Frustrations with interviewing in this wild job market

I've recently been in the market for a new job, trying to move my way up in this world and seeing what the market has to offer. 12+ years of experience, almost have a masters, relevant industry certifications, and just landing an interview seems next to impossible these days. 

Fast forward to actually landing interviews. The last few I've done have been extremely frustrating. From getting grief to asking what the position is budgeted for, growth opportunity, working conditions, etc to interviewers getting frustrated when you stray away from their script, it's been a frustrating process. 

I think the most frustrating thing for me though has been the fact that most of the interviews have dedicated time to play "stump the dummy." In my most recent interview, this company started out by playing a game of 20 questions of "How dumb can we make you look?" by asking extremely nuanced technical questions regarding systems and processes that I wasn't familiar with (nor did my resume say I was) and immediately ending the interview because I lacked familiarity with their internal organizational processes/systems. Like why did you even waste my time would you could have clearly determined that by reviewing my resume and skills. Mind you, the job requisition posted didn't call for the need to understand these items and was more focused towards my background in policy vs. being a technical SME. 

Don't get me started on jobs that list extremely high salaries in the job posting, then you get to the negotiating table, and they say "well really we only had this amount budgeted for this position." 

In reply to DirtyBird222 :

Those are probably not companies you should be working for. F-dat.

i think the key to getting an interview is to regurgitate as many keywords as possible from the job posting, either in a tailored version of your resume or in a cover letter in which you replace the phrase "the successful candidate will have" with "I have", or "I hope to" if you actually haven't.

once in the interview, diffuse a detailed question with a generalized answer.  IDK what specific materials will be used to build a widget for a specific application, but i can say "consult published materials, industry guidelines, and subject matter experts to determine material selection is appropriate, then develop and execute robust test plan to either (1) ensure customer requirements are met or (2) drive a change to design or material selection and re-test."

That sucks man!

I've had two such examples. First was at my first job out of college, an entry level design engineer role. My future boss handed me one of their products and asked me to explain how it worked.  It has some neat mechanical features that he wanted to see if I could logic my way thru how it works. That seemed like a good weeding out type exercise since it became a fairly hands on role.

On the other hand, I interviewed for a company that gave me a written test to complete prior to the interview while I waited for the interviewers to show up. WTF? Like, full on differential equations, heat transfer, and electrical circuit analysis. And this was to be manufacturing engineer?!  I withdrew my application when they offered a second round interview.

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:

i think the key to getting an interview is to regurgitate as many keywords as possible from the job posting, either in a tailored version of your resume or in a cover letter in which you replace the phrase "the successful candidate will have" with "I have", or "I hope to" if you actually haven't.

once in the interview, diffuse a detailed question with a generalized answer.  IDK what specific materials will be used to build a widget for a specific application, but i can say "consult published materials, industry guidelines, and local experts to determine material selection is appropriate, then develop and execute robust test plan to either (1) ensure customer requirements are met or (2) drive a change to design or material selection and re-test."

I've been doing the former and it has actually helped a ton. Using a script to pull relevant data out of a job posting, enter it into my baseline resume, and I'll massage it from there. Unfortunately, any organization utilizing Workday (which I hate) I have a 0% success rate with no matter what I try. 

Thanks for the advice on the latter! 

My experience recently has been more like Brotus. "Can you give us the binary version of this subnet mask?"

I'll bet those same people are wondering why it's so hard to find 'good employees'.  LOL

Appleseed is right. Those are red flags for toxic cultures. Consider them dodged bullets.

The closest thing I got to a warning about the last 2 jobs I was hired for was being put through logic puzzles on Indeed. The first job put me through a more demanding test with strict time limits, they were so impressed with my result they straight-up asked me how I cheated on the test, they hired me but it turned out not to be a good work environment, I found out that the last guy was "too nice for this place" and ghosted them after a week.

The second one I'm still at (for the moment) and has nice people but the work is a fast-paced high-stress panicfest, it's like the brainy keyboard jockey version of running around an Amazon warehouse all day.

DirtyBird222 said:

My experience recently has been more like Brotus. "Can you give us the binary version of this subnet mask?"

If you are actually getting that question it leads me to belive you work in the IT field.  Looking/willing to relocate?  

My fiance recently went through this. She was laid off for 5+ months before finding another job, literally applied to hundreds ot positions many interviews. Her last few jobs have been as a Senior Account Manager, in Marketing/AD companies, with her specialty being Email Marketing Automation.

She even had one local company interview her, ask her experience that wasn't on her resume. Then setup a 2nd interview, only to get a call back saying the team still wants "X" experience in certain skills. Which weren't on her resume and in both interviews told them she didn't have CSS/HTML5 experience. Talk about a giant waste of time. 

I also don't understand why the job market is "so bad" considering it's consistently adding a few hundred thousand+ jobs per month since last year. 

Although I did read an article on LinkedIn toward the beginning of the year when another friend was laid off, that basically "Senior-level" positions are very difficult to come by. Amazon recruited me last year, only made it to the 3rd round, but was told initially there would be 5-6 rounds.........although the compensation range was nuts for my position as a Senior Technical Writer. Before benefits/stock options/etc, the salary range was $145-165k per year. 

I'm a little bummed that I'm reaching retirement age at the same time that the market for my trade is on fire. But one of the great satisfactions of my life has been turning down what would normally be considered plum opportunities, and not being shy about the reasons why. Especially when the reasons were their incompetence in the hiring process, and the bad impression it left.

Have you been to any interviews where they talk 90% of the time and you hardly get a word in at all? That is a major red flag for me, it means they don't have a good idea what they want and are brainstorming and dreaming. Lot's of "we want to" and "we should be". Run away. 

JThw8 said:

DirtyBird222 said:

My experience recently has been more like Brotus. "Can you give us the binary version of this subnet mask?"

If you are actually getting that question it leads me to belive you work in the IT field.  Looking/willing to relocate?  

I do work in the IT field. Mainly in information assurance, policy, and risk management side of the house. I can get my hands "dirty" in the technical stuff but it's not what I'm most proficient at. 

Where at?

z31maniac: In my recent experience, most job postings that list "cyber security analysts" or anything related to my career field, typically list anything and everything from the spectrum of the IT field. "We want you to know all these programming languages, experience with 20+ toolsets, you need to have know all these cyber management frameworks and how to implement them, you need to have great collaboration/teamwork skills, IT IS A MUST THAT YOU KNOW HOW TO ARCHITECT A NETWORK, with 10 years of experience with SIEMS, plus the alphabet soup of certifications." With a entry level pay range. I completely understand the frustration your wife is going through because these recruiters set you up for an interview and you get there only to find out you aren't what they are looking for. Recruiters trying to satisfy their quotas at your expense and it's usually a disconnect in the HR processes IMO. 

pinchvalve: Yes, if I can't get a word in, instant red flag. I interviewed with with a major grocery retailer's (big one in Florida) security department earlier this summer, they wanted to stick to the interview script so badly that I got scolded for speaking out of line. I ended the interview right there and that was after one of the interviewers accused me of Googling an answer to one of their questions.

I've formulated a strategy recently that when I'm asked my first question, I take ahold of the interview, and ask my own screening questions. If it feels that it won't be a fit, I can end it right there before wasting everyone's time. I've learned to become bullish with the recruiters as well. 

I had a great interview yesterday. Very easy going conversation about life, career aspirations, what the job entails and expectations. "Hey your resume doesn't line up with everything we are looking for but you sound smart and like you could figure out anything we throw at you, which is what we need." 

Mrs. Calteg has been unemployed for 3 years, though she's been exceptionally picky about the type of future role she wants.

I tend to hop jobs every 2-3 years, and I've had absolutely zero success cold applying. Every job I've landed has either been through networking, an internal referral, or a recruiter contacting me first. 

As others have said, take a rocky interview as your early warning system to bail out.

I'm looking for my next role. And yeah this market is wild. 
 

I have people on the inside at companies recommending me, recruiters pushing for me and I still don't get a shot. Ohh well. 
 

keep networking. It'll eventually work. 

Fueled by Caffeine said:

I have people on the inside at companies recommending me, recruiters pushing for me and I still don't get a shot.

same.  in my experience there's a huge disconnect between the job to be done and the candidate identification process.

In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :

I'm hearing that the responses are so overwhelming right now for senior positions thst they are struggling to keep up. 

Fueled by Caffeine said:

In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :

I'm hearing that the responses are so overwhelming right now for senior positions thst they are struggling to keep up. 

I'm seeing on LinkedIn and Indeed, for Senior Technical Writers (Remote), sometimes 200+ applicants within 24 hours of job postings. My fiance was seeing even more than that with Marketing jobs sometimes. 

DirtyBird222 said:

JThw8 said:

DirtyBird222 said:

My experience recently has been more like Brotus. "Can you give us the binary version of this subnet mask?"

If you are actually getting that question it leads me to belive you work in the IT field.  Looking/willing to relocate?  

I do work in the IT field. Mainly in information assurance, policy, and risk management side of the house. I can get my hands "dirty" in the technical stuff but it's not what I'm most proficient at. 

Where at?

z31maniac: In my recent experience, most job postings that list "cyber security analysts" or anything related to my career field, typically list anything and everything from the spectrum of the IT field. "We want you to know all these programming languages, experience with 20+ toolsets, you need to have know all these cyber management frameworks and how to implement them, you need to have great collaboration/teamwork skills, IT IS A MUST THAT YOU KNOW HOW TO ARCHITECT A NETWORK, with 10 years of experience with SIEMS, plus the alphabet soup of certifications." With a entry level pay range. I completely understand the frustration your wife is going through because these recruiters set you up for an interview and you get there only to find out you aren't what they are looking for. Recruiters trying to satisfy their quotas at your expense and it's usually a disconnect in the HR processes IMO. 

pinchvalve: Yes, if I can't get a word in, instant red flag. I interviewed with with a major grocery retailer's (big one in Florida) security department earlier this summer, they wanted to stick to the interview script so badly that I got scolded for speaking out of line. I ended the interview right there and that was after one of the interviewers accused me of Googling an answer to one of their questions.

I've formulated a strategy recently that when I'm asked my first question, I take ahold of the interview, and ask my own screening questions. If it feels that it won't be a fit, I can end it right there before wasting everyone's time. I've learned to become bullish with the recruiters as well. 

I had a great interview yesterday. Very easy going conversation about life, career aspirations, what the job entails and expectations. "Hey your resume doesn't line up with everything we are looking for but you sound smart and like you could figure out anything we throw at you, which is what we need." 

Thankfully she started a new job about 3 weeks ago at a local marketing/ad firm. It's a little less $$$ than she was expecting, but she was out of unemployment benefits. The OK legislature passed a bill last year, that effective Jan 1, 2023, unemployment benefits were reduced from 26 to 16 weeks. 

 

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:

Fueled by Caffeine said:

I have people on the inside at companies recommending me, recruiters pushing for me and I still don't get a shot.

same.  in my experience there's a huge disconnect between the job to be done and the candidate identification process.

Same here. Perhaps this "crazy job market" is entirely the fault of overly inflated corporate bureaucracy. 

My current job took 4 months to get back to me after I intially applied. I had literally forgotten about it.

Can you take a role as a consultant? Many companies use consultants for short term role filling. Consultant relationships are low stakes because if either party is unhappy it is easy to end the contract no hard feelings either way. 

For example a 6 month contract position: 6 months is a really good amount of time for you to learn what a company really is and for the company to learn who you really are. Many consulting companies are happy to transition consultants to their clients at the end of the engagement because it fosters their relationship with the employer. 

Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:

Can you take a role as a consultant? Many companies use consultants for short term role filling. Consultant relationships are low stakes because if either party is unhappy it is easy to end the contract no hard feelings either way. 

For example a 6 month contract position: 6 months is a really good amount of time for you to learn what a company really is and for the company to learn who you really are. Many consulting companies are happy to transition consultants to their clients at the end of the engagement because it fosters their relationship with the employer. 

I've been trying everything brother. 

I had an interview at lunch that went ok. They asked a lot of technical questions that I had a hard time answering. I stopped the interview and was like "hey this is embarrasing and not related to the job posting, what's up?" They were just probing my general knowledge base and used it to see where I could fit in. Said they were impressed with everything, wanted to make an offer based on everything thus far, but wanted to find the right home for me within the organization. Interesting methodology but at least they clarified when I asked. 

I also got an offer for a position that I interviewed for a few months ago. The Reserve has me activated through the end of the FY, made that apparent during the interview process with that organization. They rescinded their offer because they don't want to wait until September after not hearing from them for two months! Can't make this crap up. With that being said, I can always fall back on the Reserve gig; however, it does not offer the flexibility I need from a family perspective + I want out all together. 

maschinenbau said:

Same here. Perhaps this "crazy job market" is entirely the fault of overly inflated corporate bureaucracy. 

My current job took 4 months to get back to me after I intially applied. I had literally forgotten about it.

LOL, i just got a robo-rejection for a position i applied for about 8 weeks ago.  the position: "Foundation Brake Vehicle Test Engineer".  and i quote: 

Robo-rejection says:

After an intensive review of your documents and your profile against our requirements, we regret to inform you that we cannot consider your application any further in the recruitment process.  We have received applications that match the position's requirements more closely.

i'm like, no you haven't.

When I was looking four years ago I received a rejection call from a headhunter saying, they thought you were more of a machinist, and they're really looking for a millwright.

Well, I am a licensed millwright with 30 years experience, but during the interview the maintenance manager looked right at me and said, wow, you have the perfect qualifications for this job, and he was right.

Sounds like you've got the right approach honestly. You should be asking those questions and have certain standards that you explore in the interview. You're interviewing them just as much as they're interviewing you, you just need to stay the course. It sounds like you're well positioned enough to land in a good spot eventually given your education and experience, it just takes time. I went through the same thing last year and it definitely took some time, but in the end, I ended up in a great position. Stay resilient brother!

DirtyBird222 said:

JThw8 said:

DirtyBird222 said:

My experience recently has been more like Brotus. "Can you give us the binary version of this subnet mask?"

If you are actually getting that question it leads me to belive you work in the IT field.  Looking/willing to relocate?  

I do work in the IT field. Mainly in information assurance, policy, and risk management side of the house. I can get my hands "dirty" in the technical stuff but it's not what I'm most proficient at. 

Where at?

 

Potentially NC.  Going to be staffing up a new unit within my company, will have a few openings and I think IT Security is one of them (I think my current ITSec guy is going to stay with the existing local unit rather than join the new unit), still getting headcount approved and JDs finalized but if you are up to relocation I can at least send you the posting when it opens up.