In reply to Carbon (Forum Supporter) :
I don't understand.
I know a marathon runner who had it and 6 months later can barely finish a 5k.
In reply to Carbon (Forum Supporter) :
I don't understand.
I know a marathon runner who had it and 6 months later can barely finish a 5k.
aircooled said:Something to consider if you are avoiding the vaccine:
Yes, COVID-19 Can Cause Erectile Dysfunction in Men
https://health.clevelandclinic.org/yes-covid-19-can-cause-erectile-dysfunction-in-men/
It comes from a study, which honestly seems pretty vague at this point: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7355084/
Might end up being a good thing though. If you cannot control the human population (virus wise) by killing humans, keep them from reproducing.
Time to go watch Children of Men (very well done movie BTW)
I'm happy to report that is not a symptom I had.
My understanding is that distribution and prioritization is gonna be a big problem.
The numbers I heard is that they will have 6 million doses available (initially). Treatment takes 2 doses, so 3 million people. With 20 million health care workers on the front lines.
Front line workers are gonna need 7X what is available.
This could take a long while. I'm not holding my breath.
Neither is my 87 year old mother. She is assuming she will not have it available to her for a very long time.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/09/health/covid-vaccine-allergies-health-workers-uk-intl-gbr/index.html
interesting. I carry an epi pen and have some bad food allergies. My wife is allergic to penicillin.
In reply to Fueled by Caffeine :
I saw that this morning, looking forward to learning more about this and if it also occurs with the other vaccines. No food allergies in the family, but my youngest son is allergic to penicillin, so I'll be watching.
I have asthma and it is getting worse again as I get older, heck yeah I'm getting the vaccine. I've already had a glimpse of the whole "drowning in mid air" feeling and I don't like it.
Fueled by Caffeine said:https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/09/health/covid-vaccine-allergies-health-workers-uk-intl-gbr/index.html
interesting. I carry an epi pen and have some bad food allergies. My wife is allergic to penicillin.
Read those articicles carefully.
From what I can glean, one UK official is creating the clickbait headline "Government urges people with allergies not to get vaccine!" whereas in reality it seems two people had anaphylaxis which may be related to the vaccine. No other details were actually provided.
It will fuel conspiracies and doubt and ruin the penetration of the thing.
tuna55 said:Fueled by Caffeine said:https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/09/health/covid-vaccine-allergies-health-workers-uk-intl-gbr/index.html
interesting. I carry an epi pen and have some bad food allergies. My wife is allergic to penicillin.
Read those articicles carefully.
From what I can glean, one UK official is creating the clickbait headline "Government urges people with allergies not to get vaccine!" whereas in reality it seems two people had anaphylaxis which may be related to the vaccine. No other details were actually provided.
It will fuel conspiracies and doubt and ruin the penetration of the thing.
I agree with this.
This is probably not an issue for most people who are allergic to something. Unfortunately, our close friend is immunocompromised (Hashimoto's) and allergic to... nickel, grass, shellfish, sulfites, vinegars (related to sulfites), penicillin, dogs... I'm sure I'm missing a lot here, too. To the point that she brings a bag of McDonalds to weddings, just to be safe. At least she's not allergic to eggs. She'll probably have to hold back on the vaccine. So that is one probable setback to getting back to "normal" for our small circle.
aircooled said:One of those articles talks about transmissibility after the vaccine in the % of people it was ineffective on (that seems kind of obvious), one was behind a sign in wall, the other mentioned that they don't know because they haven't looked at it (which is scientifically correct). It's a bit like asking them if it will make monkeys fly out of your butt. They have not looked at that, so they cannot say that it doesn't.
The proper question would be something like "is there any realistic reason why someone could transmit the virus even after successfully being vaccinated?". I don't know, maybe Curtis has more insight on this.
Thanks for the explanation Curtis. This "only treats the symptoms" thing seems to be getting around (almost like a virus....) and Time appears to have gotten itself infected, those dirty birds! (sadly, they could be doing a lot of actual damage).
As you noted previously, using the proper words for things is important, but it does get difficult since most are not familiar with the specifics of the definitions and those can obviously have different meanings in other contexts.
BTW mRNA sounds a lot like DNA, so thus, it must change your DNA.... that's just good sciencing...
In a normal situation (still researching this about C19 in particular), you can always transmit a virus, vaccinated or not. It's just that it is less likely.
Typically, in a non-vaccinated person, they receive a handful of viruses, it goes into their bodies, the virus replicates, and they reach a point where the viral load A) causes the disease, and B) makes enough that your snots and sneezes are loaded with enough virus that it can more easily be spread to another non-vaccinated person. So, using random, round numbers, let's say you take in 10,000 of the little jerks. It replicates to 10 billion, you then sneeze out 10,000 of them in a droplet and someone else gets it. It's like a starter culture that grows in another person's body.
If you are vaccinated, there is nothing preventing you from still taking in that same 10,000 viruses into your nose. The only difference is that they now can't replicate to 10 billion which A) prevents you from getting the disease/symptoms and B) makes you less likely to re-transmit large loads of virus to others. But, even vaccinated, you could theoretically take in those 10,000 viruses in your nose, then sneeze and blow your nose, thereby introducing 3000 of them back into the world. Basically, if a vaccinated person touches something with the virus, they can be a carrier and give it to someone who is not vaccinated, but it's far less likely since your body can't turn into a viral factory.
Also, at this point, I feel I should mention that I'm in no way a medical professional. My interest in the topic comes from my bio/pre-med undergrad and having been married to a veterinarian for 20 years, so my medical title should be Internetarian or Googleopath.
Subscriber-unavailabile said:In reply to docwyte :
I've heard these from various sources too.
Been very interesting week. Maybe it's my demographic, but I've asked atleast 50 people in past 2 days about how they feel about the vaccine, and would they take it. ALL have said hell no, either don't trust it or are not worried about it they want to take their risk.Disclaimer don't start E36 M3 with me, just informing what I'm experiencing in the real world.
According to NPR, they reported from some nationwide representative polls that currently suggest about 42% of the US population is saying they won't get the vaccine. In truth, polls don't paint an accurate picture, but their margin of error was +/- 11%. If that ends up being true, the future I see is that the virus won't be effectively contained, and all of the people who are against being vaccinated are going to say "see, we were right. Vaccines don't work." Then I facepalm.
Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:Subscriber-unavailabile said:In reply to docwyte :
I've heard these from various sources too.
Been very interesting week. Maybe it's my demographic, but I've asked atleast 50 people in past 2 days about how they feel about the vaccine, and would they take it. ALL have said hell no, either don't trust it or are not worried about it they want to take their risk.Disclaimer don't start E36 M3 with me, just informing what I'm experiencing in the real world.
According to NPR, they reported from some nationwide representative polls that currently suggest about 42% of the US population is saying they won't get the vaccine. In truth, polls don't paint an accurate picture, but their margin of error was +/- 11%. If that ends up being true, the future I see is that the virus won't be effectively contained, and all of the people who are against being vaccinated are going to say "see, we were right. Vaccines don't work." Then I facepalm.
Exactly. My poll at work mirrors this. I suspect the same problem.
In reply to tuna55 :
I agree. I just said it was interesting and then added some facts about myself. I'll be watching closely. My food allergies are weak and I've only had anaphylaxis once. Usually if I eat my trigger food( nuts) a dose of Benadryl and sleep will kick it out of me fast. I'm less worried about that than I am about my asthma and covid.
In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :
Just to add in some nuance to that poll number:
Gallup (https://news.gallup.com/poll/325208/americans-willing-covid-vaccine.aspx):
In a follow-up question, 37% of Americans who would not get a vaccine say the rushed timeline for the development of the vaccine is the main reason they would not be vaccinated. Another 26% say they want to wait to confirm the vaccine is safe. Rounding out the reasons for some Americans' hesitancy are 12% saying they don't trust vaccines in general and 10% who want to wait to see how effective the vaccine will be. An additional 15% cite other reasons for not getting a COVID-19 vaccine. Included among these reasons are the politicization of the vaccine potentially comprising its safety and the view that the vaccine is not necessary.
The anti-vax people will certainly come back and give that "see we were right, vaccines don't work" line. But they're a pretty small minority - 12% of the 42%. My guess is the majority of the 37%, 26%, 10%, and maybe some of that 15% (of the 42%) will be open to vaccination once the open beta has been successful.
History always provides interesting viewpoints on today. My mother in law, at the thanksgiving table after some wine, once said those who are against vaccines didn't live through the polio epidemic. I guess her and dr Salk would have agreed.
A lot of workplaces will require a vaccine to come in to work.
Refuse to get one. I guess they legally can't force you. But you will get labeled a "troublemaker" and they will find another way to get rid of you if they want to. Worse yet, they would move your desk to the basement and leave you to fight Milton for the red stapler.
"So go to the clinic and get the vaccine before you come in and bring proof of vaccination for your permanent files. OK. That'll be great."
Yeah. I streamed Office Space last night. Yeah. Most workplaces are still like that.
They can't force you to get the vaccine, but they can legally terminate your employment. Your employment is a contract. If you fail to live up to that contract, they can ditch you.
Labor laws are a bit funny. They say things like "employers may not require employees to lift more than 50 lbs." But the job description for a UPS driver says 100lbs. Its a contract. If the employer says "warning, you gotta lift 100 lbs" and you accept the job, you have contractually forfeited your rights to that portion of the federal labor law.
In the same way, if an employer says "you must have the vaccine," you either get it or they can dismiss you.
There are other ways, as well, even if it isn't in the contract. I'm guessing that our company will have the vaccines on site, for free. It may even be incentivize - get the vaccine, here is a $50 gift card, or if 95% of employees at a particular location get the vaccine, everyone in that facility gets an extra "holiday" off. I'm also guessing that for our insurance, if you don't get the vaccine, you'll have to pay an extra amount like smokers have to.
So everybody who works will end up getting the vaccine then, no matter what they say now. And quite honestly they don't really care if homeless people and your deadbeat Uncle Jake refuse the needle. They won't be missed.
I'm more than likely going to get it, even tho it's not a vaccine in the sense that I want it to be. I'm in peoples faces everyday and have two auto immune diseases. Since I'm still in the military, I'll probably have access to the vaccine through them and will be required to take it.
Keep in mind that in the past, they have said that employers are not legally permitted to require a vaccine that is under an EUA, only one that has official FDA approval.
Every state except Montana is an "at-will" state. That means you are employed at the will of your employer. It also means you can be terminated at the will of your employer.
There are a couple states that have a few exceptions, but not too many.
I was fired a couple years ago from a job. The ONLY reason given was that some coworkers felt uncomfortable working around me. No further explanation. No notice. Escorted from the building that moment.
I hired an attorney who was a specialist in employment law. She had access to my personnel file, and assured me they had absolutely no basis for my termination. She was able to get me a decent severance, but saving the job was NOT an option. At-will state. The employer doesn't need to provide a reason. They only need to say they no longer want to keep me employed.
I GUARANTEE it will be easy to remove any employees from their position who refuse to get the vaccine. All they have to say is some of their coworkers were uncomfortable working around them. Done.
And OSHA mandates that employers provide a workplace free of known hazards. If they fail to remove C19 from the workplace when they were able to, employers will be liable.
Plus, there will be so many unemployed people looking for work that are willing to get the vaccine, it will be easy to replace anyone.
They can't force you to get the vaccine. But they certainly do not need to keep you employed.
wae said:In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :
Just to add in some nuance to that poll number:
Gallup (https://news.gallup.com/poll/325208/americans-willing-covid-vaccine.aspx):
In a follow-up question, 37% of Americans who would not get a vaccine say the rushed timeline for the development of the vaccine is the main reason they would not be vaccinated. Another 26% say they want to wait to confirm the vaccine is safe. Rounding out the reasons for some Americans' hesitancy are 12% saying they don't trust vaccines in general and 10% who want to wait to see how effective the vaccine will be. An additional 15% cite other reasons for not getting a COVID-19 vaccine. Included among these reasons are the politicization of the vaccine potentially comprising its safety and the view that the vaccine is not necessary.
The anti-vax people will certainly come back and give that "see we were right, vaccines don't work" line. But they're a pretty small minority - 12% of the 42%. My guess is the majority of the 37%, 26%, 10%, and maybe some of that 15% (of the 42%) will be open to vaccination once the open beta has been successful.
35% here at work
Canada just provided emergency authoization of the Pfizer vaccine.
I am glad I got the polio sugar cube and will get this in a few months when I can ,
My best friend in High schools father had Polio , he drove us to school until we could were old enough to get a drivers license , so I saw a little of what that was like ,
They need public service ads now telling people they may have reactions for a day or 2 after getting a vaccine shot , do the ads now before the " I told you so " crowd scares everyone .
It will never be perfect , nothing is , but at least tell the people what might happen and the percentage that had reactions in the phase 3 trials.
I think we would all like to see this gone and we can get back to a "normal" life
Stay safe
I'm definitely getting it. With all respect to those that choose not to get it, I don't think people fully understand the actual science and efficacy of mRNA based vaccines. Modern medical technology has allowed us to streamline so many phases of the R&D process that viral vaccine development doesn't have to take years anymore. It's entirely possible that the first cracked mRNA pod and antibody insertion was developed and tested in lab a few weeks after the actual pandemic began.
I do understand the trepidation though, I'm not gonna fight anyone that wants to hold off for a larger sample size and more data. I will, however, fight those who flat out refuse to get it based on any sort of conspiracy theory or freedom infringement. Trust me, your freedoms have already been way further infringed upon by a host of normal, modern societal goings-on.
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