Of course. What were we thinking. Civilians with guns is so unneccessary. It's worked out so well for 3rd world countries.
Of course. What were we thinking. Civilians with guns is so unneccessary. It's worked out so well for 3rd world countries.
Will wrote:Ignorant wrote: but seriously, Do you need a 30 round mag for a handgun? Noone does.Careful there. I don't want the government telling me what I need.
The government IS going to tell you what you can and cannot do (which includes thing which you think you "need"), that is what a government is FOR. No government is anarchy. Some romanticize that, but I think few would enjoy it in reality. It's not THAT they will draw a line that is the issue, it is WHERE.
I think having a flamethrower would be cool.... imagine if that kid showed up with a flamethrower... lines are a good thing.
Cone_Junky wrote:Tifosi2k2 wrote:Or a good example of how the CCW was not needed?TRoglodyte wrote: Shadow six, Had you been in that crowd, lawfully carrying your 9mm, could things have turned out differently?One of the people who subdued the shooter was carrying his CCW. He was inside the Walgreens when he heard the gunfire and ran towards it. He ran towards the gunfire. When he got there the shooter had already been disarmed and he felt no need to draw his weapon. He held the mans legs until the Police arrived, all the while never touching his weapon. A model of restraint. Not exactly the blood thirsty vigilante the media likes to make CCW holders out to be......
No......
It's a good example of heads-up situational awareness, responsible reaction and a disregard for personal safety.
aircooled wrote:Will wrote:The government IS going to tell you what you can and cannot do (which includes thing which you think you "need"), that is what a government is FOR. No government is anarchy. Some romanticize that, but I think few would enjoy it in reality. It's not THAT they will draw a line that is the issue, it is WHERE. I think having a flamethrower would be cool.... imagine if that kid showed up with a flamethrower... lines are a good thing.Ignorant wrote: but seriously, Do you need a 30 round mag for a handgun? Noone does.Careful there. I don't want the government telling me what I need.
Maybe it's OK in Canada, or England, or France. But here in the 'states we have the Bill of Rights, and this little piece of parchment called the COnstitution that outlines what the government can and cannot do. One thing they cannot do is tell us what we can do... within reason.
Bobzilla wrote: One thing they cannot do is tell us what we can do... within reason.
Yes, that is pretty much what I said except I said it as: they can tell us what we can do... within reason. Fundamentally the same thing.
P.S. there is nothing about flamethrowers in the Bill of Rights or the Constitution. (although you could probably imply that it allows them)
Correct. It is a true "firearm", therefore falls under the 2nd ammendment. Technically they are legal in the US, except in the People's Republik of Kalifornia where farting is illegal. You can legally own a flamethrower as long as you apply for hte Tax stamp and go through the intensive screening process required for any Class III firearm.
Now it's bipartisan knee-jerk silliness.
Top Republican Rep. Pete King to Introduce Gun-Control Legislation
As if the guy didn't have a 30rd clip he wouldn't have shot anyone
-or-
If you make a law against carrying a gun near politicians this wouldn't have happened. I mean if we'd had a law against murder he wouldn't have attempted to murder the congresswoman. Right?! GUYS! Right?!
^ Bingo. But lets not let facts get in the way.
In reply to Xceler8x:
If he didn't have the 30 round clip maybe 6 wouldn't be dead and another 6 injured. Just sayin...
Since AZ is a death penalty state, even fear of being shot by a CCW wouldn't have made a difference in his decision either.
Cone_Junky wrote: In reply to Xceler8x: If he didn't have the 30 round clip maybe 6 wouldn't be dead and another 6 injured. Just sayin... Since AZ is a death penalty state, even fear of being shot by a CCW wouldn't have made a difference in his decision either.
By all information and accounts, one could presume the shooter never had any concern about the consequences of his actions.
Legislation will never overcome the motivations of the deranged. Unless, you want anyone who displays "disturbed" behavour to be detained and incarcerated.
http://www.salon.com/entertainment/comics/this_modern_world/2011/01/10/this_modern_world/index.html
Freedom isn't free... It just costs a blood bath every once in a while.
There is NO concealed carry permit in AZ. It's not needed. http://www.azcentral.com/news/election/azelections/articles/2010/04/16/20100416arizona-concealed-weapons-bill16-ON.html
Bobzilla wrote: Correct. It is a true "firearm", therefore falls under the 2nd ammendment. Technically they are legal in the US, except in the People's Republik of Kalifornia where farting is illegal. You can legally own a flamethrower as long as you apply for hte Tax stamp and go through the intensive screening process required for any Class III firearm.
what well regulated militia do you belong to?
come on.. really. Folks like you are the reason why I refuse to join the NRA and stick to my muzzleloaders and C&RFFL lust.
your answer about "need" is right on..... that said I, for the life of me, can't figure why some one would "need" a fully automatic weapon, semi-automatic sure but fully auto... just can't see it... and yeah I'm a card carrying NRA member.. go figure
Ignorant wrote: Folks like you are the reason why I refuse to join the NRA and stick to my muzzleloaders and C&RFFL lust.
Well that's amusing. A lot of C&R stuff is ex-military... why would a civilian need anything like that?
Osterkraut wrote:Ignorant wrote: Folks like you are the reason why I refuse to join the NRA and stick to my muzzleloaders and C&RFFL lust.Well that's amusing. A lot of C&R stuff is ex-military... why would a civilian need anything like that?
No hi cap mags..
mostly bolt actions.
don't think I'm stupid.
I'll tell you something.. I'd give up all my weapons and any future ability to own weapons if I could bring back that 9 year old girl who was shot.
Ignorant wrote:Osterkraut wrote:No hi cap mags.. mostly bolt actions. don't think I'm stupid. I'll tell you something.. I'd give up all my weapons and any future ability to own weapons if I could bring back that 9 year old girl who was shot.Ignorant wrote: Folks like you are the reason why I refuse to join the NRA and stick to my muzzleloaders and C&RFFL lust.Well that's amusing. A lot of C&R stuff is ex-military... why would a civilian need anything like that?
AR-15s, Thompson SMGs, BARs, FG42s, PPDs ,SKSes, Norinco AK-47s, UZIs, all C&R. Hundreds of "high cap" semi-automatic weapons are on your list.
But don't let that get in the way of your overly dramatic grandstanding. Why not auction your ability to own weapons up to something really dramatic, like the lives of every child?
Osterkraut wrote:Ignorant wrote:AR-15s, Thompson SMGs, BARs, FG42s, PPDs ,SKSes, Norinco AK-47s, UZIs, all C&R. Hundreds of "high cap" semi-automatic weapons are on your list. But don't let that get in the way of your overly dramatic grandstanding. Why not auction your ability to own weapons up to something really dramatic, like the lives of every child?Osterkraut wrote:No hi cap mags.. mostly bolt actions. don't think I'm stupid. I'll tell you something.. I'd give up all my weapons and any future ability to own weapons if I could bring back that 9 year old girl who was shot.Ignorant wrote: Folks like you are the reason why I refuse to join the NRA and stick to my muzzleloaders and C&RFFL lust.Well that's amusing. A lot of C&R stuff is ex-military... why would a civilian need anything like that?
well the C&R list has sure changed since I first was involved with it.. Scratch that off my list. berkeleying NRA.. ruining everything. When I was last inovled in the scene it was $120 for a good Swedish mauser. Now you pay that for a crap ass moisin...
So I take it to believe you wouldn't give up your ability to own guns to save the life of a child? Didn't think so.. Are you willing to admit the price for such lax gun laws is this 9 year olds life? So sad that the life of a 9 year old girl is the opportunity cost.
Mr. Ignorant, Given the opportunity, which would you rather the Government do? Snivel in the corner begging for your life or defending yourself?
Ignorant wrote: So I take it to believe you wouldn't give up your ability to own guns to save the life of a child? Didn't think so.. Are you willing to admit the price for such lax gun laws is this 9 year olds life? So sad that the life of a 9 year old girl is the opportunity cost.
You're grandstanding. We can say all kinds of fun things:
I'd give up beer to save a 9 year old from dehydration. Are you willing to admit the price for such excessive water consumption is this 9 year old's life?
I'd give up my ability to drive to save a 9 year old from a fatal car accident. Are you willing to admit the price for such mobility is this 9 year old's life?
I'd give up my ability to use the internet to save a 9 year old from an online troll. Are you willing to admit the price for such a technological achievement is this 9 year old's enjoyment on a forum?
Oh and anyone with a C&R can still pickup Nuggets for <$100 all day. But what would you want with such a high-capacity weapon of war? Hell, the gun that shot Kennedy (a Carcano) is pretty similar (AND on the C&R list) to the very weapons you claim are acceptable to purchase... if only Oswald was only able to legally purchase a 1776 era muzzleloader... Kennedy would have lived!
Osterkraut wrote:Ignorant wrote: So I take it to believe you wouldn't give up your ability to own guns to save the life of a child? Didn't think so.. Are you willing to admit the price for such lax gun laws is this 9 year olds life? So sad that the life of a 9 year old girl is the opportunity cost.You're grandstanding. We can say all kinds of fun things: I'd give up beer to save a 9 year old from dehydration. Are you willing to admit the price for such excessive water consumption is this 9 year old's life? I'd give up my ability to drive to save a 9 year old from a fatal car accident. Are you willing to admit the price for such mobility is this 9 year old's life? I'd give up my ability to use the internet to save a 9 year old from an online troll. Are you willing to admit the price for such a technological achievement is this 9 year old's enjoyment on a forum?
She's dead dude.. Joke all you want. She's DEAD.. She is the price of your freedoms.
E36 M3 changes when you become a dad. She's your opportunity cost..
btw.. It really does suck that the CR FFL list got expanded.. I wonder how many people realize that you cannot modify the weapons in any way and still keep them C&R compliant. Ohh well....
Ignorant wrote: E36 M3 changes when you become a dad. She's your opportunity cost.. btw.. It really does suck that the CR FFL list got expanded.. I wonder how many people realize that you cannot modify the weapons in any way and still keep them C&R compliant. Ohh well....
WILL SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN! And bust out the bubblewrap.
Come on, Iggy. If we banned everything that ever caused a grieving parent there wouldn't be an internet for you to troll!
Bet a dozen donuts that minivans kill more 9-year old kids in America every year than guns. Shouldn't we ban them too by that logic?
There are a thousand things within the average home that could be used to injure, maim, or kill a dozen people in a supermarket. Heck, probably a couple hundred in the supermarket itself. Captain Kirk made a shotgun out of some rocks and bamboo once, does anyone really think a motivated attacker with access to e-bay couldn't do the same but better?
The only time in human history when gun control would have worked was the first time the first gun was used. The genie is out of the bottle, whether you want to hide your head in the sand or face it, and there is no turning back. The only guns anyone will be able to control now are the ones law-abiding people would be able to get by going through all the legal processes. If there were no new guns sold in this country again ever there would still be enough of them out there to put a bullet in every kid for the next 50 years. And those guns will never be controllable. Tighten the restrictions more and they will just go further underground, further out of reach for self defense and deeper into the hands of criminals.
What property I own, what piece of steel, brass, aluminum, or plastic lives in a locked box in my closet, is only your business if I use it outside of the scope of legal authority. As long as I am not using the whatever to do something to someone else or break a law, who are you to tell me I shouldn't be allowed to own it? I don't have to have a good reason to own it because you already have no good reason to want to take it from me.
Mr. ignorant,would you bust a cap to defend your child(ren)? If the Gubbmint said it was illegal what would you do?
Osterkraut wrote:Ignorant wrote: E36 M3 changes when you become a dad. She's your opportunity cost.. btw.. It really does suck that the CR FFL list got expanded.. I wonder how many people realize that you cannot modify the weapons in any way and still keep them C&R compliant. Ohh well....WILL SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN! And bust out the bubblewrap. Come on, Iggy. If we banned everything that ever caused a grieving parent there wouldn't be an internet for you to troll!
just admit that you're OK with her death and any other school massacre etc. that will come along because.. Thats the price of freedom. And I'll go away. There is no such thing as a free lunch.
Ignorant wrote:Osterkraut wrote:just admit that you're OK with her death and any other school massacre etc. that will come along because.. Thats the price of freedom. And I'll go away. There is no such thing as a free lunch.Ignorant wrote: E36 M3 changes when you become a dad. She's your opportunity cost.. btw.. It really does suck that the CR FFL list got expanded.. I wonder how many people realize that you cannot modify the weapons in any way and still keep them C&R compliant. Ohh well....WILL SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN! And bust out the bubblewrap. Come on, Iggy. If we banned everything that ever caused a grieving parent there wouldn't be an internet for you to troll!
OK? Who's OK with a child's death? Come on, you're better than such ridiculous statements.
Price of freedom? Sure. Freedom is expensive. Every DUI-related death: price of freedom. Every time a guilty man goes free: price of freedom. The list goes on and on.
Of course, it's easy to volunteer to give up things for impossibilities in the name of righteousness.
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