East coast Port strike?

So, what's going on with this?

I am near Charleston, Sc and its all over the news.

Anybody have a good source of actual info?  All I can find is stuff that says the sky is falling and we won't be ever able to get butt wiping paper again.

My good friend is a part time dock worker and even he is in the dark about what's happening.

Whatchu got?

The west coast is open and most of our crap we buy on Amazon comes from there.  

Wait, the strike is on the east coast? Then what is my wife's company freaking out about? 90% of the stuff that goes through their warehouse comes in through port of Los Angeles or Long Beach. 

But they held a meeting today to remind everyone that every day of a strike puts them 3-5 days behind schedule as far as moving merchandise around the country goes.

Based upon a great deal of reading and extensive research, as near as I can tell the sky is falling and we won't ever be able to get butt wiping paper again.

This union leader is more of a character than the UAW union leader we had to listen to forever.  

The report I heard this morning was that the union wants a 75% pay increase over the next 6 years, while the port management is only willing to provide a 50% increase in pay over the same time period. Also there is discussion about limiting the use of automation to replace workers.

I saw some limited things that says the east coast ports are equipment heavy and food heavy.  Like 76% of our bananas come through there. 

USMX said in a statement that: "Our current offer of a nearly 50% wage increase exceeds every other recent union settlement, while addressing inflation and recognizing the ILA’s hard work to keep the global economy running."

Daggett said the union is pushing for more, including a $5 per hour raise for each year of the new six-year contract.

This shows that yet again, I am in the wrong line of work.

Not related, but there's a copper sheet shortage on the West Coast. I wonder what that's due to?

In reply to Noddaz :

Hard to tell if you are or not.  When I looked at salaries- one hiring site has them peak below $50k/year, another the peak is $75k, but there are a lot complaining about $150k.  Given the complaining doesn't seem to have data, and a $30/hr raise is 76%, then they make ~$40/hr now.  

$40/hr is almost $77k/year.  And $70/hr is $134k/year.

$40/hr matches the senior wages of one of the sites I saw.

I wonder if the big deal about the 50% over 6 years is more about automation than not- or at least some other clause in the deal being offered.  

We have to bear in mind that the news we get on both sides of a negotiation is just what they want to say to get you on their side.  

edit- given these guys haven't gotten a raise in a long time, they are certainly not the reason for inflation.  And when I looked at the total spend for shipping in the US, the raise they are asking for is 0.3% of all shipping cost from 2022.  So at the same time, it's a lot of money to the individual, but almost nothing as part of the overall system.

alfadriver said:

In reply to Noddaz :

Hard to tell if you are or not.  When I looked at salaries- one hiring site has them peak below $50k/year, another the peak is $75k, but there are a lot complaining about $150k.  Given the complaining doesn't seem to have data, and a $30/hr raise is 76%, then they make ~$40/hr now.  

$40/hr is almost $77k/year.  And $70/hr is $134k/year.

$40/hr matches the senior wages of one of the sites I saw.

I wonder if the big deal about the 50% over 6 years is more about automation than not- or at least some other clause in the deal being offered.  

We have to bear in mind that the news we get on both sides of a negotiation is just what they want to say to get you on their side.  

 

edit- given these guys haven't gotten a raise in a long time, they are certainly not the reason for inflation.  And when I looked at the total spend for shipping in the US, the raise they are asking for is 0.3% of all shipping cost from 2022.  So at the same time, it's a lot of money to the individual, but almost nothing as part of the overall system.

Agreed on all counts.  Also, keep in mind some of these ports are located in expensive cities (NYC, Philadelphia, Boston).  Some of the salaries discussed may be necessary to live <90 minutes from the port in a decent apartment or house. 

Brailla pasta moves via the east as well. Expect that to get thin on shelves soon ish. 

Just wait a week and see what happens. 

Just wait a week and see what happens. 

Seems like a good time to irrationally buy a lot of toilet paper.  

John Welsh said:

Seems like a good time to irrationally buy a lot of toilet paper.  

I believe it's called butt wiping paper.

Our hoses from Europe come through these ports.  

The answer is to send it down to the Panama Canal up to Long Beach, CA to the railroads to take it to our Denver and Chicago warehouses.  Guess who is going to pay these extra costs?  

In reply to Fueled by Caffeine :

Actually, Barilla's pasta for the US is made in Iowa and New York (I've driven by the factory in Ames many times)
There's even a 2022 news story about them being sued by people feeling mislead that the pasta is made in Italy. 

This is similar to the Rail workers strike from a while back.

If the industry is such a lynch pin to our economy that any interruption would be devastating, it stands to reason that we should be taking care of the people doing those jobs.

SOLIDARITY

IAM-751

alfadriver said:

In reply to Noddaz :

Hard to tell if you are or not.  When I looked at salaries- one hiring site has them peak below $50k/year, another the peak is $75k, but there are a lot complaining about $150k.  Given the complaining doesn't seem to have data, and a $30/hr raise is 76%, then they make ~$40/hr now.  

$40/hr is almost $77k/year.  And $70/hr is $134k/year.

$40/hr matches the senior wages of one of the sites I saw.

I wonder if the big deal about the 50% over 6 years is more about automation than not- or at least some other clause in the deal being offered.  

We have to bear in mind that the news we get on both sides of a negotiation is just what they want to say to get you on their side.  

 

edit- given these guys haven't gotten a raise in a long time, they are certainly not the reason for inflation.  And when I looked at the total spend for shipping in the US, the raise they are asking for is 0.3% of all shipping cost from 2022.  So at the same time, it's a lot of money to the individual, but almost nothing as part of the overall system.

$40/hr = $83,200 annually before taxes, health insurance, 401k contributions. 

Assuming you count 40 hour work weeks, 52 weeks of the year. Unless you don't don't get paid sick time or paid vacation, you make the same per hour when you use them. 

All you have to do is take the hourly rate and multiply by 2080.

The timing is interesting given that we're 35 days from an event and the union leader has publicly declared his support of a particular cult.  What a great way to throw the economy into turmoil.

alfadriver said:

In reply to Noddaz :

Hard to tell if you are or not.  When I looked at salaries- one hiring site has them peak below $50k/year, another the peak is $75k, but there are a lot complaining about $150k.  Given the complaining doesn't seem to have data, and a $30/hr raise is 76%, then they make ~$40/hr now.  

$40/hr is almost $77k/year.  And $70/hr is $134k/year.

$40/hr matches the senior wages of one of the sites I saw.

I wonder if the big deal about the 50% over 6 years is more about automation than not- or at least some other clause in the deal being offered.  

We have to bear in mind that the news we get on both sides of a negotiation is just what they want to say to get you on their side.  

 

edit- given these guys haven't gotten a raise in a long time, they are certainly not the reason for inflation.  And when I looked at the total spend for shipping in the US, the raise they are asking for is 0.3% of all shipping cost from 2022.  So at the same time, it's a lot of money to the individual, but almost nothing as part of the overall system.

Base salary is capped at $81k/yr. They pretty much all work overtime on top of that. The Port of NY/NJ saw more than 50% of their workers gross over $150k in 2020. And nearly 20% made over $250k. If they're actually doing productive work during all of that overtime, then good for them. But it sounds like there are a lot of cases where that may not be what's happening.

"Today, every terminal within the Port still has special compensation packages given to certain ILA longshore workers, the majority of whom are white males connected to organized crime figures or union leadership. Based on the industry’s reported figures, the Commission has again identified over 590 individuals who collectively received over $147.6 million dollars last year in outsized salaries, or for hours they never worked."

There are 3726 salaries mentioned on page 25 of the report. 590 workers identified would be 15% of the labor force in the largest port on the East coast doing little or nothing to earn their salary. $147.6 million divided by 590 workers is an average of $250k for these roles just that year.

The union boss has also been brought to trial on two occasions by the US gov for suspected mob ties, and seems pretty opposed to the oversight committee intended to root out corruption and promote diversity within the ILA.

Seems like another case of the bad apples abusing the system, making everybody look bad.

The automation ban is more important to them than the salary increase.  Long beach is nearly all automated.  

camopaint0707 said:

The automation ban is more important to them than the salary increase.  Long beach is nearly all automated.  

Which makes the whole discussion much muddier, in my opinion. People making a reasonable wage for their effort is totally reasonable. Won't wager a guess at what that "reasonable wage" is, whether they're currently making it, nor whether the 77% over 6 years is what it would take to get them there.

But the cranes they use to offload are a form of automation. As are any number of inventory tracking systems, scheduling programs, etc. that are already making their jobs what they are. Automation has the potential to make things more efficient. That's good for the whole, economically, but not good for the worker it might replace. I understand their personal opposition, but I saw a quote earlier from the union that said something along the lines of "we need airtight language guaranteeing a ban on automation for the duration of the contract" or some such. I can't get behind that.

Fall is here. We can collect leaves to replace the scarce butt-wiping paper. Don't despair.

KyAllroad said:

The timing is interesting given that we're 35 days from an event and the union leader has publicly declared his support of a particular cult.  What a great way to throw the economy into turmoil.

I'm sorry that you used "cult" because I'd rather keep this analytical than insulting. As to the substance of your statement, I've had similar thoughts. Coupled with what's going on in the middle-east, it's pretty safe to say that the average voter will not be entering the booth filled with warm fuzzies. Of course this sort of shenanigan has been used before and will be again by a variety of sides.