable two.  Life happens and we gained twins.  Which made it a bit tougher.  All together, schools are sometimes better or worse.  I think the same works for the homeschool portion they are offering now.  

In reply to Slippery (Forum Supporter) :

That sounds like a good experience. It's a LONG way from our experience, and from most public school systems I am aware of. 
 

First off, schools avoided Zoom for security reasons. It's not compliant with FERPA, COPPA, or most state's student privacy laws.  This left them using much less user friendly systems that had not been tested en masse.  Ours was barely functional. 
 

Once it was recognized that school would remain online until the end of the year, it also became known that all students would receive a passing grade, regardless of their participation. In fact, there were only 3 quarters graded. First half of the year grades were based on 2 quarters. Second half was only 1 quarter. 
 

This left almost no students participating.  My daughter had online group  classes with teachers where she was the only one in attendance. Most of the time. 
 

The content was nothing but a bunch of worksheets. On every subject. My wife called it "Twaddle". It was pointless.   My daughter's assignments could be completed in 20-30 minutes per day. 
 

Side note- every kid in the school already had  a school issued computer. Lower grades have iPads, upper grades have laptops. They were all pre-loaded with necessary books, course work, security measures,  etc. The school had already given every student the tools they needed. All they had to do was use them. 
 

They didn't. 

In reply to SVreX (Forum Supporter) :

Yes, after talking to friends that have kids in public schools I would have to say that I am glad of how my kid's school approached this. The teachers being in their respective classrooms alone made a huge difference.

Also they did take attendance everyday, my youngest would go nuts as the laptop he had was old and it would take forever to boot up and he did not want to miss out on anything. Regarding the laptops, I only had one and my brother and a friend of ours contributed theirs. During the summer break I bought a couple of chromebooks at Costco and returned the loaners.

I have no idea whether the FERPA/COPPA applies in Florida, actually not even sure what the acronym stands for lol, but they used zoom. At first it was without password, later on after there were some breaches they started using password. The school follows and adheres to the Palm Beach county curriculum.

At some point they had issues with kids "chatting" through zoom, and they put a stop to that real quick. The principal sent an email to all parents.

Again, my kids were "in class" from 8 am all the way until 1:30 pm or 2 with a small break. Usually classes start at 7:40 am and they end at 2:45 pm.

As I mentioned, given the situation and how fast things changed going from in person to remote I commend the school, principal and teachers. They did a great job.

The surveys through surveymonkey served a great purpose too. After everysurvey, the principal would email us the percentage of families that replied and it was quite high. I personally saw two things that I typed being implemented and I am sure every one was read, possibly by the teacher.

I am sharing my experience in case you guys can share what worked at other schools and see if it helps you.

This whole situation is about making lemonade out of lemons I guess.

That sounds like a very good experience, all things considered.  Hopefully most school systems have figured out how to do something similar. 

How does your 2nd grader handle a PC?  My son is about to start Kindergarten and hasn't the slightest clue how to operate a PC.  I imagine that learning curve is going to be rough.  Of course, since we don't know exactly what is happening its hard for me to help prepare him for it.

FYI there is a ZoomGov, which meets govt. requirements and is missing a few features.  I use it at work.

In reply to ProDarwin :

That's good to know. 

ProDarwin said:

How does your 2nd grader handle a PC?  My son is about to start Kindergarten and hasn't the slightest clue how to operate a PC.  I imagine that learning curve is going to be rough.  Of course, since we don't know exactly what is happening its hard for me to help prepare him for it.

Before this he had maybe used a laptop once or twice. I showed him how to turn it on and how to log in - this laptop was loaned to us by a friend so he created a guest account for him. 

After the first couple of days, he was teaching me how to use it. 

Don't underestimate kids, they are very quick learners. It also helps that he had 2 older brothers to give him a hand if he needed help, but they learn quick. Your son will have no problems. 

One of my hygienists kids school isn't going back in person until October 16th.  K-5, her kid is in 1st or 2nd grade.  Has to be online from 9am-2pm.  Not only is this going to force her to stop working at my office, putting undue financial strain on her family but now it puts a serious hurt on my small business.  We're both losers.

Very low case load in my state.  Very low infection rate, (basically zero) for small kids with very low transmittance rate.  Yet the freak out continues.

Any of you have kids going to/going back to college in the next couple of weeks? How are their schools dealing with this? 

My two oldest are both starting this fall. Moving to dorms in Iowa and upper Michigan. My daughter is driving herself up there but my son is flying. Both campuses have close cafeterias, all food is grab and take back to your room. Any big lecture is online. Looks like smaller classes are either in the bigger lecture rooms to allow for more space or adding sections in order to reduce the number of people physically in the rooms. Of course the social side of things with thousands of 18-22 year olds is the biggest deal. We'll see how that all goes. 

In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :

Yes. My son is going back to Kennesaw State. 
 

As of now, classes will resume in person 5 days a week on Aug 15 (IIRC). There is no online alternative. Professors will be required to wear masks. Students will not. 
 

In GA. Big surge in cases going on right now. 
 

Great plan. 

In reply to docwyte :

I'm sorry you are both having to deal with this. 
 

I don't understand why schools would force kids to sit in front of a computer at specific times. It ties everyone's hands. 
 

Online learning has been going on for a long time in colleges and among homeschoolers. Almost always flex schedule. There is no reason for public schools to have to reinvent the wheel. 

SVreX (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to docwyte :

I'm sorry you are both having to deal with this. 
 

I don't understand why schools would force kids to sit in front of a computer at specific times. It ties everyone's hands. 
 

Online learning has been going on for a long time in colleges and among homeschoolers. Almost always flex schedule. There is no reason for public schools to have to reinvent the wheel. 

I get it.  Interaction.  Discussion.  Engagement.  Sitting at a computer and watching a video is not the same.

The scheduling sucks, but I think the quality of education will be better than flex scheduling.

docwyte said:

One of my hygienists kids school isn't going back in person until October 16th.  K-5, her kid is in 1st or 2nd grade.  Has to be online from 9am-2pm.  Not only is this going to force her to stop working at my office, putting undue financial strain on her family but now it puts a serious hurt on my small business.  We're both losers.

Very low case load in my state.  Very low infection rate, (basically zero) for small kids with very low transmittance rate.  Yet the freak out continues.

Any chance that you could turn this into an opportunity? Survey your patients, and see how they would feel about 6-8AM appointments, and 3-7PM? 

In reply to ProDarwin :

I agree, but it may not be feasible. Right now, it's important schools recognize the kids are at risk in many ways, which INCLUDES their parent's revenue stream. 
 

Forcing specific times may force some people to lose their incomes. This creates stress, which can lead to civil abuse, etc. 
 

There is no reason a class can't be taught live stream, and also recorded for use at an alternate time. 
 

Rinky dink low budget churches are doing it. Why can't schools?

All good points.  I agree.  I guess I was just saying I understand why the school would go that route.  Doesn't mean its right.  

I think adapting to the situation is most important like you suggest.  Also as mtn suggested to doc... adapting hours there might be beneficial to both his employees and to patients.

One thing that has been true since about march - the businesses that have adapted to the situation have really outshined those that have resisted.

In reply to mtn (Forum Supporter) :

That's a possibility but a hygienist can't be here alone.  That means I also have to ask (and pay) a front desk staff person to put in additional hours and I have to as well.  Right now I've got a few hygienists that have temped for me in the past that I've reached out to see if they can help cover.  That's the easy button but also impacts payroll costs as temping is more expensive...

In reply to docwyte :

I don't know much about your business, but that looks like an opportunity in itself. 
 

Why is it necessary to always have a human sitting at the front desk?  I understand why it needs to be a live person. 
 

Why couldn't you partner with several other doctors and medical professionals to enable live remote receptionists?

For example, a patient could walk in and find a monitor screen on the front desk with a message "Touch screen for receptionist". When they do, a live person comes on screen able to assist. 
 

This person could just be a receptionist at another office "covering" reception like people cover the phones. They'd need access to the schedule, a few basic records, and a contact person at your office. 
 

Seems like you could "share" receptionists with other medical professionals, or it could be a free-standing subcontracted service. 
 

Either way, the bottom line would be your patients get proper service even when someone is not there, and it is also likely you could save a percentage on the cost of a receptionist. 
 

I know there would be kinks (HIPAA, etc), but it seems like a worthwhile side endeavor. 
 

Also, I had a different understanding of Mtn's suggestion. I don't see why you would have to maintain regular hours AND extended hours.  What if you were the only dentist in the area to be open during evening or weekend hours (and perhaps early morning), and chose to NOT be open in the middle of the day?  You may meet the needs of a lot of patients and grow your business. 

SVreX (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to docwyte :

Also, I had a different understanding of Mtn's suggestion. I don't see why you would have to maintain regular hours AND extended hours.  What if you were the only dentist in the area to be open during evening or weekend hours (and perhaps early morning), and chose to NOT be open in the middle of the day?  You may meet the needs of a lot of patients and grow your business. 

This is exactly what I was thinking. I don't know if the market is there, but if folks have to do both school and work during the school days... well, how are they going to go to the dentist? Wouldn't they rather go early/late?

No market research done here, obviously. Just posing the question.

In reply to mtn (Forum Supporter) :

I'm a solo doctor practice, whose wife works full time (several days a week until 7pm) and has small kids at home. So I simply can't extend hours, even if I had the desire to do so, which I don't.  I don't want to be here at 5am or 8pm and am more than willing to lose that market share.  Right now if you want to come see me you take time off from work/school and that's worked out fine for the past 20 years. 

If I was so busy that I needed to hire another doctor than at that point I'd do so and extend hours, splitting them between myself and the other doc.  That's not the case tho.

The virtual receptionist is an interesting idea but something that would be ungainly and expensive to implement.  Right now my receptionist checks patients in, gets their temperature, has them sign the COVID consent forms and any other consent forms, then half way walks them back to the clinical care area as we can't go up to the reception area all PPE'd up.  She also checks insurance benefits, goes over treatment plans, answers any patient questions about treatment, schedules any further necessary appointments and answers the phone.  Some of that stuff can't really happen remotely.

Also there's a safety aspect involved of having a female hygienist alone in the building, which I'm not comfortable with...

We decided early on to go the virtual route. It is a huge burden, but personally, I don't see how you can expect elementary school kids to socially distance, constantly wash hands, etc. I fully expect multiple schools here will be shut down in the first two weeks.

Soooo...the girls' elementary school has had what they're calling an "outbreak," and school hasn't even opened yet. Inside sources say roughly 30 teachers have tested positive and some have been hospitalized.

Apparently some other GA schools have already made national news with similar issues, and there's a viral video of Paulding County HS, with flooded hallways; no distancing, no masks. I do not see this ending well.

My mom, an RN who was an elementary school nurse for the last 15 years of her career, thinks it is going to be a disaster anywhere. We're asking kids to behave in ways they've never behaved in history. You'll send a kid to school with a Paw Patrol mask, and they'll come home with a Spiderman Mask because they traded it at lunch. 

We were just talking with a HS teacher here. They were going with a hybrid model, or else an either-or model. He asked the question "If I get Covid, and have to stay home, the required quarantine is more days than I have in sick days and PTO. How will that situation be handled where you're requiring me to stay home for more days than I'm able?"

No answer.

"What happens if a student tests positive - who will be required to quarantine aside from that student?"

No answer.

"What happens if a student refuses to wear a mask?"

No answer. 

Yup. They certainly planned this out well. The good news is that the virtual learning plan is one of the better ones I've seen, but hopefully we get a vaccine, fast. 

No offense to those living in the South but your states have done a particularly bad job at managing this.  Hence the increased case loads.

I fully expect the schools to pop cases, even here, once they open.  We're thinking about getting my son into a private school, but the questions we need answered from both the public and private school are "What are you going to do when a kid/teacher pops positive?"  Are they going to shut down the whole school?  For how long?  Are they going to quarantine just that class?  For how long?  What's their online program like? 

We've heard from teachers of the public school that they've had ZERO guidance and have done ZERO work on their online program.  Nothing happened at all from the end of May until now.  That's really discouraging to hear...

AGREED on all counts with the last two posts. GA has certainly berked it all up.

I'm not a religious man, but am truly thankful/feeling "blessed" every day that we don't *have* to let our kids be guinea pigs in this whole thing. I feel truly awful for those who have no other option.

The numbers I heard from the school were 80% in school - 20% virtual. We are in a very rural area, with a low median income. Not working is not an option for most.

docwyte said:

No offense to those living in the South but your states have done a particularly bad job at managing this.  Hence the increased case loads.

Yes.  They have berkeleyed it up, big time.

Colorado has not done a spectacular job though.  CO currently has about 30% more active cases than NC despite having only 54% the population.

All the stories from GA are scary.  I hope through some miracle it doesn't spread like wildfire and that no children or teachers are harmed because of the state's poor decision making.