Ford vs Ferrari

Um, there's kind of big difference between a random alpha-numeric and an actual name. Had Ferrari called it the "Silverado" I could see a point, but F150 isn't exactly original you know. This is why cars should have names and not numbers.

Yes, I think this was an accident by Ferrari--I mean do you really think they want peoplel to think of them and a pickup truck at the same time? I think the marketers got caught up in the nationalism/patiotism of Italy---and their own hubris.

What, do you mean would the passionate Italians from Ferrari deliberately antagonize a company who set out to and succeeded to embarrass them in the 60's, hmmm let me ponder that.

Are you really saying the the Italians have never heard of a Ford F150.

Javelin wrote: Um, there's kind of big difference between a random alpha-numeric and an actual name. Had Ferrari called it the "Silverado" I could see a point, but F150 isn't exactly original you know. This is why cars should have names and not numbers.

You mean like the numbers 911 (or 901 from a historical standpoint)? It's not as if we are going to mistake a Ferrari for an emergengy phone call....

For those of you who think this is silly, and ignore the fact that "F150" is a name that is trademarked, don't forget that when Ford took out the huge loans a few years ago, the brand name "F150" was part of the deal (along with the Ford oval) as part of collateral. It's quite probable that investors were there to protect the value of their collateral, too.

I'm sure they have heard of it, know of it, but didn't think they thought it through as much as they should have. I don't think they thought Ford would ever go this route.

So will Ford be sponsoring any F1 teams this year? A graphic of an F150 pickup and blue oval on the side of a F1 car would be fun. That is if anyone that high up has a sense of humor.

alfadriver wrote:

Javelin wrote: Um, there's kind of big difference between a random alpha-numeric and an actual name. Had Ferrari called it the "Silverado" I could see a point, but F150 isn't exactly original you know. This is why cars should have names and not numbers.

You mean like the numbers 911 (or 901 from a historical standpoint)? It's not as if we are going to mistake a Ferrari for an emergengy phone call.... For those of you who think this is silly, and ignore the fact that "F150" is a name that is trademarked, don't forget that when Ford took out the huge loans a few years ago, the brand name "F150" was part of the deal (along with the Ford oval) as part of collateral. It's quite probable that investors were there to protect the value of their collateral, too.

I don't the veracity of the claim, but a poster on another board stated that Peugot had exclusive rights to use "nine - zero - ?" for their products. Porsche's original 901 designation had to be changed to 911 but apparently only applied to road cars, hence the 904, 906, 907, etc, etc....

Did Ferrari blow-off any overtures from Ford before a suit was filed? Or, did Ford just go straight to court? Either way, it just makes one or both sides look petty and stupid.

oldsaw wrote: I don't the veracity of the claim, but a poster on another board stated that Peugot had exclusive rights to use "nine - zero - ?" for their products. Porsche's original 901 designation had to be changed to 911 but apparently only applied to road cars, hence the 904, 906, 907, etc, etc.... Did Ferrari blow-off any overtures from Ford before a suit was filed? Or, did Ford just go straight to court? Either way, it just makes one or both sides look petty and stupid.

Perhaps Ford and the investors have put more rights behind the F150 name. Does anyone realistically think that if Magic Chef came out with a stove with the F150 name, Ford wont try to protect it?

Also, remember "F150" is partially held as collateral to a loan, and anything that reduces the value of that name hurts the groups providing the loan against that name. For us home owners, banks require us to hold insurance on the home for the same reason.

I'm sure if enough money changes hands (considering the $$ that are both invested in F1 and the advertising) F150 can be used for the race car.

Another example of the absurdity of copyright protection.

It shocks me that (you) people actually take this stuff seriously. Just another thing in the long list of what's wrong with our society.

aussiesmg wrote: Does anybody think Ferrari did this by accident? Really

Prolly was accidental, I do see how ford has to protect itself, it cannot let one case go cause ti sets a bad precedent, but the example of the e350 van/mercedes is curious...

As well, is the ferrari f1 car even going to be on public roads?!?! prolly not, but as has been stated, ford is kind of in a bunch, and in all fairness they did ask ferrari first before jumping in the lawyer suits...

Actually, Ford owns and protects F-150, not F150. See the difference? Still, the precedent stands that alpha-numerics are not only dumb, but usually not bantered about on.

See Ford E-350/ Benz E350, Ferrari 328/ BMW 328, Ferrari 550/ BMW 550, Pontiac G6/ Gulfstream G6, etc, etc, etc.

Nobody with a sane brain would have thought that Ferrari celebrating 150 years of Unification by cleverly mating "F1" and "150" would possibly hurt Ford's US sales of the "F-150 pick-m-up truck".

oldsaw wrote: Did Ferrari blow-off any overtures from Ford before a suit was filed? Or, did Ford just go straight to court? Either way, it just makes one or both sides look petty and stupid.

I think it's pretty stupid to name your car after a product that's already on the market AND built by another company. Again. F' Ferrari. This is an American company they're dealing with. Do what you want to the Japanese.

Zomby woof wrote: Another example of the absurdity of copyright protection. It shocks me that (you) people actually take this stuff seriously. Just another thing in the long list of what's wrong with our society.

How else do you protect a product you've developed? If you have any suggestions I'm sure the world would like them. The Chinese would too as they respect any intellectual rights about as much as Frat boys respect drunk driving and consent laws.

Have you read my magazine yet? It's called Grassroots Motorsports. It's all about racing, cars, and cool stuff but doing it on a budget. It's not like the other GRM because my magazine is strictly online. That means I can violate copyright because I'll never sell it. Just online. Awesome right!?

Javelin wrote: Um, there's kind of big difference between a random alpha-numeric and an actual name. Had Ferrari called it the "Silverado" I could see a point, but F150 isn't exactly original you know. This is why cars should have names and not numbers.

So this is a list of car names that aren't really "names" and therefore uncopyrightable according to Javelin.

Bmw 2002

Nissan 300ZX

Ferrari F355

Ferrari 308 GT

etc...etc...etc...

Heck! I can't wait for the Ford Testarossa!

You can't really think that numerical based names are not fit to copyright while alpha based names are. That's completely illogical from just about any way you look at it.

aussiesmg wrote: Does anybody think Ferrari did this by accident? Really

You mean it wasn't an accident?!

Javelin wrote: Nobody with a sane brain would have thought that Ferrari celebrating 150 years of Unification by cleverly mating "F1" and "150" would possibly hurt Ford's US sales of the "F-150 pick-m-up truck".

Call me crazy!

GET'EM FORD!

btw - don't get pissed man. You've got a good point on the similar alphanumeric names. I just disagree. I think we can still be friends and drink beers together. That is unless you're black in which case we can't.

Xceler8x wrote: How else do you protect a product you've developed? If you have any suggestions I'm sure the world would like them. The Chinese would too as they respect any intellectual rights about as much as Frat boys respect drunk driving and consent laws. Have you read my magazine yet? It's called Grassroots Motorsports. It's all about racing, cars, and cool stuff but doing it on a budget. It's not like the other GRM because my magazine is strictly online. That means I can violate copyright because I'll never *sell* it. Just online. Awesome right!?

You don't.

Let the market decide.

Americans are the strongest free market advocates I know. They're also the biggest supporters of these types of laws.

The irony isn't lost on me.

Zomby woof wrote: You don't. Let the market decide. Americans are the strongest free market advocates I know. They're also the biggest supporters of these types of laws. The irony isn't lost on me.

How does the market decide if copyright laws are a good thing?

Zomby woof wrote:

Xceler8x wrote: How else do you protect a product you've developed? If you have any suggestions I'm sure the world would like them. The Chinese would too as they respect any intellectual rights about as much as Frat boys respect drunk driving and consent laws. Have you read my magazine yet? It's called Grassroots Motorsports. It's all about racing, cars, and cool stuff but doing it on a budget. It's not like the other GRM because my magazine is strictly online. That means I can violate copyright because I'll never *sell* it. Just online. Awesome right!?

You don't. Let the market decide. Americans are the strongest free market advocates I know. They're also the biggest supporters of these types of laws. The irony isn't lost on me.

I see lots of irony in your perceived irony.

And, I'll repeat myself in stating that letting this episode go public is a PR failure for both companies.

Javelin wrote: Actually, Ford owns and protects F-150, not F150. See the difference? Still, the precedent stands that alpha-numerics are not only dumb, but usually not bantered about on. See Ford E-350/ Benz E350, Ferrari 328/ BMW 328, Ferrari 550/ BMW 550, Pontiac G6/ Gulfstream G6, etc, etc, etc. Nobody with a sane brain would have thought that Ferrari celebrating 150 years of Unification by cleverly mating "F1" and "150" would possibly hurt Ford's US sales of the "F-150 pick-m-up truck".

Considering that Ford uses both F150 and F-150 with the US copyright office, I'm not so sure. I searched here- http://www.copyright.gov/ and found that things were copyrighted under both names (as well as 250 and 350 etc.). Could not find a direct link to the actual name, since I'm not sure how to look there. But Ford clearly uses both with the copywright office.

It's not about a sane brain comparing F1 to a pick up, it's about protecting a name so that someone else can't claim that you are abandoning it. And since there are many others actually using the name, I'm sure Ford does not want to allow Fiat/Chrysler to use it in anyway.

oldsaw wrote: And, I'll repeat myself in stating that letting this episode go public is a PR failure for both companies.

This

Follow up- according to the US Patent and Trademark office, where names can be trademarked, F-150 is the trademark. http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=toc&state=4001%3Auetoj8.1.1&p_search=searchss&p_L=50&BackReference=&p_plural=yes&p_s_PARA1=&p_tagrepl%7E%3A=PARA1%24LD&expr=PARA1+AND+PARA2&p_s_PARA2=f-150&p_tagrepl%7E%3A=PARA2%24COMB&p_op_ALL=AND&a_default=search&a_search=Submit+Query&a_search=Submit+Query

None the less, I'm sure Ford does not want Fiat to do anything with F150.... Sucks if you think Ford is being foolish, but it is what it is.

Zomby woof wrote:

Xceler8x wrote: How else do you protect a product you've developed? If you have any suggestions I'm sure the world would like them. The Chinese would too as they respect any intellectual rights about as much as Frat boys respect drunk driving and consent laws. Have you read my magazine yet? It's called Grassroots Motorsports. It's all about racing, cars, and cool stuff but doing it on a budget. It's not like the other GRM because my magazine is strictly online. That means I can violate copyright because I'll never *sell* it. Just online. Awesome right!?

You don't. Let the market decide. Americans are the strongest free market advocates I know. They're also the biggest supporters of these types of laws. The irony isn't lost on me.

Patents and Trademarks have long been part of the US, too. Since the start. Protects hard work so that someone else can't copy it and claim it was theirs.

Zomby woof wrote: Another example of the absurdity of copyright protection. It shocks me that (you) people actually take this stuff seriously. Just another thing in the long list of what's wrong with our society.

u r from teh canada, so you can't call it "our" society, eh.