Dog Rescue Rant II

In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker:

I feel for you. All three of ours are rescues: Greyhound, Whippet, Saluki. The greyhound group is local, we know them, so things are easier. We thought the Whippet folks (W.R.A.P.)were crazy. They wanted $450 to adopt. The grey was $250. The rescue was not providing the foster family anything. No shelter or kennel costs. WTF? Then we came across STOLA--Saluki rescue. Oy!

vwcorvette wrote: In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker: We thought the Whippet folks (W.R.A.P.)were crazy. They wanted $450 to adopt.

I spoke to a woman earlier who wanted $425 including ground transport to within 100 miles of me. It included neutering, shots, worming, etc so it;s not as out of line as it seems if that is all in order. A solid $350 of that would be spent at the local vet for the same stuff so it is really like a $75 donation with bundled services.

The breed-specific ones seem to be the most fanatical about where the dogs go. We like adopting mutts anyways.

It doesn't take much to qualify as a rescue, some are people who care and end up getting overwhelmed, others are basically the crazy cat lady.

The cost of the dog up front is a drop in the bucket compared to food and medical care. I have typically made a donation to the rescue larger than their fee anyways. Our brown dog has had two ACL surgeries and a crown on a canine tooth - that added up fast!

Our rescue pooches:

Holyawesomegogglesbatman! How hard was it to get him/her to wear em?

I'm the guy who started the last thread. I was so pissed off I came >< close to starting a web site I'd call "Does Not Adopt" and list all these so-called rescues, soliciting complaints via Craigslist. But, I have better things to do with my time than take out my anger on stupid pet hoarders.

Local Humane Society FTW. This was $29.99 because he was over 8 years old:

We still laugh about what a bargain he was.

There's one independent rescue we visited that doesn't have stupid rules or fees and even has a store front: Molly's Place If they had what we were looking for we would have adopted from them. The place was mobbed when we stopped in and it looked like turnover on the animals was pretty high. Not quite as cheap as the HS but still not a bad deal.

The best dog we ever had was a puppy from the side of the road for free. 15 years with no medical conditions and no vet visits other than getting her fixed and the annual rabies shot. Mutts for the win.

Is is just me, or is this place getting nastier, more negative and more ugly as time goes on?

I have done dog rescue for about 15 years, have worked for about a dozen groups and I have founded two groups myself. I have also written a column on dog rescue for about two years. And despite that there are some crazy groups in town who would not adopt to me because I am single or because I am male and because there isn't always somebody at home during the day. And there are also crazy people who run car clubs and who operate race car shops who you wouldn't want to do business with either.

And no, I won't give you a husky if you let him run on your unfenced property because after about a day I will probably find him dead on the side of the road. I will probably recommend that if you don't have a fence you consider building one or getting another breed that doesn't have a tendency to run. And yes, I will ask for your vet's number and make sure your previous dog got heartworm preventative every month, because about half the dogs I pull from the pound test positive for heartworm and every so often one dies of heartworm because we didn't get to him in time.

And yes, I will ask for a home visit. I probably smell better than you do, and I might have some suggestions as to how to fix your fence so your new dog doesn't escape and end up dead on the side of the road. I might even help you fix your fence, or if you are hard up for cash, I might even buy some boards and nails at the local Home Depot for you. And I just want to make sure that you aren't wanting to use the dog for dogfight bait or sell him to a laboratory for profit, or make sure that you aren't a smelly dog hoarder.

And yes, I do charge a fee. Between $200 and $300 per dog. And that just about covers all shots and tests and a checkup at the vet....if there is nothing wrong with the dog. If the dog has hearworm, my group might just end up spending another $300 to $800 beyond that to cure the dog. If the dog has a broken leg, lets make that a couple thousand. And I will still charge only $200 to $300 for the dog after all those medical expenses. Sometimes we get donations for those dogs. Sometimes I will take money out of my bank account to pay for them or pull out my credit card and hand it to the vet. I once spent about $3,000 of my own money to pay for a dog that a leg that was broken and was walked on for three months afterwards before the owner decided to dump her in the pound. Our group didn't have the money, but I did and I felt that this young dog deserved a chance. Not only did I pay for her surgery, but I spent months working with her to teach her how to walk and later run on all fours again. The Dallas Morning News did a nice article about both me and the dog. When I was finished with her, she could run again. And yes, her adoption fee was $300 and I damn well checked out the person I adopted her to before she left my home.

I have probably spent over $20,000 on dog rescue in the last 15 years and have spent endless hours rescuing, rehabilitating and finding homes for dogs. So now you might understand why when somebody who has never donated an hour or a dollar to a dog rescue group thinks he can run his mouth on a message board about how dog rescue groups should be run that I might just have an issue with that.

Better yet. If you don't like what I do, go berkeley yourself.

Well said, but if you give good people a ton of obstacles to go through they're going to go somewhere else for a dog.

Dogs aren't a limited commodity and if bad people want a dog they can get one with no questions asked, they're not going to bother coming to you in the first place. I doubt Mike Vick ever said "I need a new fighting dog, time to head down to the rescue shelter."

Snowdoggie wrote: So now you might understand why when somebody who has never donated an hour or a dollar to a dog rescue group thinks he can run his mouth on a message board about how dog rescue groups should be run that I might just have an issue with that. Better yet. If you don't like what I do, go berkeley yourself.

Better yet - listen to what I am ranting about. If you were to make the process of obtaining a dog as easy as picking one up after a donation large enough to indicate a commitment you would be doing the dogs a greater service than trying to control any aspect of where they go from there. People who abuse dogs don't rescue them at a cost of hundreds of dollars up front when the pet store is right around around the corner. People who go to rescues are trying to do the right thing and when you make it difficult or impossible with silly "control after the fact" rules they go to the pet store.

Scrutiny beyond some advice for first time owners and a check that clears drives people to puppy mills. That is exact opposite of what you want. Do you not get that making the process easy and care free is how you help the dogs? Remember - this rant is from the CUSTOMER. The guy who really wanted to save a dog and who has had terriers around for 40 years. It was right there on the application. I do know that when they are ready and I set them loose in the middle of nowhere to run - they won't die. They will run. And when I whistle - they will come back.

In any case - Meet my two new buddies - they were from the same litter, starved and dehydrated, brought back and passed on to me from someone who didn't have their panties in a wad or a chip on their shoulder. They just wanted a good home for two dogs and they found one.

I'm stoked.

bluej wrote: Holyawesomegogglesbatman! How hard was it to get him/her to wear em?

Not too bad. He does rub them off occasionally, and I haven't been as strict about him wearing them lately. He wears them in the Miata too, puts his head up over the windshield.

http://www.doggles.com/

He has a condition called Florida Spots that our vet recommended he not spend long hours in bight areas (like on the boat).

DaveEstey wrote: Well said, but if you give good people a ton of obstacles to go through they're going to go somewhere else for a dog. Dogs aren't a limited commodity and if bad people want a dog they can get one with no questions asked, they're not going to bother coming to you in the first place. I doubt Mike Vick ever said "I need a new fighting dog, time to head down to the rescue shelter."

Yeah. And in China they buy dogs and cook them and eat them for dinner, and there isn't a damn thing I can do about that either. But at least I am open to adopting one of my dogs to somebody who doesn't have somebody at home all day. People do have to work for a living and two income families are a reality. Some groups are run by stay at home wives who are married to guys who can afford to have stay at home wives, and they think that is just the way things should be. They do tend to look down their noses at us poor folk. I work primarily with Siberian Huskies and Husky Mixes. They aren't for everybody. They can escape from poorly constructed fences and run for miles. Your average Basset Hound or Chihuahua isn't going to knock down a fence and end up dead on the side of the road, but a husky just might, so I am going to check your house and look at your fence. I also want to make sure that you take care of your dogs. If you do, your vet can confirm that. If you say, "What vet." we have a problem. One woman contacted my group and wanted a husky for her son after he saw the movie Snowdogs. She freely admitted that she bought her son a Chihuahua after he saw all those Taco Bell Commercials and now he wanted a Husky instead. the Chihuahua got dumped in the pound and she was sure he got a new home somewhere. This woman didn't get a dog from us. I'm not going to ask for your credit report, ask about your political affiliations or question your religious beliefs. I just want some idea how well you treat your dogs. If your last dog lived to I ripe old age, that just might be all I need to know.

The problem with the $450 for the whippet was that the dog came to the rescue fixed, they did no vetting, and did not provide the foster family reimbursement $. And none of the $450 was going to them. We've rescued three greys. They always were vetted, shots, fixed etc. Came with collar, blanket, toy and muzzle. I convinced WRAP to take $350.

STOLA folks in the NE are just plain crazy. They strung us along for six months until we could prove we had locks on our gates, the fence was 6 feet high, and someone could visit. They decided we weren't good for Heidi and that another family was interested so they were gonna go in that direction. Months later they call to tell us Heidi is ours? What? Huh? Who?

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:

Snowdoggie wrote: So now you might understand why when somebody who has never donated an hour or a dollar to a dog rescue group thinks he can run his mouth on a message board about how dog rescue groups should be run that I might just have an issue with that. Better yet. If you don't like what I do, go berkeley yourself.

Better yet - listen to what I am ranting about. If you were to make the process of obtaining a dog as easy as picking one up after a donation large enough to indicate a commitment you would be doing the dogs a greater service than trying to control any aspect of where they go from there. People who abuse dogs don't rescue them at a cost of hundreds of dollars up front when the pet store is right around around the corner. People who go to rescues are trying to do the right thing and when you make it difficult or impossible with silly "control after the fact" rules they go to the pet store. Scrutiny beyond some advice for first time owners and a check that clears drives people to puppy mills. That is exact opposite of what you want. Do you not get that making the process easy and care free is how you help the dogs? Remember - this rant is from the CUSTOMER. The guy who really wanted to save a dog and who has had terriers around for 40 years. It was right there on the application. I do know that when they are ready and I set them loose in the middle of nowhere to run - they won't die. They will run. And when I whistle - they will come back. In any case - Meet my two new buddies - they were from the same litter, starved and dehydrated, brought back and passed on to me from someone who didn't have their panties in a wad or a chip on their shoulder. They just wanted a good home for two dogs and they found one. I'm stoked.

Sorry. If you took this the wrong way. You sound like a good dog owner and not somebody who abuses dogs. You just have to understand that some of us in dog rescue have seen dogs go out to what they thought were good homes and then get the news that the dog they adopted out a week ago escaped from the backyard and may be who knows where now. There is also a difference between a Terrier who will stick by the house and a husky or malamute who will run out into the street the first chance he gets. Some people have to be educated. When you spend a lot of time and money saving a dog you have an interest in making sure he goes to the right home.

As for using the term 'customer', dog rescue groups don't look at it that way. We don't sell dogs. We find homes for them. We don't make money doing this. The pet shop does. They will sell to anybody who walks in the door. We won't. A pet shop will sell a husky puppy or some other puppy that will turn into a large dog to somebody who lives in a 1 bedroom apartment and will not warn that person ahead of time that the dog will shed like crazy and when he gets bored he will eat your couch. They just want to sell a puppy and make the money. When the dog gets big and tears up the apartment the dog will end up with us when the owner dumps him, if he is lucky. The last thing I want to do is put the dog in anther 1 bedroom apartment with another owner who is clueless about big dogs and repeat the process. So I do want a little control about where the dog goes. I'm not fanatical about it. I just want to make sure that the dog is a good match for the owner and that the dog gets a good home. I don't know why another dog rescue group turned you down and I can't speak for another group. Maybe they were unfair to you. I don't know. But my group will continue to require applications, home visits and vet checks because those procedures make sure that the dogs go to good homes. Those procedures work for us and we have found homes for hundreds of dogs that way. And if people would rather go to a puppy mill than fill out an application, there isn't anything I can really do about it.

At any rate. Good luck with your new pups.

Snowdoggie wrote: Those procedures work for us and we have found homes for hundreds of dogs that way. And if people would rather go to a puppy mill than fill out an application, there isn't anything I can really do about it. At any rate. Good luck with your new pups.

I politely disagree that there isn't something you can do about it but I'll save the speech for when I have a better idea to implement - and thanks. Good luck finding homes for your pooches too. If no one cared to rescue them - I suppose I couldn't bitch about them hoarding them to themselves

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:

Snowdoggie wrote: Those procedures work for us and we have found homes for hundreds of dogs that way. And if people would rather go to a puppy mill than fill out an application, there isn't anything I can really do about it. At any rate. Good luck with your new pups.

I politely disagree that there isn't something you can do about it but I'll save the speech for when I have a better idea to implement - and thanks. Good luck finding homes for your pooches too. If no one cared to rescue them - I suppose I couldn't bitch about them hoarding them to themselves

If you have any good suggestions on how I can adopt out some of these doggies, let me know. I have an 89 pound Malamusky here who needs a home badly. People don't want the big ones.

Get the dog a t-shirt that says Adopt Me and take her to dog parks and charity walks? I wish I had room at the inn.

Snowdoggie wrote:

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:

Snowdoggie wrote: Those procedures work for us and we have found homes for hundreds of dogs that way. And if people would rather go to a puppy mill than fill out an application, there isn't anything I can really do about it. At any rate. Good luck with your new pups.

I politely disagree that there isn't something you can do about it but I'll save the speech for when I have a better idea to implement - and thanks. Good luck finding homes for your pooches too. If no one cared to rescue them - I suppose I couldn't bitch about them hoarding them to themselves

If you have any good suggestions on how I can adopt out some of these doggies, let me know. I have an 89 pound Malamusky here who needs a home badly. People don't want the big ones.

If I had room, I'd be on your doorstep. The big ones are the best ones. Friend of mine has something along those lines, and it's not a dog, it's a bear. A big furry awesome bear.

Snowdoggie, I think those of us bitching about these militant rescues are not targeting guys like you. Your adoption fees are not insane, your requirements for a troublesome, escape-prone breed are not out of line, and most of us know you well enough that you're not some kind of complete nut-job and you probably tell people why you've denied their application.

My desire to kick someone in the gonads was a result of being denied without reason via email, never a home inspection, an exemplary vet reference that was never checked and years of rescuing multiple similar breed dogs from my local shelter. I'm one of the thousands of potential adopters that get denied simply because some holier-than-thou person doesn't like one line on a multi-page, invasive application I filled out via the internet, the only way to attempt an adoption because they have no store front for me to visit in person. Months go by and I see the same dogs I was interested in still on Petfinder with desperate pleas to find them homes. Meanwhile, the local SPCA's and rescues like the one I linked are turning over inventory and placing dogs with very few returns. I've heard them deny people right in front of me, but for actual good reasons, not for some bizarre belief that if the dog is left alone for 5 hrs a day it will hang itself from boredom. The more I speak to other dog people the more I'm finding have been through this problem; good people, some of which have just given up and bought a puppy from a questionable breeder because they couldn't get the dog they wanted any other way.

we adopted a cat last yr ( my 88 yo Mom needs/wants companionship since I'm at work and/or gone on the lots of weekends) ... the application papers were rather invasive and the look on the "inspectors" face during the home visit wasn't very endearing .... the constant admonition that the cat NEVER EVER be let outdoors (all out cats over the yrs have gone outside when they want to) or they wouldn't let us have it

want a dog also ( they had a gorgeous / young blue tick hound that I'd have taken in heart beat ) but their requirement for a completely fenced in yard isn't really possible here .. 14 1/2 ac. of wooded mountain side with literally thousands and thousands of wooded mountains to our north has made it great place for the spaniels and setters that I've always had ...

and since the co. leash laws are starting to become somewhat oppressive ... you don't have to have them penned up or on a leash .. at least 'til someone calls to complain ... then they'll be picked up ...

means there's not much chance I'll ever get to have a dog in my life again ( at least not the type I like / would like to have )

<.

In any case - Meet my two new buddies - they were from the same litter, starved and dehydrated, brought back and passed on to me from someone who didn't have their panties in a wad or a chip on their shoulder. They just wanted a good home for two dogs and they found one.

I'm stoked.

Congrats. Those are fine looking dogs. An ex girlfriend has one like them. It can entertain itself for hours tormenting the chipmunks in the firewood stack.

Snowdoggie wrote:

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:

Snowdoggie wrote: Those procedures work for us and we have found homes for hundreds of dogs that way. And if people would rather go to a puppy mill than fill out an application, there isn't anything I can really do about it. At any rate. Good luck with your new pups.

I politely disagree that there isn't something you can do about it but I'll save the speech for when I have a better idea to implement - and thanks. Good luck finding homes for your pooches too. If no one cared to rescue them - I suppose I couldn't bitch about them hoarding them to themselves

If you have any good suggestions on how I can adopt out some of these doggies, let me know. I have an 89 pound Malamusky here who needs a home badly. People don't want the big ones.

As a husky owner (a husky with severe epilepsy - I know hardship when it comes to owning a pet), I can say, that puppy mill bastards need to be shot - SWMBO and I were obscenely naive when we purchased our "AKC registered breeder"s pup, and they provided zero education (I know, I know, I should have done some research first, so there is responsibility on my shoulders too), and were basically lied to about Husky habits. Boy were we sold a bill of goods. But, after a LOOOOONG learning period, I think all 3 of us have come to a pretty good understanding of what we all need to live happily together. Prospective owners do need to be schooled in dog ownership - it will be better for everyone involved if they are.

I can also understand why it takes a very special dog person to own a big one. Bandit is about 55 lbs, and is a total handful - all energy, totally self centered and aloof, a hair factory on an epic scale...it can make ownership tough. But he brutally sincere in those moments where he shows appreciation for our love, which easily makes up for everything else.

pilotbraden wrote: Congrats. Those are fine looking dogs. An ex girlfriend has one like them. It can entertain itself for hours tormenting the chipmunks in the firewood stack.

I fully expect them to take ownership of rodent murder here. Every good terrier needs a job - and killing things that make holes in the yard is right up their alley. I was only looking for one good dog - but these guys were a two-fer deal. Who am I to split up brothers when I have two boys who need to learn how to teach a dog to catch a frisbee?

It is going to be a loooong couple days but once they get assimilated I expect much hilarity.

I don't mean to put down the rescue societies, most do a fine job but they aren't the only way to rescue a pet. My last dog came from a adoption place run by a vet local to the area. The black lab mix I got from there as a puppy was a very good dog. Passed away at 13 years old a few years ago. We now have a toy poodle the owner was trying to get rid of as she couldn't take care of it anymore. It was on its way to the local pound when my wife found out about it and brought the dog home. Daughter has a boxer/pit mix she got the same way, Dog doesn't even know it's supposed to be mean. A real sweetheart. The only cost associated with saving one from going to the shelter is whatever care it needs and shots. I did figure out why the Poodle was on its way to the pound, needed some dental work which is common for the breed anyway. Poor thing could barely eat when we got her, after a couple hundred in dental work, update shots and she's been a good dog. And she can eat without pain now.

Had a mixed breed growing up that had epilepsy also, ended up very severe when she got old and had to be put down for it. She was 14 or 15 when that happened. That dog was one of us kids and loved playgrounds, especially slides and the barrel.

If I had a dollar for everytime the wife and I were rejected I could buy a nice meal out with her....

We're DINKS. We are going to stay that way and our dogs are our children.... in so many ways it's not funny. Our dogs are well behaved, well trained, loved to death and far from neglected. We have 2 acres, no fenced in a rural area (over half mile to the nearest house), we use a wireless "fence" but both the dogs we had trained to it didn't need it. One is a 10 year old Border Collie, the other a mixed shetland/australian shephard/mix that is 4. Her beloved passed away 4 years ago when she was 11. All were/are dedicated to use like crazy. They're inside dogs that go out regularly. We crate train, after 2 years they are allowed to roam the house but will typically sleep in their own crate (door is left open) when they get tired.

We've been turned down for the following reasons:

No Fence. (ignored the part about A.) being inside dogs and 2.) being trained with a wireless fence)

Not home 24/7. (both work, we;re gone ~7 hours a day.)

We already have a female.

We don't pay to have our dogs "professionally trained"

We Crate train.

Have a dog under 5 years old.

Have a dog over 5 years old.

Is an inside dog. (yeah, real head scratcher there)

Don't show them. (this one made me go Whiskey Tango Foxtrot)

Seriously... anyone that knows us knows our dogs. They know that they are the most wellbehaved dogs they;ve met, and are cared for and loved. Maya, the 10 year old Border Collie has had BOTH knees replaced (~$5k in work). Sadly she is now suffering from Spleen Cancer and is on borrowed time, but even with that she is happy and loved daily. So for use to be declined from a rescue is assanine. It's beyond that... it's just ludicrous. So don't give me this crap about having the animal's best intentions at heart when you decline a known good owner for something stupid.

Here's the newest dog we got 5 weeks ago: http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/423206_3123431757778_1024117577_33105630_1627882208_n.jpg[/IMG]

She's 7 months old, 70lbs and a complete teddy bear.