In reply to mtn: Legal drinking and driving?
In reply to mtn: Legal drinking and driving?
mtn wrote:z31maniac wrote: I have seen so many of these open and close quickly in the last 15 years between Tulsa/OKC/Stillwater, I can't imagine it being a solid business idea.......in any way, shape, or form.The only way I can think of it working is as a bar. It has to serve alcohol.
Bar and grill, with lots of "tough" cars people can rent........but those who don't care with a buzz will probably destroy the cars constantly.
Even the places that serve food (but no alcohol) with putt-putt, go karts, video games, etc haven't survived.
z31maniac wrote:mtn wrote:Bar and grill, with lots of "tough" cars people can rent........but those who don't care with a buzz will probably destroy the cars constantly. Even the places that serve food (but no alcohol) with putt-putt, go karts, video games, etc haven't survived.z31maniac wrote: I have seen so many of these open and close quickly in the last 15 years between Tulsa/OKC/Stillwater, I can't imagine it being a solid business idea.......in any way, shape, or form.The only way I can think of it working is as a bar. It has to serve alcohol.
Dave & Busters seems to be going strong...
z31maniac wrote: I have seen so many of these open and close quickly in the last 15 years between Tulsa/OKC/Stillwater, I can't imagine it being a solid business idea.......in any way, shape, or form.
There are places still around that have been around forever, however they are usually owned by older people who are probably looking at retiring some time soon and probably closing up shop.
There is a place near where I used to live and would drive by it everyday. It's in a pole barn and while it isn't busy during the week, the place is busy on the weekends. It's an indoor clay track. Place has been there for the last 20 years and looks like they still have events.
http://www.moodyauto.com/index.html
Don't know if they make money, but they definitely keep the hobby alive.
Guys, if I come across as a pessimist, it is because I have lived the life and learned the truth. Running a business is hard work where the only ass hanging in the breeze is the owners. Maybe it is me getting old, but a lot of the people on that list of parasites used to be symbiotic. I feel that there has been a shift to parasite in the last 10 years.
Since I have had my kick at the restaurant trade, and since I am not actually allowed to serve a flamethrower flambe to deserving patrons, and since I ain't going back there, here is my pipe-dream for someone to make real.
Build a big glass walled restoration shop and surround it on as many sides as possible with a restaurant/bar so the patrons can follow the action. Get an Epic build Project Binky type project going on all the time so the patrons have something to watch. For sure going to need some ambulant eye candy to deliver the beer and car parts as need be. Should not be too hard to get the tool sponsors lined up to help.
Should be able to launch the key-store of the franchise with about 2 million in seed money.
The local RC guys here rent a old hanger from the local parks dept once a week. Roll out the carpet set up track and race. Roll it all back up at the end of the night.
Summer they do outdoor, somehow they talked the parks dept into a new parking lot, with a ton of islands that can be walled around to make different layouts. They supplied labor to build the drivers stand.
I dont really race, just bash around these days, but they seem to have a good set up and get 30 ish guys out every week.
This is just an idea that's been bouncing around in my head for the last 12 years or so. I'm not in any position to start a business.
I'm a middle-class guy trying to support a family of 5 myself. No money for pipe dreams. I'll just be working 'till I'm dead.
By the time you pay the rent and the electric bill, you're gonna be into it EASY for $10K per month.
If you could attract 200 people every Saturday at $6 each, your gross revenue would not exceed $7200 per month.
That's before paying the "parasites".
...HOWEVER, set it up for remotely operated battle bots that could be controlled over the Internet... THEN you'll have something!
(Especially if you figure out a way to have online bets on the outcome!)
...AND, once you can figure out how to do it over the internet, you can offer different things. Have 2 different track areas, that you can setup in multiple ways. A sand pit, a slot track, roundy-round dirt track, fake snow or ice racing, flood one for boat racing, overhead quad copter races, whatever.
Periodically swap out the setups.
No spectator area necessary. (Reduced square footage= lower rental cost). Lower liability with no patrons on the premises.
Promote various "race teams" and players (like a miniature racing version of WWF).
I worked in the hobby industry, running a retail hobby shop, for 12 years. That's where my username came from. Kids and parents would see me around town and I'd hear, there's the Toyman.
The absolute biggest hurdle I see to any local shop/track is the internet. Online companies will sell the products for the same price the local shops are paying for them. Many of the biggest online companies are owned by the same distributors that the shops buy product from. They play the middleman and retailer at the same time and leave almost no meat on the bone for a brick and mortar store to earn any profit to pay the parasites, employees or owner.
As much as I loved the hobby industry, the writing was on the wall 20 years ago. Without a franchise to help with the buying, the local hobby shop is in trouble. The one we have left in town is a Hobbytown franchise. The owner used to work a day job to pay his bills, then work all weekend to keep the shop open. I hope he's not still doing that.
Is it doable, probably, but I wouldn't want to try it in anything other than a Major metropolitan area. I would also want a large wad of cash on hand to keep things afloat for a while. Anything else will probably end up being a good way to spend money.
Man I would love to try though. It's a fun business.
Edited to add. The money isn't in the track, it's in the retail. If you are lucky, the track will pay for itself. The track is advertizing to keep the hobby alive and draw in new blood, so you can sell to the racers and everyone else that thinks it looks like fun. Unfortunately, when the online retailers became so prevalent, it made retail a tough business to be in.
z31maniac wrote:mtn wrote:Bar and grill, with lots of "tough" cars people can rent........but those who don't care with a buzz will probably destroy the cars constantly. Even the places that serve food (but no alcohol) with putt-putt, go karts, video games, etc haven't survived.z31maniac wrote: I have seen so many of these open and close quickly in the last 15 years between Tulsa/OKC/Stillwater, I can't imagine it being a solid business idea.......in any way, shape, or form.The only way I can think of it working is as a bar. It has to serve alcohol.
Rental brushed Traxxas Stampedes and slashes. Those things can take a serious pounding, and take no time at all to rehab. I would say even get the drunks to put say a 25$ deposit on the truck. Won't cost you more than 15 bucks and 45min you sort a brushed 6c crash..and they're a damn sight faster than most normal rigs. There'd be some overhead in batteries and stuff but really it couls be managed pretty easily.
SVreX wrote: ...AND, once you can figure out how to do it over the internet, you can offer different things. Have 2 different track areas, that you can setup in multiple ways. A sand pit, a slot track, roundy-round dirt track, fake snow or ice racing, flood one for boat racing, overhead quad copter races, whatever. Periodically swap out the setups. No spectator area necessary. (Reduced square footage= lower rental cost). Lower liability with no patrons on the premises. Promote various "race teams" and players (like a miniature racing version of WWF).
Drone racing is getting hot. And the courses have very little footprint because it's all airborne gates. You could easily do drones over a dirt oval or on road or other associated.
In reply to Toyman01:
I don't know how he does it but my local guy charges exactly what you get it online for. Amazon, banggood, tower hobbies, horizon hobbies whatever. And he seems to be doing modestly well. And he's only open like 25 hours a week. Not living extravagant but supporting his two kids. Awesome awesome guy as well.
Joey
In reply to joey48442:
Tower Hobbies is Great Planes, the hobby distributor. Great Planes will sell to you for about 10% less than what Tower sells for.
Horizon didn't even bother to change their name when they got into the mail order business. Pretty much the same deal as Tower though.
Amazon has some shipping built into most of their pricing. Which can give you a little margin.
You can match the pricing, but the margins are so slim it's tough to make overhead.
The only place you really make money is in the little things that people don't shop price on. Glues, paints, hardware, etc. But that stuff only pays about 40%. You have to sell an enormous number of $3 items to make overhead. You also have to have it all, in stock, which means tying up a lot of money in stocking a store. In the online age, telling someone you can order it is the same as telling them to buy it online for less. The shop I ran had over $150K tied up in inventory. All those little packages add up in a hurry and we ordered at least twice a week to keep the shelves full.
I wonder if your local guy owns the building he's in? Is he old enough to be drawing a pension or be retired military? A separate source of income to feed the family, goes a long way toward keeping the doors open.
In reply to Toyman01:
Yeah I don't know how he does it, but no, he doesn't own the building, (I've met the landlord) and doesn't have a pension that I know of. He's only a few years older than me. I think he makes a lot of traxxas... at least in volume I guess. Several cars a week. He's gotten into quads pretty heavy lately. Doesn't sell any build it yourself airplanes, although he will get it for you if you want.
I think he does well because he's not a jerk, and there are so many snotty people in the hobby shop biz around here. People buy from him because he's not "riders hobby" a couple towns over. A reviewer on yelp actually called him "the least pretentious guy they have ever met in a hobby shop". And it's true. As silly as it sounds, I think it helps as well that he has chairs for us to sit in and chat and hang out, builds a community of loyal customers. We always hang around and chat, and when some fresh meat comes in looking for a new toy, you have 2 or 3 guys to tell them how much fun or well something flys. It's like reading reviews lol
Toyman01 wrote: As much as I loved the hobby industry, the writing was on the wall 20 years ago. Without a franchise to help with the buying, the local hobby shop is in trouble. The one we have left in town is a Hobbytown franchise. The owner used to work a day job to pay his bills, then work all weekend to keep the shop open. I hope he's not still doing that.
30 years ago, I worked for a local hobby shop in my tiny little town. He worked construction all day, then opened the shop from 6-10 plus all day Saturday. He owned the building and his wife ran a real estate agency in the other half.
Even back then, he was pinched between Tower and his distributors.
I have a shop local to me - HobbyMasters in Red Bank, NJ - who manage to keep going. They've been in business 30+ years. I've noticed they are responsive to trends. They used to have a decent collection of mini helis, LiPo batteries, spares., etc. Now that's mostly gone and it's drones. They still do RC cars. Very few planes. Upstairs is a well-stocked train department. They also host gaming nights for people playing fantasy card games.
It doesn't hurt that they are in a community with enough people able to impulse buy a $1000+ drone because it looks neat. They also own the building. Finally, to joey's point, they are very nice people.
mtn wrote:z31maniac wrote:Dave & Busters seems to be going strong...mtn wrote:Bar and grill, with lots of "tough" cars people can rent........but those who don't care with a buzz will probably destroy the cars constantly. Even the places that serve food (but no alcohol) with putt-putt, go karts, video games, etc haven't survived.z31maniac wrote: I have seen so many of these open and close quickly in the last 15 years between Tulsa/OKC/Stillwater, I can't imagine it being a solid business idea.......in any way, shape, or form.The only way I can think of it working is as a bar. It has to serve alcohol.
Sorry, I always forget about the lame suburbanites with kids that like mediocre food and Miller Lite.
That place is terrible. I've been twice, both were company Christmas parties I went with someone else. I would never go there of my own volition.
I agree with you--but that doesn't mean it isn't going strong.
mtn wrote: I agree with you--but that doesn't mean it isn't going strong.
They are also a massive chain with national brand recognition.
The problem I see in this group when people present business ideas, they think everyone thinks like we do. And we are incredibly small, niche group in America.
Look at how many here profess they would never buy a new car, for instance.
As far as price-shopping and mail order. Let's say you just paid $10 to run all day. 30 mins in you broke a control arm, or realized that you never ordered those tires you meant to order. Are you going to go home, order them, and wait a few days, or walk 150' to the front of the building and pay 5% more so you can get back at it? Or it's race night and Tom just beat you in heat 1....AGAIN!! The next heat is in 20 mins, guess where you can get a new motor....
In reply to DrBoost: If your in stock parts aren't price competitive though, they could just start buying spare stuff online and bringing it in with them.
This is a broad generalization, but in my experiences with hobby shop types, they're typically pretty hardcore and they get hooked on whatever their hobby of choice may be. However, most don't have a bunch of expendable income. You could have a very loyal, but very broke customer base. As an example of this point: I have literally heard people have an internal debate between buying a model kit, and buying themselves groceries for the week.
In reply to DrBoost:
I raced off road cars for 4 years. I kept a rather large stock of parts in a toolbox that went with me to every race. A-arms, tubs, motors, shocks, bearings, tires, wheels, pretty much everything needed to build an entire car. Anyone that is serious about racing does the same. Some of the will buy at the local shop, some of them won't.
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