Have I hit "the wall"?

I ask... because I've gotten "bored" with the Forte. Last quite a few events, I'm getting my best times in my first or second run. I can make 8 runs in a day (like this weekend) and my fastest is my second, and other than smashing cones getting stupid, all my times are within a tenth or two.

Is this one of those times where I've extracted all I personally can get from the car? Or is it like weight loss... you plateau and need to change some things up to drop that last bit? I'm so used to going out, dropping half seconds on subsequent runs. But this past year has just not been that way for me. Nationals, Divisionals..... local events. Always close times repeatedly.

Maybe it's time for a change? Wife is not going to like that answer!

Can you find a better driver to take some runs and see if you're getting all the car has to offer? If yes, then it may be time for something new. I hear Miatas are fun

Sounds you have the car mastered, which is definitely a good thing. I think KyAllroad has the right idea, have a hot shoe try to better your times. Then you'll know if you reached the limits of your driving or the car.

I've never heard a driver complain about being consistent before. Try having a passenger ride along and try to surprise you by yanking the ebrake at random times.

My guess is it is a 'plateau' like you mention. Keep going and you will get past it. Having someone else drive may be able to identify easy areas of improvement.

Randy Pobst wrote in one of his columns somewhere about his personal battle with a plateau like you describe and finally shook it off by actually TRYING to drive slower and ended up getting a faster time.

In autocross and in Gran Turismo, I'm a remarkably consistent driver. Not to say I'm good, but my times are very very flat. I try to shave time here and there (not always successfully) but I often can't come up with any radical new approaches.

It may or may not be that you've reached the limits of the car, but I suspect that you've reached the limits of your imagination in driving the car. My suggestion is to get instruction, both as co-pilot and pilot. I definitely need to get to an intermediate school one of these days and shake up some of my driving habits.

No one good this year has driven the car. I believe Pete's still coming in a couple weeks to check it out. But the last couple that did one beat me by a tenth, the other I smashed... for the first time. I dunno... I think I'm currently leaning towards finding a mod-car ride next year. I've already become a mod car groupie.

There is benefit to hopping around in cars. You get different sensations and feedbacks and can come back to your car "fresh".
Also, have you thought about data acquisition? It's surprising how many people think they are braking or accelerating well when the data says otherwise. You can also try different techniques and see where they add/subtract time on segments. Lots to be learned with data.

mazdeuce wrote: There is benefit to hopping around in cars. You get different sensations and feedbacks and can come back to your car "fresh". Also, have you thought about data acquisition? It's surprising how many people think they are braking or accelerating well when the data says otherwise. You can also try different techniques and see where they add/subtract time on segments. Lots to be learned with data.

Watching the GoPro vids are always eye opening. Yesterday, there was a section where it felt like I had to wait for what seemed like a really long time to get back on the power. In the vid, you can tell that a "very long time" is less than a second. Amazing how time slows down in the car...

But to your question, HAven't done anything about true DA yet. Hell, haven't even done Harry's Lap Timer yet.

Well then, a clear path presents itself.
I still think time in another car would be good for you and a nice break.

Bobzilla wrote:

mazdeuce wrote: There is benefit to hopping around in cars. You get different sensations and feedbacks and can come back to your car "fresh". Also, have you thought about data acquisition? It's surprising how many people think they are braking or accelerating well when the data says otherwise. You can also try different techniques and see where they add/subtract time on segments. Lots to be learned with data.

Watching the GoPro vids are always eye opening. Yesterday, there was a section where it felt like I had to wait for what seemed like a really long time to get back on the power. In the vid, you can tell that a "very long time" is less than a second. Amazing how time slows down in the car... But to your question, HAven't done anything about true DA yet. Hell, haven't even done Harry's Lap Timer yet.

Do you have to wait because your chassis will not accept input or because you don't think it will? Time to stiffen her up and add grip (or stop waiting, which is a lot cheaper)!

I read a similar thread on a dirt bike forum recently.

It boiled down to good technique and sensible line choices make for consistency that helps move novices up to intermediates and eventually up to advanced classes.

And it all makes sense until you start running with the big dogs and get passed by AA riders on lines that don't make any sense at all.

I think it's the imagination factor that Duke mentioned. Somehow they see things that lower skilled competitors don't, or maybe it's the opposite, they manage to only see the things that matter, either way it opens up a whole different set of lines.

I have a friend who is trying to move from quick regionally to fast nationally. He's very good at seeing the corners, but bad at seeing the space around them. We're working on it.

Huckleberry wrote:

Bobzilla wrote:

mazdeuce wrote: There is benefit to hopping around in cars. You get different sensations and feedbacks and can come back to your car "fresh". Also, have you thought about data acquisition? It's surprising how many people think they are braking or accelerating well when the data says otherwise. You can also try different techniques and see where they add/subtract time on segments. Lots to be learned with data.

Watching the GoPro vids are always eye opening. Yesterday, there was a section where it felt like I had to wait for what seemed like a really long time to get back on the power. In the vid, you can tell that a "very long time" is less than a second. Amazing how time slows down in the car... But to your question, HAven't done anything about true DA yet. Hell, haven't even done Harry's Lap Timer yet.

Do you have to wait because your chassis will not accept input or because you don't think it will? Time to stiffen her up and add grip (or stop waiting, which is a lot cheaper)!

The ways to add grip to the car (LSD and more wheel/tire) put the car into non-competitive classes. The car will hold 8.5" wheels and 235's. There is an LSD on the market. but both those take me from a competitive car and classing (STF) to SMF. That's a friggin' rabbit hole that even Alice wouldn't dare go with this car.

As to the actual question, wheel-spin and push ensue when you apply too much throttle too early. It's already stiff... (TWSS)... and the car still has to do double duty as a DD. It's bordering on the verge of too much for our terrible frost heaved roads.

Then there's the boredom thing.... I've maxed the car out for the class minus racing seats and huge money on super duper custom shocks. And I've been to too many CAM and muscle car things lately that makes me want pushrods and RWD. But wife says no more toys right now.

so I'm thinking finding a different ride for a while might be the better option.

mazdeuce wrote: I have a friend who is trying to move from quick regionally to fast nationally. He's very good at seeing the corners, but bad at seeing the space around them. We're working on it.

I have the same problem to a degree. It's like pool. I can see the angle. I can see the line I need to take. GEtting there and doing it are another ball game completely.

Switch cars with a fellow competitor or wives

So... on hte way to Grissom just south of Kokomo there has been a Mustang Notch for sale.

http://kokomo.craigslist.org/cto/5795627783.html

That one. berkeley.

In reply to Bobzilla:

Yup, still planning(and looking forward to!) flogging the Forte around. I agree with the others though - this is likely a plateau, and the best two ways to determine that, and move beyond it, are co-drivers and data.

I have no prediction on how close/far apart our times will be, but hopefully I can at least provide some insight on the setup for you.

Edit: I'll add that unless you're just growing tired of the car, data-logging and/or maybe some Evo schools would still be cheaper than starting over with another car.

but... 'merica and stuff.

I'll come codriver your car Seriously though, Solo storm and a hotshoe driver could be eye opening data.

Plateaus do happen. I've been getting bored with the s2000 and autocross in general, but a few codrives this year at national events in an ES Mr2 netted good results and my first win at a national event, which reenergized my love for the sport.

I'm hopping a codrive in an FP car next season just for a change of scenery and hoping to up my game in a legit racecar.

Bobzilla wrote: And I've been to too many CAM and muscle car things lately that makes me want pushrods and RWD.

Pushrods + RWD + CAM = Really good time. Just Sayin.

What is the CAM crowd like @ Grissom?