Cuba

As for the ability to afford a F-150, I am not thinking of the new trucks with a $25-$75k price tag. I am more thinking how can I buy up $2-$3k trucks (that seem otherwise undesirable) and send them to the Cubans who would find them amazing and functional.
My immediate thought was that here is an entire country/island that has few full size, US style, pickups.

Sure, that price may also be a stretch given the current economy. Though, if the resorts and tourism grows then some of those dollars will fall onto the average man.

F1 and WRC event.

I don't want resorts and casinos. I want small B and B's and no outside land purchasing. Once the beaches are littered with resorts and casinos it becomes just like every other island in the Caribbean.

Unfortunately within 5 years it'll be another Vegas. A lot of people still remember the old days there and that's probably the easiest way to bring fresh 'scarole into the country.

I just read that Cuba might me a great place for a MLB expansion team. Thst's a pretty damn good idea.

i worry that any economic travel in their direction will be tax soaked to prop up their government and only a whiff of it makes it to individuals, and only those that help the regime rat out dissidents.

In reply to mazdeuce:

That was a phone call that I had on my drive home

captdownshift wrote: F1 and WRC event. I don't want resorts and casinos. I want small B and B's and no outside land purchasing. Once the beaches are littered with resorts and casinos it becomes just like every other island in the Caribbean.

While you have a point, and that indeed is a possibility, I don't see it likely at all.

Only the really small islands are beach resort only- places like Puerto Rico and the Dominican Republic still have beach areas that are not overly comercial.

And relative to Puerto Rico and Hispanola, Cuba is a MUCH bigger island. So I bet there will be the easy to get to resorts, the difficult to get to B&B's or small places, and the hard to get to hideaways.

madmallard wrote: i worry that any economic travel in their direction will be tax soaked to prop up their government and only a whiff of it makes it to individuals, and only those that help the regime rat out dissidents.

Like China, for instance? We have no problem POURING money to that communist country.

I hope the have a ferry and a Burger King by the time I go to the Keys next month. I'd love to visit.

We've been down several times and it's amazing to see how much development is taking place as far as resorts go. Many of the beaches are already lined with resorts and they've built some long causeways out to islands that are just for resorts.

The old cars are pretty cool but most of them are kept on the road more for the tourist trade than for personal transport. The Chinese cars were gaining popularity but there were lots of Toyotas and Renaults on the road.

You guys realize the only people in the world that don't go to Cuba for vacation are Americans, right? There are resorts down there jam packed full of Canadians right now.

Raul Castro was here for former Prime Minister Trudeau's funeral a few years back. Seems right, since he was a French Marxist son of a bitch.

thats a seperate problem, perpetrated by the idiocy of free trade with a non-representative government.

nobody i know is suggesting free-trade with Cuba, the embargo is the surest way to defund the state of terror that governs there now, because ANY money let in will be snatched up.

alfadriver wrote:

madmallard wrote: i worry that any economic travel in their direction will be tax soaked to prop up their government and only a whiff of it makes it to individuals, and only those that help the regime rat out dissidents.

Like China, for instance? We have no problem POURING money to that communist country.

In reply to madmallard:

So you buy nothing made in China then?

I have read opinions that flooding Cuba with trade would end what they have. So....

They are very well educated.

nah, i'm not some absolutist like that. once the deal was made, there is nothing that the masses and medium business can do in short order to address it anymore, so there was precious little reason to cut yourself off at the knees financially.

--

but with Cuba, an embargo is in place. if the deal gets made to undo that embargo, then Cuba will be much closer to China; a country with hostile objectives in the world to US interests, and with an economic leverage of a 'planned' economy that can be an indirect weapon against us.

i'm against any thawing of the relationship that doesn't include some type of government reform. even a little bit would be better than this trade for what looks like 5 spies.

i would like specifics on what US interests the president think will be furthered by this action. one of his remarks is that dismiss the current state of things as "rigid policy that is rooted in events that took place before most of us were born."

the problem with this frankly myopic view is that in the US the political class has turned over almost completely by comparison, and in Cuba large number of the same people are actually in power now that were when the events took place before most of us were born... so making the intellectual argument that the policy is outdated because it predates the people in power now in the US while completely ignoring the same people are in power that caused the policy in the first place rings very hollow to me...

but what do i know...

The Castro brothers have oppressed their people. Cuba was ready to aim nukes at us. There's a bunch of other reasons to not like them. On the other hand, you can say that we have had some strained relations with Russia/USSR over the years, and last time I checked we use them to get up to the International Space Station. Then look at all of the other countries we regularly deal with who have less than awesome records regarding things like human rights, etc. Do we continue to single out Cuba, or do we start only dealing with "nice" countries?

Streetwiseguy wrote: You guys realize the only people in the world that don't go to Cuba for vacation are Americans, right? There are resorts down there jam packed full of Canadians right now.

I was just talking to a group of world travelers at happy hour this evening and they all thought ending the embargo would be devastating to the Cuban tourist economy. Cuba is world renowned as THE place to go for holiday that guarantees not having to deal with any Americans. The list of countries where this was mentioned was staggering. Thailand, South Africa, Germany, France, all of the UK, Ukraine, New Zealand, Australia, Fiji, Finland.....

Some of these folks had been globe trotting since the 70's and said it has been this way as long as they could remember.

You guys realise that America is the only country that still thinks Cuba is a threat to ANYONE, right?

You won, get over yourselves.

Yeah, Cuba is a real paradise. Ask all those people who risk their lives trying to get to the US in any way possible. Better yet, see if you can interview the ones who died trying to make the crossing.

Castro went WAY overboard back in the day what with the Russian nukes etc, over the years he continued to poke the US in the eye every chance he got. I have to admit, the guy was a genius at turning things to his advantage and also at PR to the 3rd world. The best (worst) example was when Jimmy Carter announced blanket amnesty; Castro opened the mental hospitals and jails, pointed them north and said 'go'. Next thing you know, South Florida is awash in criminals and mental cases. (Well, given what an idiot Carter was maybe it's a better example of his stupidity.) At least Obama didn't announce blanket amnesty.

Here's how I see it now- what do we gain by continuing this battle?

Nothing has happened in the last 10 years, and to think something will change when the same thing keeps going on is not realistic.

Yes, Cuba was an enemy of this country, and allowed enemies to point nukes at us. We also pointed nukes at Russia in countries next to them, too. But 1990 came, the Soviet threat through Cuba pretty much ended.

Yes, Cuba has suppressed their public. Castro did, as did Batista. One of those two we supported. We also supported many very oppresive dictatorships in central and south America. Seems like if the world gets more friendly the the general public of Cuba, the ability of the central goverment to oppress them goes down.

Really, the question is- what's the point?

What do we gain by keeping this thing going?

If we are going to be upset about spies, then we should be more upset with our allies who are spying on us, too.

Trans_Maro wrote: You guys realise that America is the only country that still thinks Cuba is a threat to ANYONE, right? You won, get over yourselves.

This. The level of butthurt the US displays over Cuba has been silly the entire time. The only thing the embargo could possibly help is Cuba's repair shops and smugglers. Is that what the US wants?

I think what's changed recently is that a lot of Cuban refugees who hate Castro's government with the force of a thousand suns are dying off.

They must have discovered significant oil/gas resources on Cuba or in their waters.

alfadriver wrote:

madmallard wrote: i worry that any economic travel in their direction will be tax soaked to prop up their government and only a whiff of it makes it to individuals, and only those that help the regime rat out dissidents.

Like China, for instance? We have no problem POURING money to that communist country.

one thing about the US.. We'll lie down with dogs, If it makes us...

GameboyRMH wrote:

Trans_Maro wrote: You guys realise that America is the only country that still thinks Cuba is a threat to ANYONE, right? You won, get over yourselves.

This. The level of butthurt the US displays over Cuba has been silly the entire time. The only thing the embargo could possibly help is Cuba's repair shops and smugglers. Is that what the US wants? I think what's changed recently is that a lot of Cuban refugees who hate Castro's government with the force of a thousand suns are dying off.

Castro kept things stirred up because the sanctions were good for him. He's as much if not more to blame than the US. Now that he's not running the show it's much easier to come to an agreement.

when can I get me a 53 chevy with a lada diesel?

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2014/12/17/cuba-million-dollar-mercedes-benz/?intcmp=features