Circa 55BC

In reply to Gimp:

pretty darn right I believe

I meant it was offensive to everyone. It makes us sound like a country full of losers.

bravenrace wrote:

93EXCivic wrote:

bravenrace wrote: And that Cicero was a pretty smart fella.

He was just another politician who changed with the prevailing political winds.

Our entire form of government was highly influenced by his teachings. Read your history. Just do it in a book that contains fact.

I never said the quote wasn't a good vote or that he wasn't smart. But he was known for changing his positions on subjects just like every other politician.

carguy123 wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dWsxMD057w This piece is 32 years old but it sounds as if it was written today. Watch it all, I'm betting you'll see it in a different light today than you did when you first heard it.

I saw that film as a teen. Made me want to get into communications to stop it from coming true. Just turn the set on and witness the breadth of my failure..

If we don't learn our history, we are doomed to repeat it. America/Rome - same thing?

aussiesmg wrote: Maybe he was blocked by the opposition at every turn

Then he wasn't so bright then.

ncjay wrote: If we don't learn our history, we are doomed to repeat it. America/Rome - same thing?

We all are on some level.

I actually believe Europe is closer than us to that kind of collapse. I think we're closer to the middle ages right now in European evolution terms... Too barbaric..

Cicero was smart, yes. His quote is very piognant to modern times. However he was a politician in ancient Rome, where senators, proconsuls, tribunes, etc. changed their loyalties regularly to stay in positions of power and favor.

And incidentally, Cicero's political views (like the ones quoted) got him assasinated by the second triumverate of Octavian, Mark Antony, and Marcus Aemilius Lepidus.

But all in all, we face virtually the exact same issues today that were at the fore 2000 years ago.

Iron Balls McGinty wrote: I meant it was offensive to everyone. It makes us sound like a country full of losers.

I didn't find it offensive at all.

Gimp wrote:

carguy123 wrote: I can't read it all, it runs off the right side of the GRM window.

HOW FAR RIGHT IS IT?

I see what you did!!

great to see,funny

Canoe

93EXCivic wrote:

bravenrace wrote:

93EXCivic wrote:

bravenrace wrote: And that Cicero was a pretty smart fella.

He was just another politician who changed with the prevailing political winds.

Our entire form of government was highly influenced by his teachings. Read your history. Just do it in a book that contains fact.

I never said the quote wasn't a good vote or that he wasn't smart. But he was known for changing his positions on subjects just like every other politician.

Ok.

cardiacdog wrote: Just to fan the flames a bit in good fun

Ohh boy a flame war...

So.. I think you're agreement is ok. except its got a few problems..

1. Almost all of the richest people in the US are liberals

2. most of the "greedy" CEO's and corporations could be considered progressive because they are constantly changing how they are doing business, never doing things the same way day in and day out.. Which is what conservatives do...

3. We'll take all the Blue states you can have the red ones. So that means we have all the smart people, the wealth base and almost every large company in the US, since they're all officially based out of Delaware. But you can have Wyoming!

4. We'll continue to outsource our cheap labor jobs to you. cause you're poor. My company now considers Kentucky and Alabama to be domestic low cost sources (Yeah that's right.. They're the equivalent of India in the US.. )

5. You can have the military. You won't have the tax base to support it, nor will you have knowhow or means of production to equip it with the latest technology.

6. So you have oil guns and pickup trucks.. Awesome.. You'll also have most of the agricultural base... Great for you. You'll also have teenage pregnancy, most of the obese people, low SAT scores and racists.. Yay for you.

Or..

You know we could just stay together as one large nation work out our differences like men in a collaborative manner, cause rehashing these stereotypes really gets us nowhere.

Please stop getting Iggy into fights! Pig/mud, haven't you guys read anything he's done yet?

tuna55 wrote: Please stop getting Iggy into fights! Pig/mud, haven't you guys read anything he's done yet?

hey you didn't read the last sentence I wrote...

huge-O-chavez wrote:

cardiacdog wrote: Just to fan the flames a bit in good fun

Ohh boy a flame war... So.. I think you're agreement is ok. except its got a few problems.. 1. Almost all of the richest people in the US are liberals 2. most of the "greedy" CEO's and corporations could be considered progressive because they are constantly changing how they are doing business, never doing things the same way day in and day out.. Which is what conservatives do... 3. We'll take all the Blue states you can have the red ones. So that means we have all the smart people, the wealth base and almost every large company in the US, since they're all officially based out of Delaware. But you can have Wyoming! 4. We'll continue to outsource our cheap labor jobs to you. cause you're poor. My company now considers Kentucky and Alabama to be domestic low cost sources (Yeah that's right.. They're the equivalent of India in the US.. ) 5. You can have the military. You won't have the tax base to support it, nor will you have knowhow or means of production to equip it with the latest technology. 6. So you have oil guns and pickup trucks.. Awesome.. You'll also have most of the agricultural base... Great for you. You'll also have teenage pregnancy, most of the obese people, low SAT scores and racists.. Yay for you. Or.. You know we could just stay together as one large nation work out our differences like men in a collaborative manner, cause rehashing these stereotypes really gets us nowhere.

pretty good response, however 1- not sure about all the wealthiest being liberal- maybe socially but not financially 2. Constant change is what most do to stay on top- so to speak 3. now that is just funny- all the smart people 4. I live in Alabama, thank you very much, and we thank you for not moving here and pissing off the good old boys. 5. So now if your "conservative" you are unintelligent, poor, and lazy. Please feel free to keep building auto industry here in our state, I just love good paying well insured working people. 6. Obesity is everywhere in this country 2/3 overweight or obese, racists- that really is annoying as more "hate" crimes happen in the "enlightened" areas than the south these days. Teen pregnancy happens everywhere

PS- keep your crime ridden, polluted, nasty northeastern cities or LA- don't want it, don't need it. And just for the record, I love to have friendly banter and most assuredly love my country and even all you damn liberals

Buffet and Gates supported obama.. Nuff said. We can go deeper if you want, but the richest people supported him.

We're already in alabama.. and I'm being very serious.. We consider it to be higher quality but we rank it in the same category with the 3rd world when talking strategic sourcing.. No bull E36 M3.

Conservative states are the fattest.. Period.

Of all the factories I've helped build in the south, the workers were southern and the management and engineers were from up north..

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2004/08/22/a_suicide_map_of_the_us/

Yeah you seem to like suicide more.

http://www.esquire.com/features/data/red-states-blue-states-0709

Ohh you may think we're pollution ridden, but conservatives hate enviromental regulations.. So your side would quickly turn into a wasteland... We'd be happy to help you clean it up though.. For a price